Shots Fired in Munich Shopping Centre

Efour said:
I've seen a video of the guy having a shouting conversation with another guy in an overlooked apartment.

The translation goes on about how he said he was bullied at his school and failed all his exams amongst all the torrents of insults and swearing.

I'm no expert but I'd wager the guys just gone postal inspired by recent events. I don't think it's jihadtime. I'm pretty sure it will be portrayed as so by the media or people looking for agenda fulfilling reasons
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Oh so potentially we're looking at a youth who felt disassociated from society, bullied and poorly educated? Pretty much what I state repeatedly in these kind of threads regarding the reasons why many people turn to extremist ways and do lunatic things.

Who'd have thought it, our vilifying of people based on religion might not be exactly right. In fact what is evidential is by doing that we are exacerbating the issue, and being a cause of the problem. We should be embracing people, welcoming them into society and being integrated.

RoboCod said:
Absolutely. The term and meaning of Radicalisation is one drummed up by the media. It's actually just lazy and sloppy journalism and everyone has just sucked that concept up. Radicalisation is an unproven and innacurate excuse that fosters an "us" and "them" attitude.

Further, the media focuses on the lunatic fringe, the 1%, the extreme and the violence. This then detracts from the vast majority of non-violent supporters and sympathisers who are ignored and marginalised. In actual fact we need to understand the social organisation and communication of those young people who have become socially disengaged. We need to understand that the lunatic fringe are a tiny % atop a large pyramid that dilutes right down to the majority of non violent sympathisers.

We need to understand that you don't have to be a radicalised violent Muslim to indirectly support the extreme violent Muslims. Simply sitting and observing their forums and discussion it's clear to see that very few mean malice. It's stark that the majority of them actually feel they are speaking out/acting out of love!

If we can take the steps to understand the process then we can take the steps to engage with the disengaged and then prevent them from becoming that way in the first place. You don't have to be Muslim to feel disengaged with society, many of our youth do.

Alas, rants about banning religion and the general lack of understanding by our own majority simply hinders any resolution to the problem. It's a long road!
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RoboCod said:
It isn't necessarily just the Conservative types either. Looking at those British individuals that fled to Syria to fight. Yes they all had some link to being Muslim, but really the evidence doesn't indicate that they were 'triggered' or that being a Muslim was the reason for their actions. In fact, neither of them were devout Muslim, that's a total misconception. The perception that an individual is scouted and radicalised is pretty much unfounded also.

What those young men all had in common instead was a stark disassociation from society. All people are vulnerable to falling foul of that, you don't have to be identifying as Muslim. You can pretty much lump our chav culture in there, our poor and uneducated types and those who have severe drug addiction. Hell, even young white lads who fall victim to feeling emasculated through societal pressures and end up becoming reclusive virgins addicted to pokemon can be classed as socially disassociated.

Anyone who feels let down by society will easily embrace something that empowers them and makes them feel part of something bigger. Unfortunately the lure of ISIL and extremism was enticing for some of these guys. What they all had in common wasn't Conservative ideals, they were all quite usual in background and upbringing. However, they all lacked decent education and/or jobs and they were left to feel outcast from society....

It's the main reason why I sneer at anyone preaching ignorant wide sweeping guff. Those people are as much a cause for the problems we have as the Islamic extremists are. They compound the issues.
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Mr Jack said:
You do know "turn the other cheek" is a Christian concept, right? "But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also" - Matthew 5:39.
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Yes, I do actually. You do know that you don't have to believe in a sky fairy to use a common every day expression (irrespective of its origin).

I've used to tell my mate he needed to be careful and not go around sowing his oats - that didn't make me a ****ing farmer.

And what's with putting ',right' at the end of every post - is this like a more articulate form of a chav 'innit' or am I missing something here.

Maybe it's a placeholder to denote sarcasm. If so it's rather misplaced.
 
RaohNS said:
:rolleyes:

So an Iranian then.
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I had to smile when the headline in the BBC is German-Iranian and they show a clip where the German police are holding a news conference where they call him 'Iranian'.

I bet all the SJW's were crying in to their granola this morning when they discovered it wasn't a 'white supremacist' - It's been reported shortly after shooting these people he ran off to a mosque. I'm sure its ...... "NTDWI" though and the reports of the usual chanting mean nothing.

