Clarification on Legal Stuff after non-fault accident

Tute · 28 Jun 2016 at 18:00

Hi all, looking to try and get my head around this.

Back in January, the missus had someone run into the back of her at a junction. Annoying yes - but it happens. She said the other driver was very apologetic, admitted fault immediately and things were put into motion to get it sorted.

Her car was taken to a garage for assessment. Our own insurer put us in contact with a company who arranged a hire car for our use in the meantime. All fine - after all the other driver had already admitted fault.

This took around two months for the garage to declare the car a write off - and it would have taken longer if she hadn't chased them herself! Anyhow, a settlement figure was reached, we received the cheque, case closed - or so we thought.

Fast forward a few weeks and a letter arrives - the other insurer is contesting the hire car amount on the grounds that it's "excessive". Sure, whatever, it's your guy who did this but I appreciate it's probably just posturing so we filled out all forms and sent it back.

Now we've got a letter - his insurer are contesting it on the basis that my missus should have "paid the costs herself". Now, quite frankly this is ridiculous. The other driver admitted fault from day one, it was all settled, so how can they possibly claim the hire car is not their responsibility?

They want us to provide a raft of bank statements, bills, CC statements etc. and quite frankly it's going to take ages. I want to go to the watchdog about this as they seem to be just trying to waste our time for sake of it.

My question is - is this acceptable behaviour from his insurer?

TIA.

vanandjuanunited · 28 Jun 2016 at 18:02

Pass letter to insurance company and move on with your life

Diagro · 28 Jun 2016 at 18:50

Yup. Ignore them.
you don't have any contract with them.
Tell them to contact your own insurers if they want.

Tute · 28 Jun 2016 at 19:01

They're writing to us through our insurers though, this isn't directly from them.

Malt_Vinegar · 28 Jun 2016 at 19:20

The are delaying, as it saves them paying out straight away.
I had a similar thing recently. It seems like a standard tactic by companies when it comes to car hire costs.
They took it right up to instructing solicitors, and getting a date for court, then pulled out and paid the costs.

Your insurance company would have asked you questions at the time of sorting the hire car about availability of another vehicle, requirement to have a vehicle, access to other vehicles. Basically, they want to prove that you really did need the car, and that the costs were unavoidable. They will almost certainly ask why you went so long with a hire car when yours was written off.

From what I can tell, some times, when people have taken the mickey, they will get the costs passed back. Do you have legal protection on your policy?

Tute · 28 Jun 2016 at 19:40

Yeah we do. It's just the added stress and PITA factor of having to do this, given that anyone with a brain cell can see they don't have a case.

I guess we'll just have to play along then.

Kuros · 28 Jun 2016 at 19:51

Yeah, it depends on if your own insurance and what they outsource to. Claim Management Firms certainly push up the prices of hire car, I know Albany was charging hundreds a day a couple of years back for a corsa. Price that up for 2 months and you'll see why it'll always be contested.

I never understand why people go to their own insurance in matters like this. If it's the other persons fault and they've admitted liability, surely it's easier to let their insurance be in charge of all the costs (then they can't complain about them after). Unless they then offer something silly as a write off value.

muon · 28 Jun 2016 at 19:56

Who took the car in to the garage? The other insurance company or your insurance company?

If it is yours, then consider what it looks like to other company. Your insurance company has taken 2 months to declare it a write off and in the mean time has earned money though an excessively long hire car period. The company your insurance company put you in contact with will be paying them a significant amount of money for the referral.

So what it sounds like is happening is that the other insurance company are refusing to pay, and now your insurance company is scrambling to put together a defense. The problem is that they are charging far higher rates than what we could go out and get right now from the usual hire car places.

Howard · 28 Jun 2016 at 20:11

This is why you should have claimed directly from the person at fault's insurer and not gone with a credit hire/accident management company through your own insurer

Tute · 28 Jun 2016 at 21:37

When we got home we phoned our insurer to notify and they put us in contact with Albany.

muon · 28 Jun 2016 at 22:15

Tute said:
When we got home we phoned our insurer to notify and they put us in contact with Albany.

Albany Assistance pay your insurer a lot of money for every referral.

Albany does that because they make a lot of money from each referral and milk the fact liability has been decided in your favour.

I bet they asked you if your were injured.

These days it won't happen because it is now banned, but in the past your details would have been sold again to solicitors who would then try and get you to claim for injury.

Tute · 28 Jun 2016 at 22:22

Yeah I see that now but having googled around a bit, it seems that most (if not all insurers) refer non fault claims to Albany or companies like them, so any sympathy I had for the opposing insurer suddenly evaporated.

