Panama Papers

I admit I've based all mine on what I've heard and seen on TV so biased and not direct facts.

Iceland's PM stepped down... So why not ours?

Because we're so great....

Why should he resign, to suit your ridiculous and misguided sense of outrage?

The longer this goes on the longer the anti Cameron brigade are making themselves look incredibly pathetic. The smart thing to do would be to shut up about it and wait for something actually worth going mad about but then if they were smart they'd not have turned this into a thing in the first place.
 
As someone saying above, this is really just highlighting the idiots on Facebook this week.

Rich seems to be becoming a dirty word.
 
Fair play to David Cameron for releasing his tax records. It's pretty clear now that David Cameron isn't a tax dodger.

Which it makes it the more bizarre that it took his office four attempts to tell the truth over this matter.
 
Ah, so it was an inheritance tax dodge? That makes sense because the 40% thing is a load of Bs.

However, why dodge it and not amend it? The people who have followed the law of the land and been hit must be quite aggrieved. The rich get richer..... The honest pay for it...

You mean the ignorant pay for it. He has followed the law of the land, he happens to have spent a small amount of time thinking about it to - others just ignore the issue, don't plan anything and then get hit with a bigger bill.
 
Fair play to David Cameron for releasing his tax records. It's pretty clear now that David Cameron isn't a tax dodger.

Which it makes it the more bizarre that it took his office four attempts to tell the truth over this matter.

Why? Seems he was being up front all along when he initially stated it was a private matter. The average **** in the street is a bit clueless when it comes to finance this the prevalence of pay day loans, people with credit card debt and silly, misguided outrage in this thread.
 
Why? Seems he was being up front all along when he initially stated it was a private matter.

If you're included on a list with El Chapo and Vladimir Putin, you're going to look guilty by association if you say that it's a private matter.

Being transparent from the start would have stopped this becoming such a drawn-out news story.
 
I'm sure he could roger a pig live on TV and some here would defend him. Or they to are being 'creative' with their tax and don't like the thought of being considered 'morally bankrupt'. ;)
 
He did this before he passed, hence why his family dodged the inheritance tax. Anymore excuses?

Well, I'd be very worried if he did something after he passed away ;)

Seriously though, you've answered your own question - it's different because Cameron is the Prime Minister.
 
Yes they are, and it's pathetic. The "dodge" is merely to use the tax rules as they have been for years. Anyone with an estate over £325k *which is almost everybody that owns their iwn house clear of mortgage, and anyone whose equity is over that amount even if there is one, is missing out if they don't at least consider exactly the same thing, and an idiot if they don't do it unless there are compelling (non-tax) reasons for not doing it. Sometimes, broken family relationships mitigate against.

Remember, every individual has an allowance of £325k. Estates passed between spouses are not subject to IHT but will be on passing to offspring. The effect is 2x £325k of allowance between both spouses.

So if your Dad has a £600k house, and passes it to you (or you and your siblings), the taxable value is £275k, so 40% IHT means tax of £110k. Result, you get £490k and the taxman gets £110k. What parent wants that £110k to go to HMRC, instead of their kids?

Now suppose your Dad gives you £325k. No tax is due, as that's the allowance. The remaining £275k goes to his spouse, who then subsequently dies, meaning that any inheritance has her £325k allowance, so IHT will only be due if the rest of her estate excluding the bit she inherited exceeds £50k.

However, before she dies, she can give you money, for example, £200k, and it's simply a gift, with no tax due UNLESS she dies within 7 years, because then, the recipient, you in this example or Cameron in the real case, will have to pay IHT on it. How much IHT depends on how much time elapses between gift and death, and the total value in 7 years. Less than 3 years and it's the full 40%, and a reducing sliding scale after that.

If she had £250k before getting the money from your Dad, she will have £525k after getting it. The first £325k is covered by her allowance, leaving £200k to be tax. Unless she gives it to you now, and then survives more than 3 years. If she doesn't, the same tax is due as if your Dad gave you that £200k. If she survives 7 years or more, that £200k is IHT-free, and if she survives somewhere in-between, you'll pay some tax, but less than the full 40%.

So one utterly legal way of reducing IHT for the wealthy is to 'gift' £45k per year, on a rolling basis. Three kids = £15k per year, per kid, and that comes close to maxing out the IHT 7-year gift examption. There are some other smaller annual gift allowances to kids, grandkids, etc.

Anyone with substantial wealth is likely to be doing something like this, unless good reason that have nothing to do with tax prevent it, like not wanting kids to get any inheritance. This isn't tax avoidance. It's very basic tax planning, using the IHT tax rules exactly as they were intended to be used, and is no more tax avoidance than anyone putting money in an ISA rather than a standard building society account is using a "dodge". And it's what happened with Cameron's so-called "dodge".

