Cameron's housing plans

[Tefal]

Tories plan

STAGE 1 – Purge on the benefit users – COMPLETE
STAGE 2 – Purge on the low paid: “Operation make the country think they’re scum and draining our society.” Make people say “they should better education themselves them”. ENGAGED
STAGE 3 – Purge on the middle class.

So they've "purged" the benefits users? why do we still have benefits users?

purge on the low paid? where are they going?

purge on the middle class? so who's going to work?


so basically you're saying the Tories plan is to reduce the population down to about 5 million people?

 

[bloodiedathame]

So they've "purged" the benefits users? why do we still have benefits users?

purge on the low paid? where are they going?

purge on the middle class? so who's going to work?


so basically you're saying the Tories plan is to reduce the population down to about 5 million people?

Housing shortage solved.

 

[Jono]

More like £55k to £60k as they tend to work 45 hrs or more each week.

People see it as a hard work, dirty outside job.

Yes, even up North you can easily earn £40k to £50k per annum as a good skilled worker in construction.

People still dont want to leave school and work in that industry.

Hell, even the managerial office based people are harder to find. We have had a 23 year old apply to the company with barely any experience and he wants £52k a year as a starting wage plus bonus.

Please can I have a job? I have 2 weeks' construction experience. But I'm good with my hands.

 

[balky12]

Housing shortage solved.

Have to start demolishing houses for graveyards.

 

[dowie]

Alright, if you wish to continue down the tedious pedant route then I actually said there was a need for landlords, which was correct.

nothing pedantic about it - like I've already pointed out it completely changes what you were trying to say, you objected to me saying there was a need for BTL landlords by making that ambiguous statement when it turns out what you actually wanted to say was that there are too many - that in itself doesn't even contradict my statement in the first place...

 

[Greebo]

Well that's the price to pay for accepting a job in an area you can't afford to live.

You would rather there be no landlords? So you can't take the job you really want because you can't afford to own a house there?

Or you want everything? Better paid job in a cheap area? If the area and jobs are that much more desirable demand for housing will still exist.. Pushing prices up.

So basically you are saying when the house prices get high enough that you cant afford to stay in the area you were born and work you have to move to other areas where the housing is cheaper? Just like what is happening where I live.

No young people or families any more, then the local schools close as there are not enough kids, then shops close and pubs close and then there is nothing left but "rich" people living in their retirement homes.

And are there any areas left? I saw the map thing of where you can buy Camerons new affordable homes on the living wage and there were two small areas of england where you could afford it.

Then there's the last problem. SO you move somewhere where the houses are cheaper which you could afford on your old wage but then find that in that area your wages are less and you still can't afford it.

 

[antijoke]

Talking about BTL, it's common knowledge here (I spoke to someone at a development last year) that BTL landlords know they can easily rent properties out at whatever cost so as soon as they are available to buy off plan they snap them up (cheaply because they are off plan) then simply put them for rent at a high cost when they are ready.

Rinse and repeat.

The only way house prices will be lower is if you build literally millions of homes everywhere, and put a lot of noses out of joint by doing that. You literally would have to flood the market, not build 200,000 across the country. It isn't going to happen.

I expect the vast majority of homes will either be passed on to family when people die (and lived in for x amount of years or sold) or the money from the death of grandparents/parents etc will be used as deposits for houses.

 

[Tefal]

So basically you are saying when the house prices get high enough that you cant afford to stay in the area you were born and work you have to move to other areas where the housing is cheaper? Just like what is happening where I live.

No young people or families any more, then the local schools close as there are not enough kids, then shops close and pubs close and then there is nothing left but "rich" people living in their retirement homes.

and then they die and the house prices fall and people move back and on and on the cycle goes.

 

[Scam]

Talking about BTL, it's common knowledge here (I spoke to someone at a development last year) that BTL landlords know they can easily rent properties out at whatever cost so as soon as they are available to buy off plan they snap them up (cheaply because they are off plan) then simply put them for rent at a high cost when they are ready.

Rinse and repeat.

Yep. Those who won the housing lottery have enough capital to literally 'rinse' everyone else. I really hope they all get their comeuppance soon enough when rates rise and house prices fall. Once all the foreign investors start losing money on their pie-in-the-sky new builds they won't be able to sell fast enough. It's going to be horrific for those BTL landlords that jumped on the bandwagon too late and are mortgaged up to their eyeballs. I can't wait.

Also, any new development I end up looking at (for funsies, obviously) I love to go in and argue with them about how many are already sold off-plan. And to who. And how do they know if they are going to live there or just let it out. Etc..

 

[balky12]

Not everyone rents in an area so why would an area have no children?!

But yes, I can't afford to live where I have lived all my life. I also can't afford to live near where I work. So could rent close to work, or close to where I live now.

Instead I saved up enough to move further out and own my own house. The downside is the £3k (£6k if u include partner) train fare a year and 40 minute journey each way. Upside is I am close to owning my own 3 bed house.

