Four day work week

Stretch · 15 Sep 2015 at 19:42

Lightnix said:
I think it's time that as a nation we start giving the idea of a four day work week more serious consideration. Politically, recently we're being shown that there is a hunger on the left for better rights for workers as shown by the left leaning Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn winning the party leadership contest by a huge majority.

A huge majority of registered labour members, which is a tiny percentage of electorate. Even the majority of labour MPs don't support Jeremy, only 3% voted for him.

What Jeremy fans seemingly havn't yet realised is rights for workers, pay etc are not something you can award without considering the wider dynamic.

For example, I work for a multi national with offices all over the world. If the UK declared a 4 day working week, there's no prizes for guessing what would happen to my job.

Stumble Bum said:
I work for a big bank and we can already do this. We still do our 35 hour week but over the course of 4 days if we choose to. It works as we have enough cover each day but obviously not every department would be able to function this way. Especially if you were client facing.

It's very handy though and most people choose to do these compressed hours. Certainly helps a little in the job satisfaction department.

I know a few people that have this, and it would be nice. However, when you regularly work with people in other countries it becomes difficult. The Americans and Japanese just wouldn't get it.

Lightnix · 15 Sep 2015 at 19:50

Stretch said:
A huge majority of registered labour members, which is a tiny percentage of electorate. Even the majority of labour MPs don't support Jeremy, only 3% voted for him.

What Jeremy fans seemingly havn't yet realised is rights for workers, pay etc are not something you can award without considering the wider dynamic.

For example, I work for a multi national with offices all over the world. If the UK declared a 4 day working week, there's no prizes for guessing what would happen to my job.

I suspect your job is already cheaper to do elsewhere, probably by significantly more than 20%.

Bear · 15 Sep 2015 at 19:54

I already do a 4 day week, I just do 40hours Monday to Thursday.

Stretch · 15 Sep 2015 at 19:56

Lightnix said:
I suspect your job would is already cheaper to do elsewhere, probably by significantly more than 20%.

Actually not really. Since we're not based in one of the major global capital cities, we are currently considered cheaper than the equivalent quality found elsewhere in the corporation.

Arthur Hucksake · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:07

pepsilol said:
I think it should be kicked up to work Monday to Saturday. No one really needs a 2 days off. Or at least make Sat an official workday from 9-1

For school we went Mon-Sat and didn't do us any harm.

lol... Everyone will be quitting work just to see their kids at some point in their childhoods.

Lightnix · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:08

Stretch said:
Actually not really. Since we're not based in one of the major global capital cities, we are currently considered cheaper than the equivalent quality found elsewhere in the corporation.

That's an interesting position to be in. Still though, the value of the worker is not dependent on how long they're spent sat down in the office. It's only really problematic if it really slows you down which some accounts show is not the case.

Caged · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:09

With a four day week that means I'd have to be in the pub from Wednesday afternoon, and I don't think I could handle that.

Lightnix · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:11

Caged said:
With a four day week that means I'd have to be in the pub from Wednesday afternoon, and I don't think I could handle that.

See? It also saves the pubs!

DirtyJester · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:18

AS_Platinum said:
Git

Take comfort in the fact I work my fair share of weekends

That said, in any given year I only work 154 shifts

adolf hamster · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:23

Technology is being used simply to keep businesses afloat and competitive in the international market, i agree how it should work is that the more we cut workers out of the equation that overall there should simply be a net rise in skilled labour accomponied by the salary and working hour benefits that go with that.

Thing is, thats not always how it works, company i work for is about as automated as industry can get and whilst yes about half of us are degree level office workers there's still a massive number of shop floor production staff putting in 12 hour shifts. The reason being is there are some things that just cant be automated yet, and human labour is the only alternative.

Stev · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:30

this is all well and good till you get to an industry you expect to be open 7 days a week (i.e catering) you now have to hire an additional member of staff for the same amount of work to be done reducing your profits, or reducing the money each member of staff gets to work it out.

Rroff · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:36

Stev said:
this is all well and good till you get to an industry you expect to be open 7 days a week (i.e catering) you now have to hire an additional member of staff for the same amount of work to be done reducing your profits, or reducing the money each member of staff gets to work it out.

Yeah always a problem with some industries but I think its more the idea of that some find insurmountable rather than the actual long term running and finances of it - none the least for some companies they could look at how those kind of changes would allow them to exploit other sources of revenue, etc.

One thing we found was that there were people who'd happily take a small reduction in pay/hours for the extra flexibility and some who'd happily take on all the extra hours and pay available which helped balance it out.

