BBQ: Gas Vs Charcoal

[D.P.]

Other food?
Oh, you mean that green stuff the womenfolk do? I thought that was a decorative centrepiece for the table!

Nah, I agree that's part of it.
I'd argue that using marinades seems a bit pointless, as the natural flavour of the meat is the more important aspect... at least in my opinion. Burying it under different flavours is just criminal... kinda like putting ketchup on stuff!

Anyway, marinades were invented to tenderise cheap, tough cuts and hide the lack of quality, weren't they? Don't need that with decent meat!

If you don't use marinades and dry rubs you are missing out on a whole world of cooking. And where did you get this "decent meat' idea form. True BBQ is all about getting cheap tough cuts of meat and cooking it low and slow for hours. Beef Brisket, pulled pork, ribs, all the cheapest toughest cuts of meat. When it comes to Chicken, thighs rule the roost, the fat renders down nicely and adds lots of flare when it hits the coal/heat plate.

In fact I would go as far as saying that for the most part you shouldn't be putting high quality meat on a BBQ, for some definition of high quality. E.g. Chicken breast will tend to dry out and wont take on much flavor on a BBQ, unless you have a good marinate that drips into the heat source. Chicken thighs are much better . Steaks, something like a fillet Mignon is going to be best pan seared as it doesn't have the fat content to do well on a BBQ. A Rib Eye streak is a good exception, the high fat content and extra rendering required suits a grill.

You bog standard sausages and burgers are all hgih fat contnent low quality meat, which is why they do well on a grill sas the fat drips off and causes flare ups.

If that were the case, every recipe should work to 100% perfection then, right? "On for 10 mins at setting 3, then remove and serve"?

Nope...

We have electric-only in our house and even the various (scientifically proven, by the way) formulae to convert from gas cooker instructions don't often work, despite the electric cooker working exactly as it's supposed to. It's more about knowing your individual cooker - The difference between gas, electric and coal is quite stark. I have professional chefs backing me up on this one, as they've used my kitchen!

Of course there is a small difference between electric or gas hobs, but that doesn't change the way water boils in a pan. You boil a pan of water and put an egg in for 3 minutes it will do he exact same thing regardless of the heat source because water boils at 100*C. The only differences will be how long the pan takes to reach boiling point, or cool down if you lowered the temperature.

Or in knowing that it doesn't need to be so complicated... or at least that the fundamentals matter more.

Good fresh pasta is a fundamental.

With both charcoal and wood, it's utterly inconsistent so very important in the type(s) you choose, the pieces you use, how you lay it, how you maintain it and how you monitor it. It's almost like extreme-overclocking a system. If it were that much of a science, we'd all be 8-Pack... [looks down at stomach, just to check].

That is stuff you learn when you are 10 years old helping your dad BBQ. There is nothing difficult about starting a charcoal fire, there is no skill in it at all. Especially these days when people just throw some lighters under a chimney.

Gas is just on or off, with fairly precise control settings.
No art. No fun. Certainly doesn't taste of burnt wood, either.

There is no art in charcoal either, just hassle, which isn't fun. Fun is playing with my child on her swing while I know my food is cooking to perfection.

If your BBQ food tastes of burnt wood then something is very wrong with your cooking. That sounds pretty disgusting.

If I'm truly honest - The best braai I ever had was back on my 30th birthday, in a park, done using a pair of cheap portable foil barbecues from the petrol station - No marinades, sauces, fancy combinations or anything like that - Just the basic fundamentals done to perfection for eleven people on a very crappy heat source, by a guy who knew what he was doing.

Yep, so he could have used gas.

Charcoal or gas is just a heat source, nothing more nothing less. It has no smoke, no flavor, nor aromatics, no special properties. It is just pure and simple heat. Flavor comes from the liquid s dripping off the meat and hitting the heat source, which is going to be identical on gas or charcoal.




Now smoking, that is a whole different ball game and a different type of cooking but again, charcoal, vs gas (and elec) is not a big deal. Those are all providing a heat source to a tray of wood chips/pellets. The only exception is wood powered smokers, where the burning wood is providing the smoke and heat together.

 

[D.P.]

I think your first point is the crux of the matter really. Despite what I said earlier I actually agree with you completely. The problem is that your average person (that would also cook badly with coal - aka British BBQ) will get a cheap gas BBQ and then burn some sausages on it. This gives an unfair image to gas BBQ in general.

