US TV journalists shot dead on air

One question is why firms keep making guns and sell that kill people.. Stop making weapons and save money to improvement health etc.. Like Africa which are the worst civil wars as people need foods.. Guns are kill people for no reason - dump all weapon...
 
sounds like he liked to play the race card.... apparently had history for suing employers for 'racism'

which probably indicates he was crap at his job/frequently got butt hurt at not getting promoted etc..
 
estebanrey said:
I never said it wasn't. Likewise 0.17 of the UK's 0.26 figure is suicide if you're only interested in murders.

But I don't see why you should only be interested in murder if you're looking at how gun culture affects the lives of your citizens. The family grieve just as much if the person shot himself instead of being shot by someone else.

Of course someone who is determined to kill themselves can do so without a gun but I'd be surprised if tight gun controls don't lower the successful suicide rate. After all, someone with a gun in their house can at any moment decide to pull and trigger and end their life with no pain and straight away. Someone taking an overdose is more likely to be found and saved and other methods usually involve some form of severe, albeit short lived, pain which is always going to put a small number of people off who it wouldn't have if you gave them the option of shooting themselves.
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Right, lets look back at the conversation you was having, as opposed to the conversation you're now having that includes suicide...

MrMoonX said:
gun control American!

works in the UK, we don't get people gunned down like that, just shows the strictest guns laws in the world work!
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darreny said:
We have had quite a few situations like that, Michael Ryan and that taxi driver whose name escapes me to name a couple.

If someone wants a gun in this country bad enough they will get one
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estebanrey said:
The fact the two cases you mentioned happened 28 and 5 years ago respectively prove the point. I bet you can name 5 instances in the US just from the last couple of years.
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estebanrey said:
Numbers of fire-arm related deaths (per 100,000 of population)

UK = 0.26
US = 10.64
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scorza said:
Isn't that a kinda pointless stat? Surely all that matters is the murder rate, not the tool used to commit the murder?
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So in reference to the original conversation you have unnecessarily conflated two sets of figures in order to exaggerate a situation. However, yes the US has a much higher gun homicide rate than any other developed nation without conflating that figure with suicide rates, which is the discussion at hand.
 
dowie said:
sounds like he liked to play the race card.... apparently had history for suing employers for 'racism'

which probably indicates he was crap at his job/frequently got butt hurt at not getting promoted etc..
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He's died from his self inflicted shot apparently.

Shame..
 
I'm actually surprised this doesn't happen more often tbh. Just about everyone has a gun.. The way an employer treats you over here if thy're letting you go, is pretty cut throat... You're really screwed in the USA without your job. No insurance for you or your family.. At least the crap they offer you COBRA is totally ridiculous.. It could easily push a sane man over the edge. Not sure what the stats are for nut jobs... as in proper nut jobs.. people that'll kill without remorse... but i think its like 1 in 100... (potentially)
 
RoboCod said:
So in reference to the original conversation you have unnecessarily conflated two sets of figures in order to exaggerate a situation. However, yes the US has a much higher gun homicide rate than any other developed nation without conflating that figure with suicide rates, which is the discussion at hand.
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If I'd have conflated them I would have presented those figures as murder figures but I didn't. I clearly labelled it as fire-arm related deaths which is correct and clear for everyone to see.

The 'original conversation' as your first quote points out was about gun controls 'working' in countries with tight-gun laws so why do you get to throw out suicides enabled by gun? If you're concentrating solely on darreny's post about Michael Ryan and Cumbria then you aren't using the correct stat either because you are lumping in all deaths caused to other people by gun with killing sprees (where there is more than one victim) caused by gun as well.
 
thedoc46 said:
So are the public. Anyone who's given a permit to carry has to go thru training, and part of that training is shoot to kill.. NEVER shoot to maim.

Double tap in center mass... If they're still coming at you, put two more in 'em ! and so on..

The point being, you're only supposed to shoot someone if you or someone else's life is in a life threatening situation.

Yes the easy access to guns works against people when nut jobs are able to arm themselves, but also works for others, when the not so nut jobs are all at equal protection. Women and the elderly as an example, against nut jobs.
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None of the three doing the interview could have done anything if they had a concealed weapon themselves. The whole premise is stupid. Just like how people are more likely to kill themselves or their family members than successfully repel a home invasion with their weapon.
 
This will start a debate in the states about the ease with which disturbed people can access a firearm and then absolutely nothing will be done about it.
 
bainbridge said:
This will start a debate in the states about the ease with which disturbed people can access a firearm and then absolutely nothing will be done about it.
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Will it?

Without wishing to be disrespectful to the two victims, there have been far worse tragedies in America associated with firearms.
 
braveheart said:
One question is why firms keep making guns and sell that kill people.. Stop making weapons and save money to improvement health etc.. Like Africa which are the worst civil wars as people need foods.. Guns are kill people for no reason - dump all weapon...
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Put the bottle down and try that again.

Edit: Anyone who buys The Sun tomorrow is a moron.

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bainbridge said:
This will start a debate in the states about the ease with which disturbed people can access a firearm and then absolutely nothing will be done about it.
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The problem is Americans, on the whole, see the world through the Hollywood black & white narrative of good and evil. Watch any interview with a US soldier or commander and they'll regularly refer to enemy combatants as "the bad guys" like a 12 year old kid.

The same goes for gun control, asking "how do we stop bad guys getting guns" is a silly question they keep debating as it presupposes people are inherently good or evil and if only we could weed out the latter group everyone would be happy (the irony being if you could do that you wouldn't need guns anyway).

Likewise this issue of mentally unstable people getting guns. Sure you can improve checks so that people with known conditions and current sufferers can't purchase them easily but once someone has passed these checks how do you stop them going through a mental breakdown after that point? Annual psychology tests for gun owners?

I'm sure we'll soon hear from Bryce Williams' family who'll all say he was such a nice, gentle guy and that this event was totally out of character etc....
 
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Chilling, I always wondered when we would see a shooting on live TV, although I had always envisioned it from a war correspondent, not a local news channel!

RIP
 
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