Are solar cells worth installing?
- Thread starter lunar
- Start date
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As far as i understand nothing has been suggested with regards to making them a compulsory item? https://www.gov.uk/guidance/smart-meters-how-they-work
I had a 3.99kw system installed this May. I have to say so far so good. We've had a dreadful summer, but the system is producing within margin what they said it would. Since the last week of May its generated about £270. Thats just what I will be paid from Feed in Tarif and the Export. Not sure how much it has saved me on my electric bill yet. But my combined electric and gas bill has dropped from £63 to £52 since May. I do a meter read monthly.
For numbers I paid £6300. The estimate is the system will have paid for itself in 6 years 4 months. So the remaining 13 years and 8 months is pure profit. Plus you get the export tarif forever.
Below shows the last 3 months. Target and actual generation.
Target KW Actual KW
June 476.9 467
July 500.16 440
Aug 465.92 382
For numbers I paid £6300. The estimate is the system will have paid for itself in 6 years 4 months. So the remaining 13 years and 8 months is pure profit. Plus you get the export tarif forever.
Below shows the last 3 months. Target and actual generation.
Target KW Actual KW
June 476.9 467
July 500.16 440
Aug 465.92 382
All right, so the smart meter charging forward for feed in (and compulsory installation) is a complete hoax? Honestly, the number of times I read the above on various forums over the last year, it's like a campaign of disinformation or something.
Ok, so what about the gov changing feed in tariffs? At the moment the Jan 2016 thing makes it guaranteed for all people before cut off point to retain the feed in rate (although doesn't guarantee the rate will rise with inflation, or does it?). But wasn't there a moment in 2011 when gov slashed the tariff in half from like forty something pence to twenty something pence for everyone, regardless of whether it made installation never pay for itself? I remember Nick Ferrari on the radio molesting the subject one morning.
Ok, so what about the gov changing feed in tariffs? At the moment the Jan 2016 thing makes it guaranteed for all people before cut off point to retain the feed in rate (although doesn't guarantee the rate will rise with inflation, or does it?). But wasn't there a moment in 2011 when gov slashed the tariff in half from like forty something pence to twenty something pence for everyone, regardless of whether it made installation never pay for itself? I remember Nick Ferrari on the radio molesting the subject one morning.
The tarif has been cut from 50p per kwh to 13p now. That rate can go up according to RPI. However the rate you get when you sign up is fixed for 20 years. The export tariff is for life and also goes up by RPI. I think. . . . Don't have my paper work to hand to confirm that. But once you are on and connected that is the rate you get for 20 years.
As for the smart meter, I don't know. I would like a smart meter. I assumed it would just show RED on the screen like the current meter does.
As for the smart meter, I don't know. I would like a smart meter. I assumed it would just show RED on the screen like the current meter does.
Yes. The estimate includes a percentage of degrading. solarguide.co.uk has a nice calculator. Matches what my install company gave me. I use the calc by system price tab. You can check with the installers what % cable/inverter system losses to expect over the 20 years. I think most kit losses 15% on average. Micro inverters do better, solar edge kit does better too.
Big thing is inverter life. A lot of company's told me to budget for a new inverter after 10 - 12 years average.
All in all I don't see the system making a loss. I reckon I'll see £10k-£13k profit from it. Plus estate agents are starting to list it as a home improvement so adding value (not all estate agents, but growing number).
I think panels are a win win if you can buy them out right or get them paid off really quickly. Finance eats into that possible profit.
When the FIT started at 50p per KWH panel systems were £15k plus! But even so, the people who got in early and are on that 40p+ tarif are laughing now.
I think the current system of reducing every 3 - 4 months works out ok. I don't know how close the government is to its green target, but cutting the tarif right down will put people off. Plus I the money is paid to you by the electric company, not the government. That money is raised by price hikes, green tax costs? So when the FIT gets cut does that mean everyone should see a drop in electric and gas prices????
Oh and the other thing to keep in mind is panels are only a good idea if you intend to stay in the house 20 years
I think the current system of reducing every 3 - 4 months works out ok. I don't know how close the government is to its green target, but cutting the tarif right down will put people off. Plus I the money is paid to you by the electric company, not the government. That money is raised by price hikes, green tax costs? So when the FIT gets cut does that mean everyone should see a drop in electric and gas prices????
