Abortion/termination - anyone ever had one?

LeeUK · 23 Sep 2015 at 17:44

Does she have a career? Does she work? If not, she probably planned it. I know lots of lasses who push out new kids when the last one nears school age so they are not forced to give up benefits and enter the world of work.

413x · 23 Sep 2015 at 17:50

First.

Ugh, the people who are coming in worrying about everyone else for selfish reasons. Don't discuss abortion etc etc

In topic
I had years to see that the relationship wasnt how it should be but I stayed in and blinkered myself. Amazing what you don't see. Thanks for your concern. In a way I was doing what she could be doing, (in my head I was) trying to keep something I wasnt sure was there. My ex is more like you, staying in it even though deep down she was somewhere between wanting out and being unsure, please for her sake, don't stay with her if you don't really want it.

What you said does signal warning bells
It is possible this was in some way (maybe even subconscious) a way of keeping you.
Absolutely the wrong thing, but worth thinking about. Especially if she is aware you and her are not in the same page.
Although that last part was said in tiredness. Did the tiredness cause her to say something she didn't mean.. Or.. Let her guard down and say what she is thinking.

I don't think this is about the baby actually
It seems about you two

Just hope she isn't the sort to have 'planned' this
She sounds controlling from the little things you said. This could (could) be used as more control
I really hope that isn't the case.

Vita · 23 Sep 2015 at 17:51

I thought I'd pop into this thread as being in a hospital does get to you after a while. Having lost my first born son after trying for a time which seemed quite long we were happy with my wife becoming pregnant. I waited 9 months only to then be left empty handed. Do I have something to show for it? Of course, will I get to keep him? Only in my memories. That's the hardest part. Knowing you had something dear to you only to be taken away, not because you wanted it, not because it could have been stopped, because that's what God had planned and fate brought upon you.

I'm 27, work full time, I have career ambitions and a ton of responsibilities. I work 13-14 hours days on the most part, I go above and beyond at work even when not needed. Would I have put that all aside to raise a child with a good upbringing and to make a difference in this world, I definitely would have.

It's hard for you, I totally understand. But you could put them on hold, work for a while even claim off the state if needed and once comfortable chase your ambitions. I would never ever go with abortion it was meant to be for your partner to become pregnant.

Put yourself in the position if your parents had aborted you?

Please really think deep down, speak to your family your partner and do what's best for the baby. Don't lose it a baby will change your world and your views of it even if does enter the world sleeping just as mine has. If you could fight the cause which caused it you would. As you would never ever ever want it go.

OhEsEcks · 23 Sep 2015 at 17:55

Vita said:
Put yourself in the position if your parents had aborted you?

You'd be dead. So it has no relevance. Appeal to emotion fallacy.

Spuddy · 23 Sep 2015 at 17:56

Curio said:
Even taking into account the fact her head is probably spinning right now, that's beyond unreasonable. I don't know why you would even consider a future with somebody like that. However, give her the benefit of the doubt and have a lengthy talk about it. Maybe she's just losing her mind a little with the mavity of the situation.

Yes it was very unreasonable to say the least, especially considering my animals as I've had some of them since I was 10 years old, they're part of the family so to speak and I cant just get rid of them.

Uriel said:
I personally wouldn't out of choice. It's partly a religious thing - a sense that human life is espacially sacred and precious. Aside from that it's kind of difficult to objectively pinpoint the time at which a human life begins and I'd rather err a long way on the side of caution.

But that's out of choice. As I said in the other thread that's been mentioned I found myself in the unfortunate position of dealing with the missus' ectopic pregnancy. This was probably around 7 weeks I think. Thankfully after a bit of google-fu I conviinced her that the symptoms she was getting (shoulder pain) might be an ectopic pregnancy. She went to the internet and agreed it was worth checking out. We went to hospital as a precaution, she was taken in overnight for observation and I took our 2yo home for the night. The next morning it got serious. Fallopain tube ruptured. According to the surgeon she lost about 2 litres of blood but thankfully she was in hospital and they operated and gave her a blood transfusion immediately. We didn't even really understand what was happening until the surgeon was telling us afterwards.

So we didn't have much of a choice. Do I regret it? Of course not. Thanks to the swift actions of the hospital staff my missus survived and the alternative was losing both her and the baby. I do wonder what that little person might have been like, had they had the chance but overall I'm glad at the outcome. I don't find myself mourning for them or anything. Would I ever consider an abortion out of choice? No - my own previous convictions have been utterly reinforced by having my own two kids - and seeing them via scans relatively early into the pregnancies.

