Why do we hate cycling in this country?

[Thekwango]

Insurance and some sort of training needs to be compulsory to ride on public roads

Second most stupid comment that ever comes out in these threads. Just waiting for the helmet and reflective gear now to call House.

The real problems are with road user attitude, education and awareness, and infrastructure.

i'll sort of agree on the insurance thing - though, I would suggest it be advisable for cyclists to have some form of insurance should they ever be at fault for an accident so they have some sort of cover to protect them from financial claims etc.

I'm more interested why you think compulsory training falls under the 'second most stupid comment' when you yourself have said that education and awareness are part of the problem for road users. surely compulsory training would improve awareness? or when you say 'road user attitude, education and awareness' are you only referring to vehicle drivers?

 

[413x]

Which is why I'd rather there was a drive to make public transport useable/pollute less/be cheaper.

We're not all in London with access to the (excellent) tube!

im thinking of giving it a go as it might actually mean i dont need to swim so much but i will need to go a non dual carriage route, and only in nice weather.

public transport would be worse for me than car or bike, but thats a problem when you arent actually in a big city but live just beyond it and your work is on outskirts too

 

[George Hincapie]

Why should insurance be compulsory?

For all road users; including horse riders.

 

[ShaolinDreams]

Implementing bicycle insurance has got nothing to do with Why do we hate cycling in this country. Just sayin..

 

[George Hincapie]

I completely misunderstood the thread. I thought it was being asked why the country hates Cyclists, not cyling.

Well I don't think we do hate cycling. The TdF Grand Depart in the UK was spectacular. My perception is that cycling is very popular.

 

[Avenged7Fold]

I think cycling as a hobby or sport is very popular but is unpopular as a method of commuting.

Got a colleague who is 5 minutes away by car, he puts his bike and lycra in the car every morning to drive to work. At lunch he goes out for a 40-50 minute cycle in his gear, then he puts the gear in the boot, showers and goes back to work. He probably wastes almost as much time getting stuff out of the shed, folding the bike and taking wheels off to fit it in the boot, getting it out and reattaching wheels to do his cycle and then taking the wheels off again, as he spends actually cycling. His wheels are not even those tool-less quick release ones.

 

[Amp34]

why is it? how can anyone be against training? and why should you not be insured against damage to a 3rd parties property?

For all road users; including horse riders.

Does that include the 10 year old out on their bike? Why not pedestrians as well, they can cause damage. It's unworkable to have mandatory insurance and there is no logical end point for where insurance should stop. Given that the vast majority of incidents involving cyclists are motorists fault compulsory bike insurance wouldn't make much difference. It's the same with horse riders, accidents are largely caused by motorists not looking and not giving enough space when passing. You wouldn't pass a car or motorcycle that close, so why pass a cyclist?

Im pretty sure average joe (in a car) is the primary reason that London is congested.

To be fair in central London there are very few private cars anymore due to rush hour, it's almost exclusively buses and taxis. Not that I understand why people take taxis, they are far more expensive and generally take longer than the tube.


The other problem with the U.K. is that we are extremely aggressive motorists. There is much less regard for for other road users or pedestrians, both on roads in towns, in the countryside and even in car parks. It's very much a me, me, me attitude where many people only think about how fast they can get from A-B. That needs to change, but I doubt it will.

 

[Orionaut]

The UK and Holland are very different places.

Comparing the two in a discussion about cycling is like comparing the USA and Canada in a discussion about Gun ownership.

Holland is Flat, Very, Very, Flat!

Cycling is a very obvious way of getting around. even a moderately fit adult can maintain a good pace and keep it up for 20-30 miles.

This is not the case in the UK.

It was worth making the investment in Holland because cycling was already popular and there was good confidence that the new facilitates would be used.

Cycling in the UK is very much a minority activity and it would cost many billions (Well into the tens of billions I would think) to improve the infrastructure enough to persuade any significant numbers to change their travelling habits.

And all on a gamble that they might not and that the money would be totally wasted.

 

[platypus]

I'm more interested why you think compulsory training falls under the 'second most stupid comment' when you yourself have said that education and awareness are part of the problem for road users. surely compulsory training would improve awareness? or when you say 'road user attitude, education and awareness' are you only referring to vehicle drivers?

Sorry that was poorly written on my part, I'd meant mostly insurance. But I do see compulsory training as a bar to entry, and as a result would need to be carefully thought about.

 

[jonneymendoza]

Im pretty sure average joe (in a car) is the primary reason that London is congested.

nope wrong again because they take bus, train whatever to go to A and B in most cases because shock horror, you cant park anywhere in london without a resident permit or £10 an hour..

 

[PermaBanned]

The UK and Holland are very different places.