As someone that now uses a pellet smoker I should really have more sympathy for gas BBQ....

How do you like your pellet smoker?
I went to a friend's place for dinner last week and had the best brisket I have ever tasted from his (gas) smoker. I definitely want to get one but I'm undecided between an electric pellet or simply propane.

 

[boxman2000]

Father in law uses gas, I always forget and get all excited when they say we are having a BBQ and we travel down to the in-laws only to get a sausage or bit of steak that would have got more colour in a griddle pan.

Reminds me of a birthday do at a relatives house a few weeks ago, they were doing a BBQ and I bought some really nice quality sausages and when I turned up they had one of those awful Outback branded gas barbeques, but had no lava rock!!! Literally cooking over a flame and (at best) a heated grate.

The person cooking the meat was going for nearly 2 1/2 hours and it was mainly burgers and sausages.

 

[D.P.]

Reminds me of a birthday do at a relatives house a few weeks ago, they were doing a BBQ and I bought some really nice quality sausages and when I turned up they had one of those awful Outback branded gas barbeques, but had no lava rock!!! Literally cooking over a flame and (at best) a heated grate.

The person cooking the meat was going for nearly 2 1/2 hours and it was mainly burgers and sausages.

You don;t need lava rocks if there is a proper heat plate. And the heat plate is only for catching the liquids that drip down in order to generate the aromatics.

 

[FrenchTart]

How do you like your pellet smoker?
I went to a friend's place for dinner last week and had the best brisket I have ever tasted from his (gas) smoker. I definitely want to get one but I'm undecided between an electric pellet or simply propane.

It's a Traeger Junior Elite so it's not without issues but it's pretty awesome to use. I've had great brisket results especially and the low temperature (70C-ish) "smoke mode" is great for making salmon candy and the like.

If buying new though I think I'd go back to a bullet smoker and a PID controller/blower set up. You can buy units with pretty reasonable smartphone control/monitoring apps now without the hassle of setting up something yourself with an rPi.

 

[ttaskmaster]

If you don't use marinades and dry rubs you are missing out on a whole world of cooking.

I find most marinades (premade or scratch-made) and "BBQ sauces" thick, sickly-sweet, overpowering fluff, more closely resembling American MREs than anything I'd call quality cooking.

True BBQ is all about getting cheap tough cuts of meat and cooking it low and slow for hours.

That sounds more like stewing than BBQ...!

In fact I would go as far as saying that for the most part you shouldn't be putting high quality meat on a BBQ

I'd not have it any other way, if I'm honest...

Chicken breast will tend to dry out and wont take on much flavor on a BBQ, unless you have a good marinate that drips into the heat source. Chicken thighs are much better .

Chicken and fish are two things I'm personally still working on.
I'm OK with the former, though I do it to my own tastes better than other peoples'. I still get decent smoky flavours, though. Might offer some paprika on the side for those that like more.
Only tried fish twice and no-one will let me have their expensive salmon to practice with. I don't like fish myself, so if they want it they can do it!

Steaks, something like a fillet Mignon is going to be best pan seared as it doesn't have the fat content to do well on a BBQ.

Depends more on taste anyway. I prefer Medium-Well, so quality of meat isn't as much of a factor and a fillet will be as good as a rump as long as it's not the cheap crap.
I'm not a fan of fatty meats overall and most lamb is quite disgusting to me.
Steaks and chops are my usual, with various sausage-type things and occasionally burgers.

You bog standard sausages and burgers are all hgih fat contnent low quality meat, which is why they do well on a grill sas the fat drips off and causes flare ups.

Most of the sausages I use are high quality, low-ish fat and are usually considered ruined if they burst and drip. I don't do cheap sausages/burgers... EVER.

The only differences will be how long the pan takes to reach boiling point, or cool down if you lowered the temperature.

But therein is one of the underlying factors that affects all the others. Electric takes ages to cool, or lower where gas takes seconds. Many electric hobs also heat at different rates to each other within the same cooker, so there's all that to factor in.
Now take that onto a barbecue, where every area is doing differently and rises/lowers at different times. There's only so much your laying and raking can achieve. Everything else is where the art comes in.

Good fresh pasta is a fundamental.

To what? A barbecue?

Actually, I'm always surprised at how many chefs favour the premade stuff, especially custard. Making one's own components from scratch is often seen as a show-off, "just because I can" thing. Makes me feel a little less guilty for not making my own!