We saw our youngest son at 7 weeks via an early scan because of the earlier ectopic pregnancy. My gut feeling at the time was I was looking a who, rather than an it - not a fully formed person by any means but neither is a newborn baby. I'm glad to have got to know him. He's about to turn 3 soon. If I could talk to myself before I became a dad, I don't think I could adequately describe the way I love either of my kids to my former self. Prior to my first son being born I wasn't sure that I was ready to be a dad but when he was born I was certainly very happy to have him.

But I don't think the talk of murder or child-killing helps anyone. This is a serious business and mud slinging isn't going to convince anyone either way. My gut feeling is that if the OP's GF wants to keep it, he can express his preference but he doesn't get the final say (same the other way round). If she keeps it, he'll hopefully get to chose how much involvement he's going to have in the kid's life.

I don't fall neatly into pro-life or pro-choice. I think abortion is always a tradjedy. Sometimes it can be a tragic necessity and explaining why is often complex.

Sorry for you loss but Im glad your wife made a full recovery, when we first found out the GF did worry about ectopic pregnancy as she was having lower abdomen pain on one side for a few days but this seems to have disappeared and she has not mentioned it anymore.

Currently Im not viewing it as a 'who' Im viewing it as a 'potential who' as they resemble nothing like that of a human in my mind, just being a cluster of cells currently. Some people may view that as wrong but thats just my views on it, however once it develops and gains limbs, a head, a heartbeat - Im not so sure I could even consider an abortion as then to me, thats a tiny little person right there.

Scottland said:
She might be a little defensive if she's been burned in the past (i.e. by her 4yo's father) hence why she wants things on her terms. But you need to help her understand that it's supposed to be a partnership and both of you need to be happy or it won't work.

The most important decision should be based upon the relationship, not necessarily the financial implications. You'll both have to make some sacrifices and compromises - if she won't budge then it doesn't bode well for the future but it's better to know that now rather than suffer an unhappy relationship for the sake of the kid(s).

Yeah he burned her pretty bad, only 2 months after the child was born he went to go work away and consequently ended up moving in with another woman and having an affair for the next 8 months behind her back...

Currently with what she's said it feels like Im entering into her dictatorship, not an equal partnership. I wouldn't be happy with what she's proposed, I don't want my life to be miserable for the sake of the kids you're right.

LeeUK said:
Does she have a career? Does she work? If not, she probably planned it. I know lots of lasses who push out new kids when the last one nears school age so they are not forced to give up benefits and enter the world of work.

Yes she has a pretty good job actually. She's a post-operative staff nurse. I don't think it was planned, at least I hope its not as she's betrayed me if thats the case as this was never our plan..

413x · 23 Sep 2015 at 18:01

Missed a few bits

I've changed my mind.
If she is saying what you're saying (animals etc) it seems like she isn't giving anything and wants it all
With this baby she now may feel she can say this, because you can't so easily run

Even if this isn't true, it's sounding like you don't want what she wants.
I don't blame you, you don't seem to be getting anything you want, and expected to give almost everything up

Entirely my opinion, but I think I'd rather foot the bill than compromise add much add she wants

Scottland · 23 Sep 2015 at 18:05

Spuddy said:
Yeah he burned her pretty bad, only 2 months after the child was born he went to go work away and consequently ended up moving in with another woman and having an affair for the next 8 months behind her back...

Currently with what she's said it feels like Im entering into her dictatorship, not an equal partnership. I wouldn't be happy with what she's proposed, I don't want my life to be miserable for the sake of the kids you're right.

To be honest, you may find that telling her you want it to be a partnership etc may allay some of her fears and allow a better conversation about it. If she's got her guard up it's going to be much harder.

josh_sheffield · 23 Sep 2015 at 18:12

It seems unreasonable that she expects you to graduate and get a job and forget about postgrad. I would look into the figures. It might actually be beneficial to stay in education. I had a tax free stipend of £14k, averaged about 2k worth of teaching and worked part time pulling in another 5k. Plus my income for tax credits assessment was only the 7k so we got a bit of help from tax credits. Also depending on your subject and work group you could be really flexible. If she does decide to keep the baby don't let it stop you from doing what you wanted to with you're life!

Rroff · 23 Sep 2015 at 18:19

Sorry skipped through the thread without reading most of it but this made me think:

Spuddy said:
I don't think now is the right time for me to become a dad

I have never met anyone (and I've met a few) who has considered this aspect and then gone ahead with it and regretted it (and quite a few who wonder afterwards how they could have ever even considered it).

Spuddy · 23 Sep 2015 at 18:20

Vita said:
I thought I'd pop into this thread as being in a hospital does get to you after a while. Having lost my first born son after trying for a time which seemed quite long we were happy with my wife becoming pregnant. I waited 9 months only to then be left empty handed. Do I have something to show for it? Of course, will I get to keep him? Only in my memories. That's the hardest part. Knowing you had something dear to you only to be taken away, not because you wanted it, not because it could have been stopped, because that's what God had planned and fate brought upon you.