I think it is telling though that some parts of the world manage to work a good bit less hours and still remain as productive as other parts of the world where long hours have become a culture.

Lightnix · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:40

Stev said:
this is all well and good till you get to an industry you expect to be open 7 days a week (i.e catering) you now have to hire an additional member of staff for the same amount of work to be done reducing your profits, or reducing the money each member of staff gets to work it out.

I'd say in some respects that's also a benefit. I was reading something earlier and they had an expression to the effect of "some of the population can't find a job and the rest are being overworked." This is particularly true for low skilled positions which is where jobs are drying up the fastest.

D.P. · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:45

Lightnix said:
I'd say in some respects that's also a benefit. I was reading something earlier and they had an expression to the effect of "some of the population can't find a job and the rest are being overworked." This is particularly true for low skilled positions which is where jobs are drying up the fastest.

This is true but the overheads of hiring additional staff makes it unfeasible unless people accept lower salaries.

If a company has 4000 hours of work to do in a week it is much cheaper to hire 100 people to do 40 hour weeks than 125 people to do 32 hour 4 day weeks. So not only will you earn 20% less for reduced hours you will have to have an even lower salary so make up for the extra overheads. So now you have a 30% pay cut and work 4 days a week.For most people that simply isn't affordable.

Lopéz · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:46

I'm working with some Americans at the moment, and the concept of "working hours" is lost on them - the way they see it, if you earn a salary, you work until the work is done. If you want to clock off at 5:00 on the dot, go and get a job in a factory or a warehouse.

It's already creating a cultural clash trying to "force" that mindset onto UK employees.

UTmaniac · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:47

The future is 30 hour, 4-day working weeks. Plus birth control, to reduce the population of the UK and reduce family expenses.

Everrr · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:49

esoteric said:
My place does Mon-Thu 0730-1630 and 0730-1330 on, Friday. It's a system I really like because it leaves time for appointments and such. I do my shopping on, Fridays and it's easier and quicker early afternoon then after 1630.

I'm a frequent overtime worker too, so a lot of the time I do 0730-1800. I would happily do 10hrs over 4 days and have a 3 day weekend and it would be easy to adjust too. My company is in a position to make this change but it has to be all in or not at all. In my department a lot of people only focus on certain tasks, for example I do all the welding so I can't not be there during official hours.

I have the early Fri finish under a different arrangement - core hours 0900-1600 Mon-Thu, 0900-1200 Fri. As long as I do 40 hrs a week (excl. lunch of course) and I'm there during those hours, the rest is up to me. So it'd be easy to adjust to a 4 day week and I'd welcome it, but it won't happen.

M1k3H · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:49

D.P. said:
This is true but the overheads of hiring additional staff makes it unfeasible unless people accept lower salaries.

If a company has 4000 hours of work to do in a week it is much cheaper to hire 100 people to do 40 hour weeks than 125 people to do 32 hour 4 day weeks. So not only will you earn 20% less for reduced hours you will have to have an even lower salary so make up for the extra overheads. So now you have a 30% pay cut and work 4 days a week.For most people that simply isn't affordable.

What happens if one of them gets sick? Or goes on holiday?

Any sane company would hire the 125 to make sure they cover holidays/sickness and also add flexibility if workload increases.

Lightnix · 15 Sep 2015 at 20:56

D.P. said:
This is true but the overheads of hiring additional staff makes it unfeasible unless people accept lower salaries.

If a company has 4000 hours of work to do in a week it is much cheaper to hire 100 people to do 40 hour weeks than 125 people to do 32 hour 4 day weeks. So not only will you earn 20% less for reduced hours you will have to have an even lower salary so make up for the extra overheads. So now you have a 30% pay cut and work 4 days a week.For most people that simply isn't affordable.

Well, frankly I think those companies should foot the bill. Does it make it harder to do business? Sure, for already successful companies who can afford to take on staff. The flip side is that it gives individuals who want to indulge their entrepreneurial side a massive edge. I'm not too sorry about any businesses that would sink because they rely on what I believe are unfair working hours.

Rroff · 15 Sep 2015 at 21:24

M1k3H said:
What happens if one of them gets sick? Or goes on holiday?

Any sane company would hire the 125 to make sure they cover holidays/sickness and also add flexibility if workload increases.

Most companies have as little over for coverage as they can get away with and more or less expect the staff in general to absorb the workload when someone is off on holiday or sick.

Where I work we do atleast get paid extra for doing extra hours to cover holiday/sickness even if salaried who wouldn't normally get paid for extra hours that were considered part of their job.