Surge Protection for Office

Soldato
Joined
18 Oct 2002
Posts
4,656
Location
The Darkside
A local business called me in to fix a few systems but I was in for a shock. An electrician was changing over to a generator because of the DNO doing work in the area and the sparky made a mistake and blow every printer up, cabinet switches/routers and every computer except two latest systems.

It was a mess. Anything turned on at the socket died. I've replaced the computer psu's and installed new switches and so on.

What is the best way of surge protecting everything in the office so something like this can hopefully be avoided? Can you get protection for the Consumer unit to protect a circuit or surge protected 3-pin faceplates etc?

I don't want the mess of surge protected extension cords everywhere especially when there are 15+ computers and other specialised equipment in operation.
 
Last edited:
I wouldn't trust a £5 surge "cube". But that's just me!

My APC smartUPS committed suicide several years ago when I had a power surge (lightning storm), saving all my equipment connected to it.

About 6 months ago, another lightning storm destroyed my APC backUPS. Everything was ok apart from one of my Dell 2007WFP monitors which popped a cap. I had it replaced and it lives again (it was a 9 year old monitor at the time though).

I haven't bought a new UPS yet. I had one from OCUK but it made an annoying high pitch noise every 5 seconds so I returned it.
 
I am going to put a UPS on the server but I can't stick one on every system in the office. I would need too many and the cost would be massive.
 
An electrician was changing over to a generator because of the DNO doing work in the area and the sparky made a mistake and blow every printer up, cabinet switches/routers and every computer except two latest systems.
Any recommendation that ignores numbers is best considered uninformed. A mistake by sparky would have increased line voltage from 230 to something that would never exceed 480. All those protectors recommended by others ignore any voltage below 500. Furthermore, those protectors are only optimized for microsecond events. What sparky probably created was a high voltage that lasted for seconds.

No protector or UPS adjacent to an appliance claims to protect from typically destructive surges. Anyone can also read those numbers - near zero protection. Destructive surges (that also well exceed 500 volts) means the solution says where hundreds of thousands of joules harmlessly dissipate. How many joules do those recommendations absorb? Hundreds? Thousand?

So it does not claim to protect from an anomaly created by sparky. And it does not claim to protect from a completely different anomaly that typically exceeds 500 volts. So why did others make recommendations without numbers? Those missing numbers (provided here) should say plenty.

Where is a spec number that says the UPS will protect from a 300+ voltage?
 
The spark didn't turn of all the breakers and when he switched over to the generator, a specialised heating system was in operation and the generator powered away down till near stall and shot back up to full power when it sorted itself out all in a few seconds.

I take it, it was the quick fire up after the dip overvolted the circuit. It was a single phase supply and if it was three phase, it might not have occurred.

Basically, ups or surge protectors wouldn't have prevented this damage?
 
Last edited:
Well a UPS switches over to battery mode instantly when it detects high voltage or voltage drop and remains on battery power untill voltage are at a acceptable level again. I think the switch over is something like 5-10ms

The downsides are UPS's use power(mine uses about 30watts 24/7) as they are constantly monitoring the mains power and the batteries need changing every 3-4 years.
 
Basically, ups or surge protectors wouldn't have prevented this damage?
To say something that is not wild speculation means identifying what parts inside the PSU, etc were damaged. ATX type PSUs should withstand up to 1000 volts without damage. If a surge was 1000+ volts, then it simply blew through that UPS.

Meanwhile, any generator that can create a 1000 volt surge is defective by design. The protection from that anomaly should be standard inside a generator. That is where best protection and least expensive protection exists.

Did the generator create a 500 volts surge? That might blow through a UPS in microseconds (UPS requires tens of milliseconds to respond). Just another reason why protection is best located at the source - not at its victims.
 
To say something that is not wild speculation means identifying what parts inside the PSU, etc were damaged. ATX type PSUs should withstand up to 1000 volts without damage. If a surge was 1000+ volts, then it simply blew through that UPS.

Meanwhile, any generator that can create a 1000 volt surge is defective by design. The protection from that anomaly should be standard inside a generator. That is where best protection and least expensive protection exists.

Did the generator create a 500 volts surge? That might blow through a UPS in microseconds (UPS requires tens of milliseconds to respond). Just another reason why protection is best located at the source - not at its victims.

I guess if the UPS flick over to battery power fast enough is might of stopped the damage.. Like nothing will protect you from a A direct lightning, but you have to be very unlucky to be hit from a direct strike. Someone told me with surges, the surge gets weaker when enters your home, so a UPS might be fast enough to flick over to battery mode before it causes damage?

You can buy a UPS that uses battery mode all the time, So basically there no switch over time. The UPS check the input voltage and then it alters the voltage if its too high or too low before entering your equipment. I think these are called "Online/double-conversion UPS's"

The downside on these, they cost more, use more power as the batteries are constantly being recharged, but they offer more protection then the normal UPS's
 
Last edited:
Actually I think I got that wrong about surges getting weaker, they get stronger, so a UPS might be able to flick over to battery mode before the surge gets to dangerous levels.

As you can see, my UPS flicks over to battery if voltage goes under 172v or above 258v

Image1.jpg
 
Last edited:
I guess if the UPS flick over to battery power fast enough is might of stopped the damage.. Like nothing will protect you from a A direct lightning, but you have to be very unlucky to be hit from a direct strike. Someone told me with surges, the surge gets weaker when enters your home, so a UPS might be fast enough to flick over to battery mode before it causes damage?
If that speculation was true, then numbers could exist to explain it. Destructive transients occur in microseconds. UPS takes tens of milliseconds to respond. Clearly it cannot switch fast enough.

Furthermore, did you really think a millimeters gap in that disconnecting switch would stop what three miles of sky could not? More numbers that expose the myth.

A basic electrical concept is taught to first year engineers - superposition. To a destructive transient, the battery is nothing more than a short circuit. You have no reason to believe a battery does any such protection. But again, many make assumptions rather than learn significant concepts such as normal mode and longitudinal mode currents.

UPS is temporary and 'dirty' power so that unsaved data can be saved. 'Dirty' because protection already inside all electronics is more robust. Your concern is the rare and destructive transient that can overwhelm protection already inside all electronics. No UPS or adjacent protector claims to protect from that type of transient. A 'whole house' solution (that costs tens of times less money per protected appliance) does that protection.

Any protection solution that does not protect from direct lightning strikes is bogus and often a profit center. Routine for over 100 years was direct strikes without damage. Your telco's CO suffer about 100 surges with each storm. How often is your town without phone service for four days after each thunderstorm while they replace that $multi-million computer? Never? Because direct lighting strikes without damage has been routine anywhere that basic electrical concepts (and not magic box protectors) are employed.

Electronics atop the Empire State Building suffer about 23 direct lightning strikes annually without damage. But due to myths promoted by near zero plug-in protectors, many only assume nothing can protect from direct strikes.

Any protection a UPS or power strip might provide must already be inside electronics. Concern is for a transient (maybe once every seven years) that can overwhelm that existing protection. Informed consumers properly earth a 'whole house' solution. Even the 'whole house' protector is not found in some systems. But every effective protection system concentrates on THE most critical component in every protecton system: single point earth ground. A protector is only as effective as its earth ground (that power strip and UPS protectors do not have and will not discuss).
 
Something like the "VFI2000C 2KVA/1600W Online Double Conversion UPS" is going tobe my next UPS when the Batteries fail again on current UPS, as it will be roughly 10yrs old by then.....

Transfer Time 0ms (between on-line mode & battery mode)
Image2.jpg
 
Last edited:
Back
Top Bottom