I'm 27, work full time, I have career ambitions and a ton of responsibilities. I work 13-14 hours days on the most part, I go above and beyond at work even when not needed. Would I have put that all aside to raise a child with a good upbringing and to make a difference in this world, I definitely would have.

It's hard for you, I totally understand. But you could put them on hold, work for a while even claim off the state if needed and once comfortable chase your ambitions. I would never ever go with abortion it was meant to be for your partner to become pregnant.

Put yourself in the position if your parents had aborted you?

Please really think deep down, speak to your family your partner and do what's best for the baby. Don't lose it a baby will change your world and your views of it even if does enter the world sleeping just as mine has. If you could fight the cause which caused it you would. As you would never ever ever want it go.

I am so sorry for your loss, these words probably mean nothing to you at this difficult time as I imagine your heart is broken.

This decision wouldn't be so hard or such a negative one (abortion) if I felt more comfortable in my relationship to alleviate some of my worries and fears. I don't want to become trapped in a relationship because of a baby when I don't feel ready to be 100% committed to this person (the mother).

I'm now single al4x said:
First.

Ugh, the people who are coming in worrying about everyone else for selfish reasons. Don't discuss abortion etc etc

In topic
I had years to see that the relationship wasnt how it should be but I stayed in and blinkered myself. Amazing what you don't see. Thanks for your concern. In a way I was doing what she could be doing, (in my head I was) trying to keep something I wasnt sure was there. My ex is more like you, staying in it even though deep down she was somewhere between wanting out and being unsure, please for her sake, don't stay with her if you don't really want it.

What you said does signal warning bells
It is possible this was in some way (maybe even subconscious) a way of keeping you.
Absolutely the wrong thing, but worth thinking about. Especially if she is aware you and her are not in the same page.
Although that last part was said in tiredness. Did the tiredness cause her to say something she didn't mean.. Or.. Let her guard down and say what she is thinking.

I don't think this is about the baby actually
It seems about you two

Just hope she isn't the sort to have 'planned' this
She sounds controlling from the little things you said. This could (could) be used as more control
I really hope that isn't the case.

I'm now single al4x said:
Missed a few bits

I've changed my mind.
If she is saying what you're saying (animals etc) it seems like she isn't giving anything and wants it all
With this baby she now may feel she can say this, because you can't so easily run

Even if this isn't true, it's sounding like you don't want what she wants.
I don't blame you, you don't seem to be getting anything you want, and expected to give almost everything up

Entirely my opinion, but I think I'd rather foot the bill than compromise add much add she wants

Foot the bill as in let her have the baby?

I guess she is controlling to a certain extent, she is the jealous type but she has been trying to work on that and Ive been giving her the benefit of the doubt as she blames her last husband for the way she thinks now...

Yes, it does certainly feel as if Im having to give almost everything up, you could argue that I would also be gaining something so very precious but... at what cost? My happiness?

I feel like the only possible way this could work currently if if we both lived separately whilst having this baby and she has to learn to compromise a little and in time this could work as a family scenario, but not right now...

I don't think she would entertain that however. She's stubborn.

Scottland said:
To be honest, you may find that telling her you want it to be a partnership etc may allay some of her fears and allow a better conversation about it. If she's got her guard up it's going to be much harder.

Thanks, I did try to convey that to her the other night but emotions were running high. I will try again however.

D.P. · 23 Sep 2015 at 18:26

I'M strongly pro-abortion but to me I think you just need to accept that what is done is done and plan your new life as a father. It wont necessarily interrupt your career, very common to be a parent and do a PhD.

413x · 23 Sep 2015 at 18:38

Spuddy said:
I am so sorry for your loss, these words probably mean nothing to you at this difficult time as I imagine your heart is broken.

This decision wouldn't be so hard or such a negative one (abortion) if I felt more comfortable in my relationship to alleviate some of my worries and fears. I don't want to become trapped in a relationship because of a baby when I don't feel ready to be 100% committed to this person (the mother).

Foot the bill as in let her have the baby?

I guess she is controlling to a certain extent, she is the jealous type but she has been trying to work on that and Ive been giving her the benefit of the doubt as she blames her last husband for the way she thinks now...

Yes, it does certainly feel as if Im having to give almost everything up, you could argue that I would also be gaining something so very precious but... at what cost? My happiness?

I feel like the only possible way this could work currently if if we both lived separately whilst having this baby and she has to learn to compromise a little and in time this could work as a family scenario, but not right now...

I don't think she would entertain that however. She's stubborn.

Thanks, I did try to convey that to her the other night but emotions were running high. I will try again however.

