Soldato
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Those who moved to the US - yay/nay?
- Thread starter squerble
- Start date
It wasn't me who bought burger flippers into it. I'd suggest the majority of this forum would struggle to move there, that might help you grasp my point. The community was reference to people working in tech, there are many here and many of them would struggle I'd suggest and the are many people on this forum who don't work in tech.
We have a general point about a person I know little about asking how difficult it is. THAT is what we are talking about. Moving to the U.S. is not something most here would do easily no matter how much you suggest they would. My entry to this discussion was you do need to be a specialist in something, you now seek to debate what determines a specialist and how many people here that applies to, something neither of us know.
What mostly happens for emergency stuff is that the homeless bum will end up with a lot of debt, he might have to declare bankruptcy, but for a homeless bum that is not a big deal. For an average poor person what will tend to be the case after some 200K life saving emergency operation is they will be setup on a repayment plan where they look at the monthly income and outgoing expenses and so the hapless victim pays like $200 a month to pay off his medical debts. then after x years they just wipe out the debt.
A much bigger issue is things like long term illness.
But anyway, this kind if discussion is pretty irrelevant for someone who wants to move to the US because presumably they don;t want to be homeless or underpaid.
Caporegime
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Well, do you even see homeless bum getting into debt?
Or do you see anyone having to remortgage their house to pay for medical bills?
Or anyone having to set up a repayment plan at all?
Yes yes yes, the NHS isn't technically free as money doesn't fall out of the sky and pay for doctors and nurses (yes i haven't included medicine, electrics, admin cost either before the pedantics start another one), the point is, you don't pay at the point of treatment, nor after, directly.
I was going to mention long term illness (about 2 posts back but thought not, now that you mention it), about middle income family having to choose between reportage their house in order to pay for drugs. it is like choosing between death or risk being homeless.
It's not really a choice one should have to make.
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Soldato
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Holding dual nationality helps. 
well given that the OP is talking about the better salaries in the IT industry state side it is a bit of a moot point re: non tech workers among OCUK posters
this is a technical forum and attracts a lot of people who work in the tech industry - it is probably reasonable to assume(given that he seemingly works in IT) that should the OP really want to move there then he could find a way else it would be a bit silly for him to ask in the first place... yet on threads like these we still get people pointing out that it isn't easy for joe bloggs to just move to the US
You are missing my point. It is not easy for many technical people to get there and just because he works in tech does not mean he has an open door. That is my point and trying to pick a role or qualification and suggest you're all set is misguided.
I moved to the US about 5 years ago. I've lived in Illinois, Indiana and California.
A few thoughts:
The US is a big place. I mean really big. About the same size as Europe. Asking what it's like to live in the US is a bit like asking what it's like to live in Europe. It's not going to be the same in Leeds as it is in Warsaw.
If you are in a skilled field, there is a 90% chance you will get paid more over here. The salaries for my job aren't even close (read: 100% more than London equivalent). Again, this is highly dependent on location (Bay Area > Mississippi). Funnily enough taxes are pretty much the same (there's no huge "no NHS coverage" discount that you might expect).
Housing ranges from dirt cheap to entirely unaffordable. Just like "the North" vs. London prices.
Workers rights and healthcare really depend on your circumstances. Definitely don't move here if you're going to be working for Walmart on low wages. Right now I have better healthcare than the NHS would provide and the maximum I can pay for it in a year is $2,000 (if everything goes completely **** up). My company has better rights than 95% of companies in the UK - holiday, paternity, hours wise.
Because I earn decent money I buy a lot of private insurances (disability - long and short term, life etc.). With these I have better safety net than I would in the UK. JSA is a complete joke compared to unemployment here which would pay me $2k a month.
Social security is much more generous than a standard state pension in the UK. If you have a decent 401(k) match through an employer I imagine being able to move somewhere cheap like the midwest and retiring very comfortably.
The caveat to all this is you can't really just decide you'd like to live here. The visa process is a pain the ****.
A few thoughts:
The US is a big place. I mean really big. About the same size as Europe. Asking what it's like to live in the US is a bit like asking what it's like to live in Europe. It's not going to be the same in Leeds as it is in Warsaw.