Oh and the other thing to keep in mind is panels are only a good idea if you intend to stay in the house 20 years
Hmm not sure its ever really worked then. When they paid 4x what I get per kwh the system still paid for itself in 7 ish. To be honest yes there is a financial gain, but over 20 years. Its still a trickle of money. £500 ish per year profit. But it does feel good that my home generates some money rather than draining my pocket
There's a bit of an argument about the cost of domestic FITs to the average bill, some sources say £9 others £10 PER ANNUM!
http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jul/21/can-uks-solar-industry-survive-without-subsidies
FITs only account for about 7% of the green levies on your bill. ALMOST ALL THE REST IS SWALLOWED BY THE COST OF CLEANING UP NUCLEAR
http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jul/21/can-uks-solar-industry-survive-without-subsidies
FITs only account for about 7% of the green levies on your bill. ALMOST ALL THE REST IS SWALLOWED BY THE COST OF CLEANING UP NUCLEAR
I had them fitted 3 years ago, and bought them out right. I get the top tariff of around 50p per KW so I am laughing. I save around a third on my electric bill, but that is because we are carful to use things like the washing machine, dishwasher etc when its sunny so it doesn't cost anything (use the timers etc)
Panel life should not be a factor for most people especially if you bought a decent brand as their performance will degrade very slowly over time. Invertor life can be increased if kept cooler, a lot of installers fit them in lofts as its easier and cheaper for them but they tend to run very warm in the summer and a it can effect performance and life expectancy (mine was fitted in my garage at my request).
From the start, I have treated mine like a small business, I paid the initial outlay and each payment I receive goes into an ISA, any repair cost or upgrades will be paid for from the profit.
Panel life should not be a factor for most people especially if you bought a decent brand as their performance will degrade very slowly over time. Invertor life can be increased if kept cooler, a lot of installers fit them in lofts as its easier and cheaper for them but they tend to run very warm in the summer and a it can effect performance and life expectancy (mine was fitted in my garage at my request).
From the start, I have treated mine like a small business, I paid the initial outlay and each payment I receive goes into an ISA, any repair cost or upgrades will be paid for from the profit.
So, if I get panels installed before Jan 2016 I will be on the higher 12p tariff? If I were to add more panels after this date, would it be classed as a new and bigger system therefore reducing me to the new lower tariff? Or would I remain on the higher tariff, only now with more panels at that rate.
I'm not sure you can add extra panels later. I think extra panels means a second system. Though panel cost is cheap! So not really a saving.
So the first install would be on the 12p+ the rest would be on the new low rate. You get a certificate of install, it shows the power rating etc.
So the first install would be on the 12p+ the rest would be on the new low rate. You get a certificate of install, it shows the power rating etc.
Also you would need to check with your local network operator how much more power you are allowed to export. We've got 4kW on the roof and we're only allowed to add 1kW if we wanted to extend the system.
Some people have fitted 4.5 or even 5 KW of panels but have then limited their invertors to 4KW (to stay on the higher tariff). The benefit of this is that you will produce nearer to 4KW more often thus maximising income.
I thought you needed planning permission to install a panel system over 4kw? Has that gone up to 5kw now? I know a domestic property can go to 10kw but at a lower FIT payment.
I must admit I wish I had maxed out my roof. would have been a 5.8kw system. . . But never mind.
I must admit I wish I had maxed out my roof. would have been a 5.8kw system. . . But never mind.
So, I've just signed up for a survey from IKEA/Hanergy and lo and behold there is some change in rates coming literally at the end of this month. The lady was positive that they can install the system by the end of the month, but wasn't sure if I can complete paperwork for gov something by the end of September. I'm not slightly regretting that so little time is left because it seems Hanergy/IKEA are installing 125W panels with 13.3% efficiency instead of 250W at 15% efficiency, so returns per meter of roof space may be lower and all that jazz, so if I had time to research it better I would probably end up with something marginally better in a long run (not necessarily cheaper, as IKEA after discounts was cheapest installation so far).
Anyway - my question is - those that had it installed - what kind of paperwork/caviats are involved and does it really take longer than a week to file and process?
Anyway - my question is - those that had it installed - what kind of paperwork/caviats are involved and does it really take longer than a week to file and process?