Can someone inform the BBC that Allah Ackbar actually means 'God is Great' and not 'Nothing to do with Islam'.
 
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RoboCod said:
Oh so potentially we're looking at a youth who felt disassociated from society, bullied and poorly educated? Pretty much what I state repeatedly in these kind of threads regarding the reasons why many people turn to extremist ways and do lunatic things.

Who'd have thought it, our vilifying of people based on religion might not be exactly right. In fact what is evidential is by doing that we are exacerbating the issue, and being a cause of the problem. We should be embracing people, welcoming them into society and being integrated.
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Possibly have a good point. By creating divisions, suspicion and internal violence in society, extremist organisations are winning by dividing and conquering. This could be ANY organisation that thrives on having a race/religion based enemy (BNP/BF/ISIS and whatever).

If you look at the kind of people who tend to join 'nutjob' political organisations, they tend to be poor, rejected, uneducated, feel like 'others' are getting a better deal and pushed aside. They are scared. And yes, there are a good amount of mouth-breathers and thugs in the ranks as well (EDL is a pretty good example).

By ignoring the scare stories, being somewhat accepting and more open-minded, these sort of organisations won't gain traction as people will have too much to lose.

Give them something to value above violence in reaction to persecution and things may change.
 
Malevolence said:
If only he'd have taken the opportunity when it presented itself.

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Why would he want to kill a successful politician, one that has done a lot for her country? She has only made one mistake about the refugees but even there she is supported by a large portion of Germany. I would rather have her than the buffoons we have in this country.
 
Whether this was an Muslim terrorist or a right-wing terrorist I think it's safe to say the current situation in the world has created plenty more of the former and I don't think it's really going to be that long before we see plenty of the latter with the general levels of discontentment and the whipping up of the mob by nationalistic and right wing politicians.
 
do_ron_ron said:
German Iranian who has spent several years in Germany. Beginning to look like a right wing nut job on the anniversary of the Norwegian guy. Rather than the 'Allah ....' he apparently said 'I am German'.
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I saw the clip from the rooftop where he said '"Ich bin ein deutscher', but there are reports from someone inside the McDonald's where this all (apparently) started where he was shouting the usual slogans. Nothing is really adding up to be honest - Half Iranian white supremacist? Isn't that a complete contradiction?!
 
The excuses list needs amending again, if he turns out to be "of the faith".

#? : A right wing nut job on the anniversary of the Norwegian guy.

#? : A youth who felt disassociated from society, bullied and poorly educated.

#? : Being somewhat accepting and more open-minded, these sort of organisations won't gain traction as people will have too much to lose.

#? : Whatever, turn the other cheek and forgive him.

#? : He got in early, so nothing to do with Merkel's decision for Germany to step up and take a reasonable share of the refugee burden.

I bet you guys had awesome excuses for late homework..... ;)
 
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b0redj0rd said:
I saw the clip from the rooftop where he said '"Ich bin ein deutscher', but there are reports from someone inside the McDonald's where this all (apparently) started where he was shouting the usual slogans. Nothing is really adding up to be honest - Half Iranian white supremacist? Isn't that a complete contradiction?!
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So he cannot be a right wing nut job without being white???? Bit of a racist statement.
 
b0redj0rd said:
I saw the clip from the rooftop where he said '"Ich bin ein deutscher', but there are reports from someone inside the McDonald's where this all (apparently) started where he was shouting the usual slogans. Nothing is really adding up to be honest - Half Iranian white supremacist? Isn't that a complete contradiction?!
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I don't see why there should not be WS organisations in Iran.

But either way, the guy was nuts.
 
do_ron_ron said:
Why would he want to kill a successful politician, one that has done a lot for her country? She has only made one mistake about the refugees but even there she is supported by a large portion of Germany. I would rather have her than the buffoons we have in this country.
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I guess we'll see how supported she is at the elections next year :cool:
 
b0redj0rd said:
If it's racist to say that, it certainly isn't intentional. I presume 'white supremacists' are actually .. You know, white.
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Or deluded which could also explain the act itself.

Although the amount of stupidness to believe your skin colour is something else would be quite a feat.
 
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