If you are in a skilled field, there is a 90% chance you will get paid more over here. The salaries for my job aren't even close (read: 100% more than London equivalent). Again, this is highly dependent on location (Bay Area > Mississippi). Funnily enough taxes are pretty much the same (there's no huge "no NHS coverage" discount that you might expect).
Housing ranges from dirt cheap to entirely unaffordable. Just like "the North" vs. London prices.
Workers rights and healthcare really depend on your circumstances. Definitely don't move here if you're going to be working for Walmart on low wages. Right now I have better healthcare than the NHS would provide and the maximum I can pay for it in a year is $2,000 (if everything goes completely **** up). My company has better rights than 95% of companies in the UK - holiday, paternity, hours wise.
Because I earn decent money I buy a lot of private insurances (disability - long and short term, life etc.). With these I have better safety net than I would in the UK. JSA is a complete joke compared to unemployment here which would pay me $2k a month.
Social security is much more generous than a standard state pension in the UK. If you have a decent 401(k) match through an employer I imagine being able to move somewhere cheap like the midwest and retiring very comfortably.
The caveat to all this is you can't really just decide you'd like to live here. The visa process is a pain the ****.
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Caporegime
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This is probably a good idea. And by good I mean really, really obvious and massively important.
Comment made me laugh.
I moved from the UK to San Diego, California about 9 months ago on an inter-company transfer visa (L1).
Positives:
Cons:
Positives:
- I get paid about 1/3 more here than I would in Cambridge, UK, and my taxes here are less than they were in the UK. I'm able to save a lot of money.
- My outgoings for rent (sharing a house with two guys) are cheaper here than I paid in Cambridge, UK (where I shared a house with three others); paying less dollars than I used to pay pounds
- I was able to buy a brand new car (top of the range Mazda CX5, 100% built in Japan) cheaper here than I could in the UK, with 20% deposit and 0% APR financing, despite having only lived in the country for one month when I bought the car
- I live in a city with t-shirt and shorts weather (most of the) year round - I very rarely wear a hoody/jumper/jacket
Cons:
- Until I get a green card, if I lose my job, I'll only have 10 days to pack my things and go back to the UK
- I "only" get 15 days holiday vs 25 in the UK, AND I have to accrue it before I can use it. However, I can keep a balance of two years and turn some of it into cash (on a use 1 day, cash 1 day ratio).
- California is in a drought at the moment, and I feel bad if I take a shower that lasts longer than a few minutes.
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Some of the guys here have summed it up really well.
Personally... if you moved here, initially you will think they are all nuts. Takes about a year to get used to it. (I'm talking about moving here, not visit mode).
From a personal perspective, the housing in my area is REALLLLLY expensive, whether you rent or buy it's excessive. The yearly housing housing tax in my area can be between 8k to 20k normally depending on the price of your house.
Depending where you live, life is NOT cheaper. I earn more than I did in the UK, but that soon goes.
Petrol is cheap. Electricity and oil for heat are not. Plus depending on your area you need A/C on a lot of the time.
You can't just move to the states, it doesn't work like that. My visa after being married was a total nightmare, and almost destroyed my marriage due to being away from my wife (I needed to remain in England during the process unfortunately as I'm the one with the decent job).
Would I recommend it? Yes, in a heart beat. I have my pet hates, like the complete morons on the roads and other minor things, but I love where I work, I love the weather, I love that for three months I've been able to get in the pool outside.
I don't want to repeat what the others said, and can't be bothered to give a structured answer because it's already been done.
Things that people won't tell you. If you lose your job, you still need to be insured. If you want the same level of coverage between jobs, you need to buy something called 'Cobra' which is a total rip-off and extortionate. Best hope you get a job quickly.
Jobs are easier to get, just don't go searching for a professional job around Christmas, nobody hires then. Jobs are easier to get fired from, and you can be walked out the door just like that.
Watch office space. It is TOTALLY like that.. so much so it's scary. Having multiple managers... it's kinda bizarre.
Be careful where the hell you go. You can be in death alley without realizing it extremely quickly if you don't know the areas.
Personally... if you moved here, initially you will think they are all nuts. Takes about a year to get used to it. (I'm talking about moving here, not visit mode).
From a personal perspective, the housing in my area is REALLLLLY expensive, whether you rent or buy it's excessive. The yearly housing housing tax in my area can be between 8k to 20k normally depending on the price of your house.