I would say a proviso of living together is compromise. Especially anything you have already. For me, giving up a pet, or not having a desk, that's too much. And accepting it would be a slippery slope to me.
Those aren't difficult things for her to compromise on if she really does want you two to work.

Yes you would be gaining a child, but you shouldn't have to give everything up for that.
It needs a proper discussion where you both discuss boundaries, and compromises. I really don't think you should have or that it will help of you let her call the shots

koolpc · 23 Sep 2015 at 18:43

Once you have a child, you would give everything up for that child! Even your life! Believe me!

Spuddy · 23 Sep 2015 at 18:43

Rroff said:
Sorry skipped through the thread without reading most of it but this made me think:

I have never met anyone (and I've met a few) who has considered this aspect and then gone ahead with it and regretted it (and quite a few who wonder afterwards how they could have ever even considered it).

Any of them not with the mother at time of birth? I don't imagine I will regret the child once it is already here (if we decide to keep the baby).

D.P. said:
I'M strongly pro-abortion but to me I think you just need to accept that what is done is done and plan your new life as a father. It wont necessarily interrupt your career, very common to be a parent and do a PhD.

Thanks for the input, can i ask why you think that?

Whether I'll be a single father doing a PhD or not is still yet to be determined.

phonemonkey · 23 Sep 2015 at 18:43

I understand what a difficult decision the 2 of you have to make, and I also respect your desire to do the right thing.

I think, before you speak to your girlfriend again you probably need to be clearer in your mind about whether are prepared to move in on the currently offered terms, and whether (if you're not) you wish to continue with the relationship.

Being honest with her is the best thing you can do. Knowing where you stand, and what she can expect from you, if she keeps the baby (or doesn't) may influence her final decision and is probably the most help you can be right now.

Uther · 23 Sep 2015 at 18:47

I think this thread is badly timed, but having said that...
I am very much pro choice, but you should be aware that waiting until later in life to try for a child might not work out.
Not an easy decision, but a very personal one.

Spuddy · 23 Sep 2015 at 18:48

I'm now single al4x said:
I would say a proviso of living together is compromise. Especially anything you have already. For me, giving up a pet, or not having a desk, that's too much. And accepting it would be a slippery slope to me.
Those aren't difficult things for her to compromise on if she really does want you two to work.

Yes you would be gaining a child, but you shouldn't have to give everything up for that.
It needs a proper discussion where you both discuss boundaries, and compromises. I really don't think you should have or that it will help of you let her call the shots

Thanks, me and you seem to see things the same in this situation. I asked her why she couldn't compromise and because its HER house was her answer and she *needs* a guest bed apparently.

I don't want to let her win (in terms of compromising, not necessarily the baby) as I agree, it would be a slippery slope and family have also agreed this. What would my life be like in 5 years? Miserable probably, probably even sooner than that.

koolpc said:
Once you have a child, you would give everything up for that child! Even your life! Believe me!

I do believe you, 100%. However in my eyes, there currently is no child to give everything up for (yet).

pioneer2000 · 23 Sep 2015 at 18:49

1) You don't have a choice here, she's almost guaranteed to force you to be a father.

2) Sounds like she wasn't really on contraception.

413x · 23 Sep 2015 at 18:54

Spuddy said:
Thanks, me and you seem to see things the same in this situation. I asked her why she couldn't compromise and because its HER house was her answer and she *needs* a guest bed apparently.

I don't want to let her win (in terms of compromising, not necessarily the baby) as I agree, it would be a slippery slope and family have also agreed this. What would my life be like in 5 years? Miserable probably, probably even sooner than that.

I do believe you, 100%. However in my eyes, there currently is no child to give everything up for (yet).

And if you let her Win, and your mind sees it as her 'winning', it could very well lead to resentment.. Never a good thing.
Definitely be clear what you will and won't compromise on, stand your ground

I suppose it may come down to what you do if she won't
Would you rather

Give in and be in the relationship
Or
Be distant but retain what you wanted before the pregnancy minus the relationship

Hopefully she does compromise, but think about what you will do if she won't
Sounds like a big part of the problem is she sees the house thing as doing you a favour.. She let's you live in her house,.. You do as she says.

CREATIVE!11 · 23 Sep 2015 at 19:00

Want my honest brutal answer?

If it was me i'd terminate, only because bringing a child into a situation where you are at uni etc presume you are a young man and want to experience things means you are tied down for 18 years. Also legally you'll be stuck to child support payments whatever happens. I only believe in bringing a child into this world under the correct conditions where both parents want them and they are financially able to care for them.

My friend same age has knocked his gf up recently. RIP to him because he didn't want the kid, she's decided to keep it so gg life.

Would be a big no no for me. I'm 28 for reference.

Edit: Upon reading your age OP and how long you've been together the advice above I stand by more so. Burnsy has been the voice of reason in this thread.