Court Case: woman tricked into sex with a woman pretending to be a man

Terminal_Boy · 12 Nov 2015 at 17:59

lafemmefatale said:
Issues with the term 'genetic woman' (as we established in the other thread that even that most staunchest of self-identified alpha males, Thompson_NCL doesn't know if he's a 'genetic woman' or not, and the same is true for his wife) aside, there's nowhere it says anything other than that.

I'll take as 'no' then.

SexyGreyFox · 12 Nov 2015 at 18:17

I miss Lucy Bee and her friend Jessika.
I wonder if she's out there looking in?

bitslice · 12 Nov 2015 at 19:33

The sentence she got for this was well over the top, eight years is insane.

lafemmefatale said:
The precedent set by the case is a clear warning shot to all gender variant and trans people.

I think this is why I'm uncomfortable with the sentence, the court is kind of defining that only binary genders are OK and anything else is some variation of rape. Not everything is that clear cut.

-

balky12 · 12 Nov 2015 at 19:59

lafemmefatale said:
The precedent set by the case is a clear warning shot to all gender variant and trans people.

bitslice said:
I think this is why I'm uncomfortable with the sentence, the court is kind of defining that only binary genders are OK and anything else is some variation of rape. Not everything is that clear cut

Warning shot is a bit strong I feel.

Regarding the court and binary genders. There is plenty of law regarding transgenders and 'non-binary' genders.

All this court ruling has enforced is that it's not ok to use deception regarding gender to get into bed with someone.

It's a complete non-issue in my book. Honesty and disclosure. After all if you have to keep something a secret from someone in order to have a sexual relationship do you really want a relationship with that person anyways?

i.e. if you know a hetero male would not sleep with you as you are transgender, would you really want to strike up a sexual relationship with this person? Then live in fear that one day they will find out? Surely you would want a relationship built on trust and honesty? Find someone who doesn't mind.

Then no one is hurt.

lafemmefatale · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:04

Given that the common public perception of trans guys is that they're women pretending to be men, and vice versa for trans women, it's not going to sit well within their community given that 'trans panic' is also a defence for mitigating murdering someone.

dowie · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:10

well being upfront with people not deceiving them into believe you're something your not would be the way forwards - this case shouldn't have many implications for trannies in general other than people who'd want to cover up their sex

lafemmefatale · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:14

dowie said:
well being upfront with people not deceiving them into believe you're something your not would be the way forwards - this case shouldn't have many implications for trannies in general other than people who'd want to cover up their sex

Second time that language has been used in here, and it's disgusting. Mods, is this OK, or is it not?

Anyway, I wasn't wrong:

....I'm sure the herpy derpy let's all point and laugh at the 'man' in the dress crew are about to crash into here at great speed with their vast omnipotent knowledge of something they know nothing about, except for what they read somewhere on Breitbart.

Sigh.

dowie · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:25

lafemmefatale said:
Second time that language has been used in here, and it's disgusting. Mods, is this OK, or is it not?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/05/22/rupaul-responds-tranny_n_5374897.html

When asked whether he is bothered by the word "tranny," RuPaul responded by saying, “No! I love the word tranny.”

Maron then noted that the trans community is offended by the term, to which Ru responded:

No, it is not the transsexual community. These are fringe people who are looking for story lines to strengthen their identity as victims.

Are you a tranny?

Uncle Petey · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:25

Maybe you're just making it mean what you want it to.

Much like you've made this thread into something about transsexuals, when it's about a lesbian that got caught out being a sneaky sod with an absolute idiot.

lafemmefatale · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:25

Dis86 said:
Talk about missing the point because you're on one of your trans friendly crusades. You're actually agreeing with what I'm saying. You just need to stop talking once in a while and engage your brain.

Where did I say I was disagreeing with you? :confused:

Schlong&Stable · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:25

lafemmefatale said:
Issues with the term 'genetic woman' (as we established in the other thread that even that most staunchest of self-identified alpha males, Thompson_NCL doesn't know if he's a 'genetic woman' or not, and the same is true for his wife) aside, there's nowhere it says anything other than that.

This is simply not true.

As I said at the time, persons with chromosomal disorders are rarely incognito. Men with XXY chromosomes usually have a myriad of health related issues, not least their being sterile and developing breast tissue. Women with XXY chromosomes are rare and stick out like a sore thumb because they look wrong.