That is stuff you learn when you are 10 years old helping your dad BBQ.

Then I guess I missed out.

There is nothing difficult about starting a charcoal fire, there is no skill in it at all. Especially these days when people just throw some lighters under a chimney.

Pfft... If you come near me with firelighters, chimneys, or paraffin, I will throw them at you!!!
You lay the kindling so it will ignite with one match and maintain flame long enough to get the coal up, lay the coal on when appropriate, then spread it out before topping it off and bringing that up, all before you even lay the grille down over it.

There is no art in charcoal either, just hassle, which isn't fun.

It's only hassle if you do it wrong...

Fun is playing with my child on her swing while I know my food is cooking to perfection.

You present me with this supposed 'perfection' and I'll concede.
Until then, my own experiences just suggest gas barbecues to be expensive toys for men who think they know what they're doing, or who cannot be trusted with fire that cannot be immediately turned off in the event of an accident!

If your BBQ food tastes of burnt wood then something is very wrong with your cooking. That sounds pretty disgusting.

Marinade sounds disgusting to me, but hey...
TBH, it depends on the wood. Some is kinda rank, while others are great!

Yep, so he could have used gas.

Yeah, because lugging a Calor canister and however many kilos of kit across a mile of uneven ground would be SO much better...

Flavor comes from the liquid s dripping off the meat and hitting the heat source, which is going to be identical on gas or charcoal.

So why do the resulting steaks from an indoor grill, where the liquid drips down *away* from the heat source above still taste about the same as that from an outdoor gas 'barbecue'?

 

[Rich_L]

Brave man dispensing advice while admitting to liking steaks medium-well, not liking lamb, fish or fatty cuts of meat and failing to understand how marinades or slow-cooking works. Think we can draw our own conclusions

 

[D.P.]

... wall of junk ttaskmaster who clearly has no idea what he is talking about

There is so much fail in your post I don't know where to start TBH.
When someone clearly doesn't understand marinades or the basics of BBQ cooking then is seems to be pointless continuing this discussion , but here is a brief summary:

1. You simply have absolutely zero idea what a marinade is. that in itself means we can ignore pretty much every you say
2. No, True barbeque is cooking tough joints like beef brisket until they are tender. Grilling is the more precise term used for cooking things like burgers, steaks and sausages on charcoal or gas.
3. Sausages and burgers have a high fat content, even the best, by design. Otherwise you get a dry tasteless piece of cardboard whoever you cook the burger. It has nothing to do with being cheap. I make my own sausages from scratch, adding pork fat is a requisite ingredient
4. You don't even know about marinades so I wouldn't expect you to have a clue about pasta either
5. People that refuse a charcoal chimney are like Amish who refuse to use electricity or drive cars. Do you go around in a horse drawn carriage by chance? Again, statements like that clearly show you really don't know how to BBQ/grill.
6. There is proven no difference between charcoal and gas when you are simply grilling food. Perfection is equally achieved on a gas or charcoal grill.
7. "Marinade sound disgusting". What marinade? That is like saying meat/vegetables/fruit/food is disgusting. A Marinade is whatever you want it to be. You don't have to marinade but it is the liquids form the marinade and rendered fat that will flavor the meat and give the flavor. Charcoal has no smoke and add absolutely nothing to the flavor.
8. An Indoor grill is completely different to an a gs BBQ. Again, that just proves you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

 

[Glaucus]

Rofl, priceless wall of tat.

 

[Maccapacca]

Who would have guessed thread turns to junk

 

[chroniclard]

Gas users so butthurt.

 

[monkeyspank]

Brave man dispensing advice while admitting to liking steaks medium-well, not liking lamb, fish or fatty cuts of meat and failing to understand how marinades or slow-cooking works. Think we can draw our own conclusions

call it a braai and apparently you win.
I'm not sure about that myself, but it does seem to be certain peoples rationale

 

[monkeyspank]

he is trolling ffs. the best "braai" he ever had was on a pair of petrol station disposables. he needs to get banned or go back to gd

 

[monkeyspank]

he is good though hehe

 

[MadMouse101]

Charcoal user here.

 

[monkeyspank]

madmouse101 uses charcoal everyone! you can all sleep sound tonight

 

[Glaucus]

By far the best meat by a mile. So tasty and flavour fall, without over doing it like a lot of game. Nit that game is bad, just not as perfectly balanced as good lamb.

