High Court Ruling on School Holidays

[Gaygle]

Parents who deem it reasonable to take their children out of education for a week should be allowed to do just that...what right does the state have to punish someone for exercising responsibility, after all isn't that what parenthood is all about.

You're making the huge mistake thinking that all parents are what the majority would call "reasonable". You'll get some parents who believe that taking their child out of school for a month in May is "reasonable". I imagine these are the same types of parents who would do absolutely *nothing* to try and help their child come back up to speed and they probably aren't the types of parents who have straight A children. A generalisation? Absolutely. Is likely to be accurate? Absolutely.

I don't believe children should be taken out of school for a holiday - the amount of disruption it presents to the school, teachers, child and the rest of the class completely outweighs the convenience of the parents wanting to take AL when they want.

When that child comes back after 2 weeks away, and all the other children in the class are working through what they've been doing for the last 2 weeks - what then? A teacher has got to neglect the rest of the class to spend a disproportionate amount of time with one or two children to *try* to get them up to speed. This puts pressure on the child, pressure on the teacher having to effectively plan two lessons for the same lesson and is unfair on the other children who are 2 weeks ahead who have their education affected. Not only that, as any teacher will tell you, as soon as you have to take your eye off the rest of the class and deal with one child - the rest of the class will become distracted as well.

Now imagine that 5 children out of a class of 25 go off on holiday at different times over a 4 week period, and all come back at different points and trying to plan a lesson to accommodate everyone. Good luck is all I would have to say!

The comparisons with sickness aren't valid either - these are completely unavoidable. With adverse weather and industrial action - ALL of the children are off school, rather than just one or two which means when they come in the day after, everyone is still at the same level.

 

[muon]

Industrial action is rare as well, with 1 or 2 days missed at most.

In 13 years of schooling, I never had industrial action happen which prevented a lesson.

 

[The Mad Rapper]

Don't twist my words.

When did I say parents can't do that. Secondly a parent does not have complete authority.

The state has a duty of care to provide an education to all under 18s.

If parents want to take the child out of education completely (not partially and when they see fit) as long as education is being provided that is fine.

Going on vacation reduces attendance and hence the quantity of education being provided. The state has a duty of care that education is provided or an equivalent is being provided privately. Going on a family holiday is not an equivalent.

Are you even a parent? I'm not sure you judging by the tripe you just posted.

 

[muon]

Are you even a parent? I'm not sure you judging by the tripe you just posted.

If I was, would you accept my argument?

Or are you looking for an irrelevant attack?

The best people to comment on education and the impact of absence are teachers. However, I suspect you would dismiss their comments.

 

[The Mad Rapper]

If I was, would you accept my argument?

Or are you looking for an irrelevant attack?

If you weren't I'd think "Well STFU then you **** - WTF has it got to do with you?"

So answer the question.

 

[muon]

If you weren't I'd think "Well STFU then you **** - WTF has it got to do with you?"

So answer the question.

Lol.

How about MPs with no children. Are they no allowed to vote on such matters?

I don't think you are an adult who can think reasonably.

 

[The Mad Rapper]

If I was, would you accept my argument?

Or are you looking for an irrelevant attack?

The best people to comment on education and the impact of absence are teachers. However, I suspect you would dismiss their comments.

No. Idiot post. The best people to decide on what's best for their children in every aspect of their lives are that child's parents.

 

[Gaygle]

Are you even a parent?

Oh god!

I wondered how long it'd be until someone came out with this patronising tripe.

 

[The Mad Rapper]

Lol.

How about MPs with no children. Are they no allowed to vote on such matters?

I don't think you are an adult who can think reasonably.

Is your real name Tommy Tangent? So you have no children? Get out of the thread then

 

[muon]

No. Idiot post. The best people to decide on what's best for their children in every aspect of their lives are that child's parents.

I disagree and so does the law. Parents do not have absolute authority over the the well being of their children.

Tough, deal with it.

Move to a country that isn't the case.

 

[The Mad Rapper]

I disagree and so does the law.

Tough, deal with it.

Move to a country that isn't the case.

No. I will continue to do what I want when I want. Deal with that.

And parents DO and always WILL have absolute authority over their children.

 

[muon]

No. I will continue to do what I want when I want. Deal with that.

Hey if you want to break laws to exercise absolute authority over your chilren, go ahead.