Where I live currently is mega expensive. Plenty of families and schools. A lot of old people too. However it's a very pleasant place to live. (Upminster)

 

[Greebo]

and then they die and the house prices fall and people move back and on and on the cycle goes.

Nope, the new retirement people move into these houses. Will eventually catch up when the generation exists who haven't bought a house and hence cant sell up and buy something cheaper in the countryside and then the market value of these homes drop.

And never mind BTL landlords. There are now about 20 of the small, cheaper houses in our village have been bought and rented out as holiday lets.

 

[Greebo]

Not everyone rents in an area so why would an area have no children?!

This is my area where all the available housing get bought by people who are retired and hence no children.

The younger people rent but normally move away to get better paid jobs so they can buy a house and live with their family.

A 3 bedroom house is around £250k where i live but the local wages for most jobs is £20k to £25k tops.

Like i said, back in 1999 £95k would have got you a 4 bedroom house.

 

[Tefal]

Nope, the new retirement people move into these houses. Will eventually catch up when the generation exists who haven't bought a house and hence cant sell up and buy something cheaper in the countryside and then the market value of these homes drop.

And never mind BTL landlords. There are now about 20 of the small, cheaper houses in our village have been bought and rented out as holiday lets.

so all these retired folk who moved there they never owned a house before then?

cause all you're talking about is simply populations moving around.

 

[dowie]

Yep. Those who won the housing lottery have enough capital to literally 'rinse' everyone else. I really hope they all get their comeuppance soon enough when rates rise and house prices fall. Once all the foreign investors start losing money on their pie-in-the-sky new builds they won't be able to sell fast enough. It's going to be horrific for those BTL landlords that jumped on the bandwagon too late and are mortgaged up to their eyeballs. I can't wait.

the sort of properties foreign buyers go for are still going to be very much in demand even with a few rate rises - prime locations in Central London are expensive to develop in and will have plenty of demand for the foreseeable future

Also, any new development I end up looking at (for funsies, obviously) I love to go in and argue with them about how many are already sold off-plan. And to who. And how do they know if they are going to live there or just let it out. Etc..

why would they care?

If you want to limit foreign investment in property you need the govt to step in

 

[balky12]

This is my area where all the available housing get bought by people who are retired and hence no children.

The younger people rent but normally move away to get better paid jobs so they can buy a house and live with their family.

A 3 bedroom house is around £250k where i live but the local wages for most jobs is £20k to £25k tops.

Like i said, back in 1999 £95k would have got you a 4 bedroom house.

Back in 1950 it would have cost £3k!

Where I hope to get my house prices are similar and wages I guess similar. That's why I stomach the £3k travel fare and 40 minute journey each way to increase earning potential.

 

[Greebo]

so all these retired folk who moved there they never owned a house before then?

cause all you're talking about is simply populations moving around.

Yes they have. They sell it for loads of money and move to the country where its cheaper. What's your point?

They are still absorbing all the available housing stock and removing them from local workers and driving prices sky high.

Don't get me started about 2nd holiday homes. There are some places where almost 50% of the house are second homes and only occupied for weekends or the odd weeks during a year.

 

[dowie]

Nope, the new retirement people move into these houses. Will eventually catch up when the generation exists who haven't bought a house and hence cant sell up and buy something cheaper in the countryside and then the market value of these homes drop.

And never mind BTL landlords. There are now about 20 of the small, cheaper houses in our village have been bought and rented out as holiday lets.

So retired people move to the countryside and people growing up in the countryside mostly need to get jobs in a big city if they want to earn a decent wage? (well aside from perhaps the local GP, Vet and some farmers) Seems pretty normal at the moment.

Maybe working from home will change this in future, in fact that could easily ease the pressure on housing in the South East too.

 

[balky12]

They are still absorbing all the available housing stock and removing them from local workers and driving prices sky high.

Where are these local workers living prior to the pensioner invasion? Being a local worker implies they already living locally? So how would a pensioner moving in to the area drive these local workers out?

 

[Greebo]

Where are these local workers living prior to the pensioner invasion? Being a local worker implies they already living locally? So how would a pensioner moving in to the area drive these local workers out?

Living with parents and/or renting.

Fact is if you want to own a house and have a family you move out of the area as you cant afford £250k houses when your joint income is around £40k

Surprisingly enough rental rates are cheap and a 2/3 bedoom house is only £500/600 a month to rent.

Because of that we dont have the big influx of BTL people.

I looked at the rental income of my £500k house last year. I could expect to receive £1000 a month rent.

 

[Greebo]

So retired people move to the countryside and people growing up in the countryside mostly need to get jobs in a big city if they want to earn a decent wage? (well aside from perhaps the local GP, Vet and some farmers) Seems pretty normal at the moment.

Maybe working from home will change this in future, in fact that could easily ease the pressure on housing in the South East too.

Yeah but then they find in the city they struggle to buy a house as well.

But yeah, it was never like this 10/20 years ago. Some people choose to go to the cities for better paid jobs/careers but at least you had a choice.

Now the choice is rent. I know several families who have rented all they life and will continue to do so.