Living Wage 2020... is it right?

[Freakbro]

Who can afford that! Blimey!

Why do you think the Child Tax Credits are so high!

and your quoted statement about it doesn't cost 21k a month to run a Nursery, hmm, my wage bill alone at the minute is ~£42K a month (hence this rise to £9 is going to have a massive effect)

Then you have all the other usual costs, utilities (massive! the place is open 10 hrs a day with constant Laundry/Commercial Kitchen/Heating etc), insurances, rents, office costs etc etc

Then you have to buy resources, holy cow, these companies know how to charge because it a 'child rated' Nursery item....the prices would make your eyes water.

 

[Hades]

If one of your 2 IT technicians left, how quickly could you train up their replacement(assuming no previous experience)? And what impact would that have on the business?

I am in exactly this position right now. One of my L2 analysts is moving jobs. Yes it will have a significant impact but salary doesn't affect this dramatically as we will have to cover the loss in the wider team until a replacement is up to speed.

It will take me about 1 to 2 months to get headcount approval. But I am confident that once headcount approval is given I could interview someone within 24 hours and if it were not for the long winded admin to hire someone they could be at a desk very quickly (but given the admin involved it will probably take another month after verbal acceptance) then they could. There are, sadly, that many unemployed IT people looking for jobs. I have several CV's sitting in my desk drawer ready for when headcount approval is eventually given.

No they would not have experience on the apps we support but they would have a strong background in the technologies needed.

So if anyone is looking for an L2 support analyst role in London then PM me. Must have some experience of at least some of... Unix/Linux, Windows Server, database technologies such as MSSQL and Oracle, scripting, job sceheduling, middleware such as MQ, JBoss, Weblogic, etc. However I'd personally rate the "right person" with motivation and good communication and analytical skills over specific technology experience as those can be learned.

 

[Diagro]

Why do you think the Child Tax Credits are so high!

and your quoted statement about it doesn't cost 21k a month to run a Nursery, hmm, my wage bill alone at the minute is ~£42K a month

Then you have all the other usual costs, utilities (massive! the place is open 10 hrs a day with constant Laundry/Commercial Kitchen/Heating etc), insurances, rents, office costs etc etc

Then you have to buy resources, holy cow, these companies know how to charge because it a 'child rated' Nursery item....the prices would make your eyes water.

Mental mate.
Absolutely mental.

 

[Spacedeck]

Why will they?

There would be management/supervisor opportunites for these people.

Well I say this because as it stands, the NMW is for those unskilled people so to speak. Those without good grades or unfortunate to not have progressed far in life.

Opportunity isn't always there unless you have good grades. Plus if people on NMW lost a job, they would find it harder getting another job than someone who already earns much more over the NMW.

I only earn 15K pa, but I would like to try get more money together to go into learning something I'd like to do. I don't like being stuck on 15k but being here doesn't provide much progression and finding another job wouldn't be easy with my grades.

 

[antijoke]

Well I say this because as it stands, the NMW is for those unskilled people so to speak. Those without good grades or unfortunate to not have progressed far in life.

Opportunity isn't always there unless you have good grades. Plus if people on NMW lost a job, they would find it harder getting another job than someone who already earns much more over the NMW.

I only earn 15K pa, but I would like to try get more money together to go into learning something I'd like to do. I don't like being stuck on 15k but being here doesn't provide much progression and finding another job wouldn't be easy with my grades.

But if you are actually in a job and you can show those employers you are a worthy employee and worth considering for a promotion don't they usually not pay attention to grades you have and go on how well you work/what qualities you show in your day to day jobs?

I know this was the case several years ago when I worked at CPW and was promoted to branch manager, my grades didn't make one bit of difference, it was my attitude and company values I exhibited (consistently excellent customer care) that got me the promotion.

 

[Spacedeck]

But if you are actually in a job and you can show those employers you are a worthy employee and worth considering for a promotion don't they usually not pay attention to grades you have and go on how well you work/what qualities you show in your day to day jobs?

I know this was the case several years ago when I worked at CPW and was promoted to branch manager, my grades didn't make one bit of difference, it was my attitude and company values I exhibited (consistently excellent customer care) that got me the promotion.

This isn't the type sadly. Most people don't feel well paid here. We are a company who deals with staff in office and being out in the field. Different departments within the office, and there is specific jobs which need completing which work towards the overall full report which goes to the client. Going out on site doesn't interest me and I don't drive anyway, so that rules that out. Moving around in the office isn't an easy thing when we are understaffed as it is. We won't take anyone else on due to money, so then often we become backlogged with work, which they seem to instantly think it can be done in a day...

 

[jimjamuk]

One thing is that this only applies to the >25's meaning that if companies need to "lower" their costs they will go for younger people that this doesn't apply to. You can see that as a good thing and a bad thing but complaining that those on the lowest rung are getting a bit of a payrise has Shirley got to be a good thing

 

[jimjamuk]

This isn't the type sadly. Most people don't feel well paid here. We are a company who deals with staff in office and being out in the field. Different departments within the office, and there is specific jobs which need completing which work towards the overall full report which goes to the client. Going out on site doesn't interest me and I don't drive anyway, so that rules that out. Moving around in the office isn't an easy thing when we are understaffed as it is. We won't take anyone else on due to money, so then often we become backlogged with work, which they seem to instantly think it can be done in a day...

suggest you look for a new job then - if the place really is as bad as you say why would you want to do all that for little pay as you say?