All Cameron's dad did with this transfer to spouse was to use exactly what the law intended. Until fairly recently, something like 15 years ago, each spouses IHT allowance (less than £325k then) was non-transferable, so if the assets of one spouse passed to the other, only one lot of IHT allowance applied. The government (Labour) changed that introducing that transferance precisely to have this effect. It was possible before then to achieve the same thing, but only by keeping assets 50:50 between partners. That meant separate bank accounts not joint, having two shareholding with 50% in each name not a single joint holding, making sure that property (like houses) was legally separated so each party absolutely owned 50%, rather than a single joint ownership. It was a lot of faffing about, and it all became unnecessary when the government made the IHT allowance trabsferable between spouses.

At what point is a company set up in Panama of all places during this process?
 
I'm sure he could roger a pig live on TV and some here would defend him. Or they to are being 'creative' with their tax and don't like the thought of being considered 'morally bankrupt'. ;)

Well let me see... I have a small amount in an ISA, and my private pension contributions are made through a salary sacrifice scheme. So, umm, guilty m'lud?

Being serious now, Cameron is in a mess entirely of his own (and George Osborne's) making. Instead of making the case for a low tax, low regulation economy for (like 'proper' Tories would), he opted for the class-war "wealth is immoral" line that Labour started under Ed Milliband

Hoist on his own petard :D
 
Yes they are, and it's pathetic. The "dodge" is merely to use the tax rules as they have been for years. Anyone with an estate over £325k *which is almost everybody that owns their iwn house clear of mortgage, and anyone whose equity is over that amount even if there is one, is missing out if they don't at least consider exactly the same thing, and an idiot if they don't do it unless there are compelling (non-tax) reasons for not doing it. Sometimes, broken family relationships mitigate against.

Remember, every individual has an allowance of £325k. Estates passed between spouses are not subject to IHT but will be on passing to offspring. The effect is 2x £325k of allowance between both spouses.

So if your Dad has a £600k house, and passes it to you (or you and your siblings), the taxable value is £275k, so 40% IHT means tax of £110k. Result, you get £490k and the taxman gets £110k. What parent wants that £110k to go to HMRC, instead of their kids?

Now suppose your Dad gives you £325k. No tax is due, as that's the allowance. The remaining £275k goes to his spouse, who then subsequently dies, meaning that any inheritance has her £325k allowance, so IHT will only be due if the rest of her estate excluding the bit she inherited exceeds £50k.

However, before she dies, she can give you money, for example, £200k, and it's simply a gift, with no tax due UNLESS she dies within 7 years, because then, the recipient, you in this example or Cameron in the real case, will have to pay IHT on it. How much IHT depends on how much time elapses between gift and death, and the total value in 7 years. Less than 3 years and it's the full 40%, and a reducing sliding scale after that.

If she had £250k before getting the money from your Dad, she will have £525k after getting it. The first £325k is covered by her allowance, leaving £200k to be tax. Unless she gives it to you now, and then survives more than 3 years. If she doesn't, the same tax is due as if your Dad gave you that £200k. If she survives 7 years or more, that £200k is IHT-free, and if she survives somewhere in-between, you'll pay some tax, but less than the full 40%.

So one utterly legal way of reducing IHT for the wealthy is to 'gift' £45k per year, on a rolling basis. Three kids = £15k per year, per kid, and that comes close to maxing out the IHT 7-year gift examption. There are some other smaller annual gift allowances to kids, grandkids, etc.

Anyone with substantial wealth is likely to be doing something like this, unless good reason that have nothing to do with tax prevent it, like not wanting kids to get any inheritance. This isn't tax avoidance. It's very basic tax planning, using the IHT tax rules exactly as they were intended to be used, and is no more tax avoidance than anyone putting money in an ISA rather than a standard building society account is using a "dodge". And it's what happened with Cameron's so-called "dodge".

All Cameron's dad did with this transfer to spouse was to use exactly what the law intended. Until fairly recently, something like 15 years ago, each spouses IHT allowance (less than £325k then) was non-transferable, so if the assets of one spouse passed to the other, only one lot of IHT allowance applied. The government (Labour) changed that introducing that transferance precisely to have this effect. It was possible before then to achieve the same thing, but only by keeping assets 50:50 between partners. That meant separate bank accounts not joint, having two shareholding with 50% in each name not a single joint holding, making sure that property (like houses) was legally separated so each party absolutely owned 50%, rather than a single joint ownership. It was a lot of faffing about, and it all became unnecessary when the government made the IHT allowance trabsferable between spouses.

Well put, all they have done is what anyone with half a brain would be doing in their situation - start moving assets from the old to the young NOW before you die and have to pay tax on it.

It would be dodgy if they were trying to do THAT via some kind of offshore trust.

**** inheritance tax.
 
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This is getting absurd now. BBC news front page, Camerons mother gifted him £200k after his fathers death to 'avoid inheritance tax'. This is NOT front page news.
 
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