If you can dodge the repercussions, then that is a shame.

People don't get to pick and choose which laws to follow.

And parents DO and always WILL have absolute authority over their children.

Might as well close down all social services departments for children.

They quite simply don't no matter what you say.

 

[The Running Man]

No. I will continue to do what I want when I want. Deal with that.

And parents DO and always WILL have absolute authority over their children.

You sound like a.model parent.

 

[Gaygle]

And parents DO and always WILL have absolute authority over their children.

No they don't.

I'd say they have general authority but absolute authority assumes that they can operate with no confines whatsoever - which is impossible because of UK law. Parent's have as much authority as is afforded to them by the law. This isn't absolute authority.

 

[rare]

People don't get to pick and choose which laws to follow.

A law in itself may not be a morally or logically sound concept just because it is a law.

The government can't even organise logical SAT's tests what makes you think they understand a child's requirements over a parent.

To quantify, what % attendance do you see as minimum standard?

Not for me to say but I can pick a number that sounds reasonable off the top of my head. Lets try 90%.

You're making the huge mistake thinking that all parents are what the majority would call "reasonable". You'll get some parents who believe that taking their child out of school for a month in May is "reasonable". I imagine these are the same types of parents who would do absolutely *nothing* to try and help their child come back up to speed and they probably aren't the types of parents who have straight A children. A generalisation? Absolutely. Is likely to be accurate? Absolutely.

Afraid we just have different perspectives. The school should advise against such a move if they felt they ought to, providing a full and sensible account of why taking a child out of school for anything more than say a week, might be a bad idea.

If the parent, armed with that full understanding still decides to do that, well so be it in my mind.

 

[dowie]

And parents DO and always WILL have absolute authority over their children.

Really, what about when they abuse them? What about when they get divorced?

Authority can easily be taken away - there are various instances relating to the welfare of the child where the state can and does get involved - these can range from medical situations to education though to child safety issues. Stating that parents have 'absolute authority' is complete nonsense.

 

[RaohNS]

Jebus and i thought i stirred the thread up! Lulz

People without kids who are in this thread: you have no comprehension of what it means to want to do something to give your kids the best. Being in a school for education is not always the best. There are also far more beneficial things than school.

I could guarantee that a trip to the pyramids is worth a months worth of lessons on Egypt. There really is a limit to the amount of learning that can be done from a book. Why do teachers and teaching staff like myself arrange external trips to meet a point or highlight something. Prime example i mentioned regarding Rome earlier was that my kids took more from Rome than ANY taught school session EVER could.

By the same token IF a parent makes a holiday a learning experience they are adding 10x the education. When did school last take my kids snorkeling? Yea thats it, last week and the week before... not

 

[muon]

Children do not go to school for 260 days a year. There is an understanding that being in education all the time isn't the best for children.

So 190 days has been selected as the optimal amount.

There are 70 other days + weekends to go on a vacation.

The real problem is monetary. Not that there isn't time. Schools also frequently offer trips abroad with educational value far higher than the usual family holiday.

People without kids who are in this thread: you have no comprehension of what it means to want to do something to give your kids the best.

These people have comprehension about caring about the wellbeing of people they don't have direct relations with. I know that may be hard for you to believe. It is the entire basis of a state government.

 

[Kaeo]

Jebus and i thought i stirred the thread up! Lulz

People without kids who are in this thread: you have no comprehension of what it means to want to do something to give your kids the best. Being in a school for education is not always the best. There are also far more beneficial things than school.

I could guarantee that a trip to the pyramids is worth a months worth of lessons on Egypt. There really is a limit to the amount of learning that can be done from a book. Why do teachers and teaching staff like myself arrange external trips to meet a point or highlight something. Prime example i mentioned regarding Rome earlier was that my kids took more from Rome than ANY taught school session EVER could.

By the same token IF a parent makes a holiday a learning experience they are adding 10x the education. When did school last take my kids snorkeling? Yea thats it, last week and the week before... not

If kids have an interest in sealife, I don't see the issue with snorkeling? Water hater.

 

[muon]

I think the government should start paying for family holidays. It sounds like they have immense educational value. Divert some of that, what sounds like, inefficiently spent education budget.

Reduce number of school days to 180 a year and give families money to go on a 2 week holiday. Has more educational value apparently than Maths and English lessons.