Comparing the two in a discussion about cycling is like comparing the USA and Canada in a discussion about Gun ownership.

Holland is Flat, Very, Very, Flat!

Cycling is a very obvious way of getting around. even a moderately fit adult can maintain a good pace and keep it up for 20-30 miles.

This is not the case in the UK.

Well, yes and no. Yes there are more hills, but that by no means makes cycle commuting a literal impossibility. Especially when the places drastically in need of cycling infrastructure - city centres - are generally pretty flat too. It's not about being able to speed as fast as you can on your bike, it's about being able to keep a higher average pace because the infrastructure doesn't force you to stop or change speed every 20 seconds.

It was worth making the investment in Holland because cycling was already popular and there was good confidence that the new facilitates would be used.

Cycling in the UK is very much a minority activity and it would cost many billions (Well into the tens of billions I would think) to improve the infrastructure enough to persuade any significant numbers to change their travelling habits.

And all on a gamble that they might not and that the money would be totally wasted.

This actually isn't true at all. In the 70s cycling was probably less popular in The Netherlands than it is in the UK today. It's pretty well acknowledged that good cycling infrastructure leads to more people cycling more regularly, leading to reduced congestion and better public health. This is worth a watch:

 

[Avenged7Fold]

How would insurance work for those who cannot afford to pay it but require a bike to get to work?

Children cant be expected to get insurance for cycling.

I can understand the sentiment but it would be ridiculous to make it compulsory, especially considering the worth of some of these bikes. It would seem like a considerably unnecessary expense to a cyclist, even more so if you had just a crappy old thing to get you from a to b. If the insurance didn't cost much, then companies would not bother and claims would simply not be worth it.

 

[Tuppy_Glossop]

Sorry that was poorly written on my part, I'd meant mostly insurance. But I do see compulsory training as a bar to entry, and as a result would need to be carefully thought about.

Presumably the training would be recommended by the insurers to lower premiums. How to train pedestrians ? Who will police it ?

I passed my cycling proficiency test back in the 70s

 

[Avenged7Fold]

Would bicycles require identifiable plates and need to be registered as well?

 

[jonneymendoza]

How would insurance work for those who cannot afford to pay it but require a bike to get to work?

Children cant be expected to get insurance for cycling.

I can understand the sentiment but it would be ridiculous to make it compulsory, especially considering the worth of some of these bikes. It would seem like a considerably unnecessary expense to a cyclist, even more so if you had just a crappy old thing to get you from a to b. If the insurance didn't cost much, then companies would not bother and claims would simply not be worth it.

children dont cycle on the roads mate. usually adults i see cycling

 

[Avenged7Fold]

I see loads of school kids cycling on the roads around the time school closes. A few in the last hour passed outside my office window. They aren't in lycra and don't always wear a helmet but many cycle on the road, probably to avoid people on the pavements.

 

[phil675]

The other problem with the U.K. is that we are extremely aggressive motorists. There is much less regard for for other road users or pedestrians, both on roads in towns, in the countryside and even in car parks. It's very much a me, me, me attitude where many people only think about how fast they can get from A-B. That needs to change, but I doubt it will.

Compared to Europe I think we are quite civilised on the roads really, but something that needs to change is all the unwritten rules that people have in their head. Every car should have a copy of the Highway Code stapled to the windscreen.

 

[linktoinsanity]

The other problem with the U.K. is that we are extremely aggressive motorists. There is much less regard for for other road users or pedestrians, both on roads in towns, in the countryside and even in car parks. It's very much a me, me, me attitude where many people only think about how fast they can get from A-B. That needs to change, but I doubt it will.

Eh? You think we're bad?

Ever been to Italy?

 

[Avenged7Fold]

Eh? You think we're bad?

Ever been to Italy?

Was just thinking this lol

Most selfish and aggressive drivers in the world. I forget how scary it can be on the road and am reminded every time i go back to visit relatives.

 

[Amp34]

Compared to Europe I think we are quite civilised on the roads really, but something that needs to change is all the unwritten rules that people have in their head. Every car should have a copy of the Highway Code stapled to the windscreen.

Some parts of Europe yes, but Certainly not many other parts. A lot of places are very aggressive to other motorists but treat non motorists with far more respect than we do.

Think that would make a difference? Most people won't have read it the first time.

Personally I think part of the system for getting a driving licence should be a set amount of time on a bike. Say 100 hours of cycling, which would both help people understand how non motorist road users behave (and why they behave like that - for example why you should cycle in the middle of your lane, not at the kerb). It would also be a period where learner drivers would be pushed to really get to grips with the Highway Code, before being put in a car on their own. If could run in parallel with driving lessons, or before they are even allowed in one.