There is absolutely no chance I am a "genetic woman" or my wife a "genetic man". Equally, this issue has almost nothing to do with transsexualism since very few transsexuals have chromosomal disorders.

dowie · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:26

http://katebornstein.typepad.com/kate_bornsteins_blog/2009/07/who-you-calling-a-tranny.html

In the interests of keeping the call as open as possible, we agreed to include as many trans-identities as we knew, so we used the word "tranny." And that's where the activist **** hit the postmodern fan base. People have been ****ed. Here's their argument: FTMs are co-opting a word that belongs to MTFs. The word "tranny" belongs to MTFs, reason those who were hurt by our use of the word, because it was a denigrating term reclaimed by MTFs—ergo, only MTFs could be known as trannies. I spoke with Bear, and we agree that’s wrong on several counts:

Tranny began as a uniting term amongst ourselves. Of course it’s going to be picked up and used as a denigrating term by mean people in the world. But even if we manage to get them to stop saying tranny like a thrown rock, mean people will come up with another word to wound us with. So, let’s get back to using tranny as a uniting term amongst ourselves. That would make Doris Fish very happy.
It's our first own language word for ourselves that has no medical-legacy.
Even if (like gay) hate-filled people try to make tranny into a bad word, our most positive response is to own the word (a word invented by the queerest of the queer of their day). We have the opportunity to re-create tranny as a positive in the world.
Saying that FTMs can’t call themselves trannies eerily echoes the 1980s lesbians who said I couldn’t use the word woman to identify myself, and the 1990s lesbians who said I couldn’t use the word dyke.

lafemmefatale · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:29

Let's see which side of the fence the moderating team fall on this one.

Using language such at that is most definitely against the spirit of the membership charter, especially when it's a very deliberate use like the examples above.

Uncle Petey · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:30

Oh, ze drama...

dowie · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:31

lafemmefatale said:
Let's see which side of the fence the moderating team fall on this one.

Using language such at that is most definitely against the spirit of the membership charter, especially when it's a very deliberate use like the examples above.

sicne you didn't answer I'm going to assume you fall into this camp:

These are fringe people who are looking for story lines to strengthen their identity as victims.

Rofflay · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:34

The world has offically gone mad, But anyone who does not disclose ops or sex changes should do jail. At the end of the day it is not a million miles off rape. You may of consented to meeting them or sexual relations thinking they were a different sex.

But if they turn out to be post-op or pre-op that is actually rape if you look at what they are defining as rape. So really this person has been sentanced for rape and rightly so.

lafemmefatale · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:36

dowie said:
sicne you didn't answer I'm going to assume you fall into this camp:

If you ask me properly, instead of using childish language, I'll answer.

Gilly · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:36

I want to understand the issue. I feel like someone is offended by the use of a word here that is used globally as a descriptive term.

I feel it best if this is to be taken offline or into the content forum, and not discussed at length in the open forums, if we are to reach any sort of understanding.

balky12 · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:37

lafemmefatale said:
Let's see which side of the fence the moderating team fall on this one.

Using language such at that is most definitely against the spirit of the membership charter, especially when it's a very deliberate use like the examples above.

It is a deliberate use you're right. Deliberately used to describe one who has changed gender. This is so people don't confuse them with born females or born males. The transgender community seem more than happy with it (see above).

The fact that you are trying to make out it is a bad word goes against what the very community are trying to avoid. So much for your 'crusade' it seems.

Moderators will most probably (should) conclude the word is fine. Especially when the above is taken into account. If they conclude the word is fine will you stop calling Hetero men boring or transphobes just because we admit we wouldn't sleep with a transgender? Also you can stop calling out and attacking Thompson? To be fair you should stop that silly behaviour either way, but having been proved wrong should make it all the easier.

lafemmefatale · 12 Nov 2015 at 20:38

Gilly said:
I want to understand the issue. I feel like someone is offended by the use of a word here that is used globally as a descriptive term.

I feel it best if this is to be taken offline or into the content forum, and not discussed at length in the open forums, if we are to reach any sort of understanding.

I feel it doesn't need to be taken anywhere. It's a simple question, is the word 'tranny' or any other such derogatory, demeaning and dehumanising term used to refer to trans people, OK to use on here.

Yes or no?

*edit - if it is acceptable, then you won't see me post on here again. If it is deemed not acceptable, then fair enough, the membership charter as it stands has shown that it's worth the 0's and 1's used to create it.

When you've made your mind up, let me know.