Also the charges for Albany compared to standard hire do look high but then see above. I'm not going to feel bad for his insurer because they've decided their own medicine is a bit bitter.

muon · 28 Jun 2016 at 22:27

Tute said:
Yeah I see that now but having googled around a bit, it seems that most (if not all insurers) refer non fault claims to Albany or companies like them, so any sympathy I had for the opposing insurer suddenly evaporated.

Also the charges for Albany compared to standard hire do look high but then see above. I'm not going to feel bad for his insurer because they've decided their own medicine is a bit bitter.

I understand why no one would have any sympathy. But you can see why they might dispute it, especially as 2 months for a write off is taking the ****.

It's a sad state of affairs as these additional costs are reflected in insurance premiums. So we are all paying extra to fund companies like Albany which shouldn't really exist.

If you made a courtesy car claim against your own insurer, they wouldn't be using Albany.

Kuros · 29 Jun 2016 at 08:00

Don't forget that the reason insurance companies pass details onto albany is because if you don't want to deal with the other persons insurance, the other option would be to make a claim on your own insurance as a 'fault' claim until the charges are settled by the other person, meaning you'd still need to fork out your excess until it's all sorted.

muon · 29 Jun 2016 at 08:53

Kuros said:
Don't forget that the reason insurance companies pass details onto albany is because if you don't want to deal with the other persons insurance, the other option would be to make a claim on your own insurance as a 'fault' claim until the charges are settled by the other person, meaning you'd still need to fork out your excess until it's all sorted.

The repair itself will usually still be handled by your insurer.

So your excess usually does get temporarily waived if it is likely third party is at fault. If they can't make a recovery you will have to pay the excess later.

Albany will also only take the credit hire on if it is clear third party is at fault.

fezster · 29 Jun 2016 at 09:43

Albany also give you an insurance policy which basically says that if you cooperate with them fully, then should they not be able to claim costs back from the other side's insurance, you will not be liable for them. However, keep in mind that "cooperating" means filling out forms, providing bank statements, and possibly attending court. So essentially, what you're doing now is what you signed up for - you did read the Albany contract before you signed it, right?

I was in a similar position a few months ago, and in the end decided to give Albany a miss. Yes, they were offering me a fully loaded premium SUV, but they were charging over £400/day for it's hire. I ended up going directly with the at fault drivers insurance company. I got a reasonable car for around £120/day and I could be rest assured there'd be no comeback 6 months down the line. I also believe that it was doing the right thing - as said above, we all pay higher premiums because of these exorbitant claims.

It's worth noting that when you are asked about whether you need a hire car, what kind of car you need and whether you have any other vehicles in your household which you can use, it's important you answer truthfully and honestly! Otherwise, you could end up liable for costs.

Diagro · 29 Jun 2016 at 10:01

£120 a day?

Still very high no? I can go to the local Hire place and hire a nice motor for £50 a day :/

Tute · 29 Jun 2016 at 10:21

fezster said:
Albany also give you an insurance policy which basically says that if you cooperate with them fully, then should they not be able to claim costs back from the other side's insurance, you will not be liable for them. However, keep in mind that "cooperating" means filling out forms, providing bank statements, and possibly attending court. So essentially, what you're doing now is what you signed up for - you did read the Albany contract before you signed it, right?

Yep, we read all this.

My problem is more with his insurer's stance - whether it's "excessive" or not is really not down to me or my missus, it's down to said insurer and Albany to argue amongst themselves. After all, it was us who chased up the garage in question because they were taking their time - Albany didn't seem fussed that it was dragging out at all! (now I understand why)

And as said, they'd lose no sleep about unleashing Albany on others if the roles were reversed.

What a stupid industry car insurance is.

tom_e · 29 Jun 2016 at 10:25

Diagro said:
£120 a day?

Still very high no? I can go to the local Hire place and hire a nice motor for £50 a day :/

Anything involving insurance will always have a hefty insurance tax added, just look at the cost of some relatively simple and straightforward repair work when it gets billed to insurance compared to what you could actually get it done for.

fezster · 29 Jun 2016 at 10:32

Tute said:
Yep, we read all this.

My problem is more with his insurer's stance - whether it's "excessive" or not is really not down to me or my missus, it's down to said insurer and Albany to argue amongst themselves. After all, it was us who chased up the garage in question because they were taking their time - Albany didn't seem fussed that it was dragging out at all! (now I understand why)

And as said, they'd lose no sleep about unleashing Albany on others if the roles were reversed.

What a stupid industry car insurance is.

I do agree with you, and feel your frustration. However, you do need to take responsibility for what you signed. Ultimately, it comes down to you benefiting at the insurance companies expense. If they can argue in court that your benefit was excessive or unnecessary, then they don't legally have to pay. You should be ok though - as long as you've been truthful and cooperate, Albany's insurance policy will protect you from any costs. It's still a lot of unwanted hassle though!