Hajj pligrimage crush

Metallifux · 24 Sep 2015 at 09:43

http://news.sky.com/story/1558034/hajj-pilgrimage-150-people-die-in-crush

Every year, they never learn.

Terminal_Boy · 24 Sep 2015 at 09:48

If someone truly believes that everything which happens is God's will, events like this must be a head scratcher.

Sankari · 24 Sep 2015 at 09:51

You'd think that by this stage Muslims would know how to queue.

Uther · 24 Sep 2015 at 09:51

Same sort of death toll every year isn't it? Must be a fun day out

Thekwango · 24 Sep 2015 at 09:58

to pour scorn on those following their faith? to poke fun at those so blinded by that faith that they crush each other in a stampede?

don't know to be honest - just guessing

Metallifux · 24 Sep 2015 at 10:04

Thekwango said:
to pour scorn on those following their faith? to poke fun at those so blinded by that faith that they crush each other in a stampede?

don't know to be honest - just guessing

Scorn, yeah people of faith deserve some scorn. Poke fun, no, point out that it happens every year and the authorities still do nothing about it, yeah, maybe that.

Sankari · 24 Sep 2015 at 10:06

Uther said:
Same sort of death toll every year isn't it? Must be a fun day out

They love it really. Death and religion, it's what the Middle East is all about.

Buddy · 24 Sep 2015 at 10:12

Saudi could probably get some advice from Iraq. Arbaeen regularly has 20million pilgrims (Hajj around 3m) and from a quick googling couldn't find any stampede events.

Doubt they will. Saudi too busy supporting isis, commercialising mecca and destroying religious sites

Crpwned · 24 Sep 2015 at 10:34

220 people die in a crush on a pilgramage, no sympathy here it seems.
96 people die in a crush at a football match and everyone goes nuts!

I despair.

Dis86 · 24 Sep 2015 at 10:37

Lessons were learned from Hillsborough and it's never happened again.
This happens every frigging year without fail

Thekwango · 24 Sep 2015 at 10:48

Dis86 said:
Lessons were learned from Hillsborough and it's never happened again.
This happens every frigging year without fail

but the only reason it has never happened again is because there are security and safety measures in place.

sadly for these people they are not afforded such measures.

edit: whats with the post deletes? didn't think I'd posted anything untoward or offensive huddy?

dl8860 · 24 Sep 2015 at 10:52

Thekwango said:
but the only reason it has never happened again is because there are security and safety measures in place.

sadly for these people they are not afforded such measures.

Or they are stupid enough to dive in, when surely the dangers must be widely known?

MookJong · 24 Sep 2015 at 10:54

Evangelion said:
You'd think that by this stage Muslims would know how to queue.

I was on holiday in Austria this year at a resort very popular with Muslim families from UAE and Kuwait. Queuing is just not something that comes naturally to many people from this region. I lost count the number of times I saw people just push in and the Austrians don't like it all. A street vendor selling Nutella pancakes went absolutely ballistic one night with the general inability to just queue and wait.

It was the same when we visited some attractions like the summer toboggan. There is a long queue for the ticket desk and a large family from the Middle East would arrive and march to the front and try and get served!

Stretch · 24 Sep 2015 at 10:55

Uther said:
Same sort of death toll every year isn't it? Must be a fun day out

It's uncommon.

It's like football in the 80s. Maybe Islam should be be banned from international competitions until they learn to control their fans

steve_c · 24 Sep 2015 at 10:58

I went to the border crossing once between India & Pakistan.

The Waggah border ceremony is very popular and everyone pushes up to a metal gate so they get the best chance to get to the front of the stands.

It's completely terrifying once it opens. The police have to hit people with sticks to slow them down.

Once they get to the stands, the push to get in is nothing short of pandemonium. People literally getting crushed at the bottlenecks.

Queuing is a completely foreign notion. Must have been a truly awful experience for everyone involved.

Thekwango · 24 Sep 2015 at 11:07

dl8860 said:
Or they are stupid enough to dive in, when surely the dangers must be widely known?

most likely mob mentality and all that. common sense goes out the window - probably not fair simply putting it down to stupidity

Skidder · 24 Sep 2015 at 11:21

Very sad that this happens.

Zogger · 24 Sep 2015 at 11:22

Metallifux said:
http://news.sky.com/story/1558034/hajj-pilgrimage-150-people-die-in-crush

Every year, they never learn.

How is this every year? The last one was in 2006

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incidents_during_the_Hajj

Thekwango said:
sadly for these people they are not afforded such measures.

Following the 2006 incident, the Jamaraat Bridge and the pillars representing Satan were demolished and reconstructed. A wider, multi-level bridge was built, and massive columns replaced the pillars themselves. Now, each level of the bridge allows easier and safer access to the columns representing Satan. The picture to the right shows a view of one level post-construction. It was taken the year after the 2006 incident. In addition, the stoning ceremony must be carried out according to pre-determined schedules to prevent over-crowding and the attendant risks. The Jamarat basin has been expanded from its current circular shape into an oval to allow better access to the pillars. The new arrangements provide for separate access and departure routes.

Clearly they could do more but some people just guess at facts...

Freefaller · 24 Sep 2015 at 11:32

Crpwned said:
220 people die in a crush on a pilgramage, no sympathy here it seems.
96 people die in a crush at a football match and everyone goes nuts!

I despair.

Sad isn't it? Just because it's based around something that a lot of people disagree with or do not understand or do not care about it's fine to poke fun.

Poke fun at the Hillsborough disaster or anything local and you're considered scum and heartless.

People like to be offensive with things regarding religion or things that people don't agree with, rather than doing the human thing and feeling sad for the death of hundreds of people, and suggesting ways to prevent it from happening again.

Criticising the lack of improvement at controlling crowds surrounding the Hajj pilgrimage and the organisation for dealing with it is perfectly justified - criticising religion or the people is not. Criticise the people in charge, criticise the lack of pedestrian control, and people flow - that's what the issue is here.

Let us have some empathy and a bit of compassion please.

Thekwango · 24 Sep 2015 at 11:35

Zogger said:
Clearly they could do more but some people just guess at facts...

quite right you are I did indeed guess - apologies.

I didn't realise that work had been done to try and make the whole thing safer