 

[skaif]

OMG cry me a river, your just an run of the mill IT bod nothing special.

Bit harsh!!

Op all I can say is that more money per hour is still more money. The fact that the gap between the minimum wage and you wage is irrelevant other than as a matter of perception. The reality is that £11.20 an hour is significantly more than £9 per hour.

20% is hardly a significant difference compared to the ~60% OP was stating before!

 

[TwsT]

Bit harsh!!

20% is hardly a significant difference compared to the ~60% OP was stating before!

but in 5 years

i would expect op to have a pay rise in that time if he doesn't then he or his employer sucks.

 

[lsg1r]

But there will be more jobs overall. For most you have to think that businesses will be employing x number of staff because they need them to fulfil y amount of work... they could only really shed staff by lowering their capacity, and if they did that they would no longer be able to fulfil y amount of work... so cutting staff would also mean cutting business.

Alternatively the companies could look at automating their process, think robots picking orders for factories (some already do) or similar. Places like tesco's have already got 'staff free tills' and they're gradually increasing in number at stores... it doesn't take much to 'adapt' in large corporations.

Then there's actually outsourcing and importing from a cheaper location.

The smaller companies will be the ones that will be hit hardest in my view and the simple fact is we all know that by the time the £9 min wage comes in the money needed will be something like £15 .

 

[Spacedeck]

suggest you look for a new job then - if the place really is as bad as you say why would you want to do all that for little pay as you say?

Well, chances are I wouldn't get another job so easily anyway, not that I even know what I want to do. I do plan on start looking though. For comparison sakes though, I didn't exactly complete mainstream school, I completed around 6 grades and the my best was ICT but that was only a short course. Then I attended college but I suffered heavily with confidence, so after around 3 years at college, I left after completing a level 1 in ICT. Me nor the family really had enough money to carry on as it would have started costing due to my age.

Only managed to get this job because my brother already worked here. After change of company hands around 3 times, my job position was made redundant. Went onto job seekers, claimed a single week and then was invited back to this company again so I took it. Isn't something I wanted to do but anything was better than job seekers.

 

[fendi]

I opted out of the Pension. Because I cant afford the £90 to leave my pay each month just yet.

you will regret doing this.. also it wouldn't be £90 as you get a tax break or pay less in NI (can't remember which) on paying contributions to a pension scheme.

 

[Haggisman]

[...]No they would not have experience on the apps we support but they would have a strong background in the technologies needed.[...]

Which is exactly why they are more "valuable" than the guy who cleans your desk, who doesn't need to have a strong background in anything to be able to do the job.

 

[RDM]

I find it interesting that income equality causes such problems even at the lower end of the pay spectrum...

 

[Pneumonic]

I think this is mostly just moving money around... government benefits in some ways..

Firstly the employers are going to pick-up the cost in the difference between the current minimum wage and the £9 / hour for the over 25's so saves them money there..

Secondly that minimum wage equates to around £16K / annum (assuming unpaid holiday).. so that will increase the number of people actually paying PAYE/NICs.. including the employer contribution so additional tax comes in from that perspective.

while with the reduction in corp-tax government will lose out on revenue there.. I haven't looked at the numbers in detail.. but the cynical might suggest this is just moving numbers on the books for PR purpose..

* They can claim some social responsibility buy increasing NMW
* They can claim they have reduced the 'benefits' bill
* They can claim to be more 'business friendly' from corp-tax cuts

In reality they have added cost to employ.. but reduced cost on profit..

 

[wez130]

The thing i'd be more worried about is that businesses will be more tempted to hire people under the 25 year old threshold so that they won't have to pay £9 p/h, putting millions of over 25's at risk of struggling to find work. Especially in unskilled positions. Then with the recent changes to employment law where you don't effectively have any rights until you've worked for a company for 2 years, as long as it's not a case for unfair dismissal, they can just replace you for another younger model. As happened to me a few years ago.

 

[Spook187]

Well I say this because as it stands, the NMW is for those unskilled people so to speak. Those without good grades or unfortunate to not have progressed far in life.

Opportunity isn't always there unless you have good grades. Plus if people on NMW lost a job, they would find it harder getting another job than someone who already earns much more over the NMW.

I only earn 15K pa, but I would like to try get more money together to go into learning something I'd like to do. I don't like being stuck on 15k but being here doesn't provide much progression and finding another job wouldn't be easy with my grades.

Actually your wrong, I am living proof that you can do well without good grades.

Bit harsh!!

20% is hardly a significant difference compared to the ~60% OP was stating before!

Not harsh at all, like I say IT bods are two a penny, not exactly hard plugging in ethernet cables is it lol.

 

[Diagro]

Actually your wrong, I am living proof that you can do well without good grades.



Not harsh at all, like I say IT bods are two a penny, not exactly hard plugging in ethernet cables is it lol.

Oh dear. Ye that sort of "It Bod" is 10 a penny.

Also those Guys get paid 10-12k pa lol

 

[lsg1r]

That's going to happen regardless of relatively small changes in pay, though. Once the tech is mature enough to not require a huge investment.

I know it's coming at some point but in some sectors it could bring it in earlier, it's not like they can't claim back the cost of purchases against their business earnings or anything is it