 

[MadMouse101]

madmouse101 uses charcoal everyone! you can all sleep sound tonight

I would hate to keep everyone up at night for not knowing

 

[boxman2000]

You don;t need lava rocks if there is a proper heat plate.

There wasn't, the food took an age to cook and tasted awful. My previous cheap bbq had lava rocks and did a relatively good job overall - a country mile better than this one at my relatives place.

 

[ttaskmaster]

Brave man dispensing advice while admitting to liking steaks medium-well, not liking lamb, fish or fatty cuts of meat and failing to understand how marinades or slow-cooking works. Think we can draw our own conclusions

I understand how marinades work perfectly fine. I just generally don't like them. I don't like most spicy food, either. Wanna draw more 'conclusions' from that, too?

No, True barbeque is cooking tough joints like beef brisket until they are tender. Grilling is the more precise term used for cooking things like burgers, steaks and sausages on charcoal or gas.

In America, perhaps... not here, though:

Barbecue - South African usage: Cooking meat, usually in an outdoor environment, over charcoal or wood. (Afrikaans: Braai).
Barbecue - British usage: A fast cooking process directly over high heat.
Barbecue - American usage: A slow process using indirect heat or hot smoke.

So you're talking American, rather than British, Australian, Portuguese or South African and probably others that I haven't looked at. I'm not American. I don't 'grill'.

I also understand, from reading a number of US championship websites, that almost all competition grillers in the US use charcoal...
Charcoal, eh?
But I thought you were telling me gas was the "scientifically proven" route to perfection, here...?

Sausages and burgers have a high fat content, even the best, by design. Otherwise you get a dry tasteless piece of cardboard whoever you cook the burger. It has nothing to do with being cheap. I make my own sausages from scratch, adding pork fat is a requisite ingredient

Cheap sausages have too much fat and too much rusk, so it has a LOT to do with being cheap. Same for burgers.
Low fat ones have less of both, consequently with more meat, but still enough to work.
THAT is why you don't use the cheap stuff - It's crap and good for nothing!!

You don't even know about marinades so I wouldn't expect you to have a clue about pasta either

I've made it a couple of times. Like pastry, it's nice to do, but takes time and isn't the primary focus of my cooking. I generally leave that part to the chefs among my friends, just as I leave the advanced mechanics to the friend who does that for a living.

People that refuse a charcoal chimney are like Amish who refuse to use electricity or drive cars. Do you go around in a horse drawn carriage by chance? Again, statements like that clearly show you really don't know how to BBQ/grill.

Now you really are talking out of your own backside!
I do it because I WANT to and because I enjoy it.
Do you similarly crack at everyone who likes to go fishing with a rod of being similarly archaic because they don't use a fishing trawler where they're far more likely to catch more?
Or people who like to go hiking with a map and compass, rather than a pocket SatNav?

There is proven no difference between charcoal and gas when you are simply grilling food. Perfection is equally achieved on a gas or charcoal grill.

So why isn't everyone achieving such easy perfection with gas grills everywhere, then?
Why are there so many grill competitions (grill, not barbecue), and why do so many of the competitors go for coals over gas?

You don't have to marinade but it is the liquids form the marinade and rendered fat that will flavor the meat and give the flavor.

I don't want my steak to taste of BBQ sauce, honey & mustard, char siu, or whatever. I want it to taste of steak. Therefore, I don't like marinades. Same as I don't like chips drowned in ketchup.
Problem?

Charcoal has no smoke and add absolutely nothing to the flavor.

Dunno what charcoal you use, but mine definitely does...!

An Indoor grill is completely different to an a gs BBQ. Again, that just proves you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

No, I just don't know what YOU are on about, mate...

call it a braai and apparently you win.

It's just the word for barbecue in another language. Means the same thing.... except in America, apparently. It's also shorter than barbecue, though I always felt 'BBQ' was more reminiscent of that crap sauce from McDonalds.
Most people I'm around call it a braai, so that's just my preferred term.
It does also refer to the whole social event, but that's a different context than in this thread.

he is trolling ffs. the best "braai" he ever had was on a pair of petrol station disposables. he needs to get banned or go back to gd

You come ban me, then...
I'm expressing opinions, debating others and having a discussion. The whole thread is about what different people prefer... or do you think I misinterpreted the OP's pretty straightforward question somehow?

Anyone who doesn't like lamb is clearly mentally ill.

We spend vast amounts of money (that some really cannot afford) on tarting up machines that play games - and you want to talk about mentally ill?