Depending where you live, life is NOT cheaper. I earn more than I did in the UK, but that soon goes.
Petrol is cheap. Electricity and oil for heat are not. Plus depending on your area you need A/C on a lot of the time.
You can't just move to the states, it doesn't work like that. My visa after being married was a total nightmare, and almost destroyed my marriage due to being away from my wife (I needed to remain in England during the process unfortunately as I'm the one with the decent job).
Would I recommend it? Yes, in a heart beat. I have my pet hates, like the complete morons on the roads and other minor things, but I love where I work, I love the weather, I love that for three months I've been able to get in the pool outside.
I don't want to repeat what the others said, and can't be bothered to give a structured answer because it's already been done.
Things that people won't tell you. If you lose your job, you still need to be insured. If you want the same level of coverage between jobs, you need to buy something called 'Cobra' which is a total rip-off and extortionate. Best hope you get a job quickly.
Jobs are easier to get, just don't go searching for a professional job around Christmas, nobody hires then. Jobs are easier to get fired from, and you can be walked out the door just like that.
Watch office space. It is TOTALLY like that.. so much so it's scary. Having multiple managers... it's kinda bizarre.
Be careful where the hell you go. You can be in death alley without realizing it extremely quickly if you don't know the areas.
New Hampshire is great we have no state income tax or sales tax, but then they sting us on other costs to make up the difference. I live in the sticks, we lose power quite a lot in bad weather, i think nothing of driving 1 hour one way just to goto a store or go out for a meal.
Work wise i used to work for Lindt and i got 6 weeks holiday a year, the job im at now i get 56 hours this year and 88 next year
This is also an at will state, where they can get rid of you for no reason. 2nd had cars are stupidly priced.
There is hardly an crime in NH, most people i know are shocked that i lock my house. Even where i live.
Generally we have a decent life over here, my child is in one of the best private schools, but that is down to the local school being crap.
I've made some great friends over here and know a few english guys who live locally too, actually it quite surprising how many Brits i meet in NH.
Life's what you make it, no matter where you live. I would say though if you have the chance to move to another country go for it. If it all goes horribly wrong you can always get back on the plane to the UK.
Work wise i used to work for Lindt and i got 6 weeks holiday a year, the job im at now i get 56 hours this year and 88 next year
This is also an at will state, where they can get rid of you for no reason. 2nd had cars are stupidly priced.
There is hardly an crime in NH, most people i know are shocked that i lock my house. Even where i live.
Generally we have a decent life over here, my child is in one of the best private schools, but that is down to the local school being crap.
I've made some great friends over here and know a few english guys who live locally too, actually it quite surprising how many Brits i meet in NH.
Life's what you make it, no matter where you live. I would say though if you have the chance to move to another country go for it. If it all goes horribly wrong you can always get back on the plane to the UK.
Good post and some it up well. For sure low paid jobs at a lot lf companies will see you worse off than thr awake both financially and I terms of social security and benefits. Bit if you are a skilled worker generally you are better, although typvially not in terms of vacation.
As an exapple my wife had 9 months paternity leave paid at full salary . That is well over $100k for being at home looking after her baby, no string attaché.d how many company in the UK are going to shell out that kind of money on paternity leave, and it is paternity leave because it applies to both fathers and mothers.
Social security I much better that the UK. I work for a start up and risked loosing my job recently due to an investor pulling out at th last minute, so I researched the process and pay outl I would get around $2500 a month from the state if I lost my job. I also have an unemployment insurance that would liekly double that. What is it you get in the UK, £60 a week or something laughable.
The house prices issue is very true, the cheap mansions you get in the Us doesn't apply,to places like the Bay Area or New York but you are still likely to be better off than in London. The golden ticket is to get a job so eh were a. It smaller that has the cheaper housing but still decent slareries. Our house would cost about 2-3x the amount in a European city, and my wife and I get paid 2-3x what we would in the UK. We hope to be mortgage free in a year or 2. But thn a friend has just moved to Georgia and have our chased a house bigger than ours for less than half.
New Hampshire is great we have no state income tax or sales tax, but then they sting us on other costs to make up the difference. I live in the sticks, we lose power quite a lot in bad weather, i think nothing of driving 1 hour one way just to goto a store or go out for a meal.
Work wise i used to work for Lindt and i got 6 weeks holiday a year, the job im at now i get 56 hours this year and 88 next year
This is also an at will state, where they can get rid of you for no reason. 2nd had cars are stupidly priced.
There is hardly an crime in NH, most people i know are shocked that i lock my house. Even where i live.
Generally we have a decent life over here, my child is in one of the best private schools, but that is down to the local school being crap.
I've made some great friends over here and know a few english guys who live locally too, actually it quite surprising how many Brits i meet in NH.
Life's what you make it, no matter where you live. I would say though if you have the chance to move to another country go for it. If it all goes horribly wrong you can always get back on the plane to the UK.
The locked houses is an eye opener.
Back in 2004 I loved in California and stayed the night at the girlfriends. Next morning getting some cereals we had no milk so we walked over to her neighbors in our PJs and knocked on the door, no one home so we just walked I. And got some milk form the fridge, the whole concept was so alien to me coming from titian, despite living in a Small supposedly safe town in Scotland. It is almost the same where I live now, I needed some butter the other day and texted the neighbors, one said they were out but just walk in and help myself.
I moved from the UK to San Diego, California about 9 months ago on an inter-company transfer visa (L1).
Positives:
- I get paid about 1/3 more here than I would in Cambridge, UK, and my taxes here are less than they were in the UK. I'm able to save a lot of money.
- My outgoings for rent (sharing a house with two guys) are cheaper here than I paid in Cambridge, UK (where I shared a house with three others); paying less dollars than I used to pay pounds
- I was able to buy a brand new car (top of the range Mazda CX5, 100% built in Japan) cheaper here than I could in the UK, with 20% deposit and 0% APR financing, despite having only lived in the country for one month when I bought the car
- I live in a city with t-shirt and shorts weather (most of the) year round - I very rarely wear a hoody/jumper/jacket
Cons:
- Until I get a green card, if I lose my job, I'll only have 10 days to pack my things and go back to the UK
- I "only" get 15 days holiday vs 25 in the UK, AND I have to accrue it before I can use it. However, I can keep a balance of two years and turn some of it into cash (on a use 1 day, cash 1 day ratio).
- California is in a drought at the moment, and I feel bad if I take a shower that lasts longer than a few minutes.
A few people have mentioned vacation and agree it is a big sticking point, one if the reasons that makes me want to return to Europe.
However, it is not so bad. Like you I get 15 days vacation. But I also get 11 public holidays which is pretty standard, while the auk only has 7 I believe. So the difference is somewhat smaller. Then there is the fact the many companies let you buy more vacation time, and since you typically get paid more then you can make up the difference.
My company just gave me an extra 8 days vacation, they didn't have cash for a bonus but anted to thank is and incentivize is to stay. Also next year I will have been here long enough to get 20 days a year.
Americans do have a strange idea if vacation though and many of them would be quite happy to never take a day vacation in their life. Some Of them feel bad taking. Time off work. I really don't get this, it's bizarre. I guess Americans are much more dedicated to their employer.
Not moved there but have some limited experience of living there - amongst other things used to play competitive quake 3 CTF in NA due to lack of a real euro scene at the time.
I find the attitudes of some of them really odd (and really hard to get along with) - you really can't comprehend it without experiencing it - but on the flipside the friends I made over there are awesome - have a family like relationship that is rare over here. (EDIT: kind of tying in with what D.P. said some of them wouldn't blink an eyelid if I turned up out of the blue tomorrow and made myself at home - on a short term basis obviously).
Was quite fascinated that some parts were this really odd mix of something somewhat reminiscent of some aspects of 70s UK but with a mix of more modern aspects that (at the time - this was a few years back) were more advanced than the UK.
TBH if I was moving that way I'd probably move to Canada.
I find the attitudes of some of them really odd (and really hard to get along with) - you really can't comprehend it without experiencing it - but on the flipside the friends I made over there are awesome - have a family like relationship that is rare over here. (EDIT: kind of tying in with what D.P. said some of them wouldn't blink an eyelid if I turned up out of the blue tomorrow and made myself at home - on a short term basis obviously).
Was quite fascinated that some parts were this really odd mix of something somewhat reminiscent of some aspects of 70s UK but with a mix of more modern aspects that (at the time - this was a few years back) were more advanced than the UK.
TBH if I was moving that way I'd probably move to Canada.
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