Ansbach explosion: Syrian asylum seeker blows himself up in Germany

RaohNS · 25 Jul 2016 at 18:37

gettothechopper said:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/editorialguidelines/guidance/terrorism-language

There ya go - but ot course you already knew that !

I'm sure you will see it as some silly conspiracy against you, rather than a thoughtful attempt to avoid emotive language

No if they change their wording fair enough. Their wording was Surian Man Blows himself up (thus implying an innocence).

Again though... BBC other sources report much more and faster now. If anything on some topics BBC are weeks behind. Rampaging migrants for example. ******** was full of them... Not a peep from Aunty.

gettothechopper · 25 Jul 2016 at 18:44

RaohNS said:
No if they change their wording fair enough. Their wording was Surian Man Blows himself up (thus implying an innocence).

Again though... BBC other sources report much more and faster now. If anything on some topics BBC are weeks behind. Rampaging migrants for example. ******** was full of them... Not a peep from Aunty.

As I keep explaining, the BBC wants to only report confirmed information, rather than having a commercial interest in getting the first scoop, hence sky news is usually quicker to report breaking news (but as a side effect sometimes puts out wrong information)

which story are you talking about - there are many recent articles on the BBC about migrant riots in Calais, Greece, Macedonia, Austria, etc

RaohNS · 25 Jul 2016 at 18:53

gettothechopper said:
As I keep explaining, the BBC wants to only report confirmed information, rather than having a commercial interest in getting the first scoop, hence sky news is usually quicker to report breaking news (but as a side effect sometimes puts out wrong information)

which story are you talking about - there are many recent articles on the BBC about migrant riots in Calais, Greece, Macedonia, Austria, etc

No I am referring to the early waves of migrant riots from last year. They were all over ******** and so called "nutjob" media sites but videos in this instance don't lie.

Well twitter was releasing info as confirmed way before BBC. I think even Breitbart had it up earlier

Amp34 · 25 Jul 2016 at 19:56

RaohNS said:
A maniac running round with a machete stabbing people.. His intention must have been to....

Are you also going to insinuate that it was not the man but the machete that was killing the people?

No. I'm pointing out that, much to the annoyance of many on this forum insisting it was a terrorist attack, it was' a terrorist attackt.

Yet so many people jumped to that conclusion, complained about the fact the media didn't report his religion and didn't instantly jump on the terrorism bandwagon.

In the end the media got it right, the people asking others not jump to conclusions got it right and the people arguing it was a terrorist attack before any of the facts came out got it wrong. Again.

All I'm asking is people look at the facts and make a decision based on that, rather than run with preconceived ideas that have been shown to be wrong several times in the last few weeks.

Amp34 · 25 Jul 2016 at 19:58

gettothechopper said:
Face palm

You didn't know that when you were squinnying that the BBC hadn't jumped to the same conclusion as you

And he was wrong in the previous threads. That won't stand in the way of his one man crusade against the "MSM" not jumping to conclusions.

Dis86 · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:00

Amp34 said:
No. I'm pointing out that, much to the annoyance of many on this forum insisting it was a terrorist attack, it wasn't.

Yet so many people jumped to that conclusion, complained about the fact the media didn't report his religion and didn't instantly jump on the terrorism bandwagon.

In the end the media got it right, the people asking others not jump to conclusions got it right and the people arguing it was a terrorist attack before any of the facts came out got it wrong. Again.

All I'm asking is people look at the facts and make a decision based on that, rather than run with preconceived ideas that have been shown to be wrong several times in the last few weeks.

The problem is, as I pointed out, the German authorities and media have a habit of withholding certain important facts. This leads people to jump to (incorrect) assumptions.

Tummy · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:02

Dis86 said:
The problem is, as I pointed out, the German authorities and media have a habit of withholding certain important facts. This leads people to jump to (incorrect) assumptions.

Eh? If you want to make a judgement, just do not form a judgement until you have more information?

Dis86 · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:03

Tummy said:
Eh? If you want to make a judgement, just do not form a judgement until you have more information?

I'm going to point you towards the beating a child thread

People do make judgements without all of the facts.

Amp34 · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:05

Dis86 said:
The problem is, as I pointed out, the German authorities and media have a habit of withholding certain important facts. This leads people to jump to (incorrect) assumptions.

As we debated in the other thread not discussing someone religion when it is irrelevant to a case is not withholding information.

The point still stands though. The authorities have plenty more information than us and have plenty more time with that information than us. Why not just wait 12 hours until the authorities actually release proper information before making judgement calls.

All this insistence that every news reported event is terrorism until proven otherwise just plays into terrorists hands, causes undue friction on to whole groups of people and isolates people even more.

Lets just debate the facts, rather than fill the gap with incorrect speculation.

Tummy · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:08

Dis86 said:
I'm going to point you towards the beating a child thread

People do make judgements without all of the facts.

Absolutely. However; a better example would be the people at the start of that thread that literally did not read the article and spouted nonsense.

Arazi · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:13

Amp34 said:
As we debated in the other thread not discussing someone religion when it is irrelevant to a case is not withholding information.

The point still stands though. The authorities have plenty more information than us and have plenty more time with that information than us. Why not just wait 12 hours until the authorities actually release proper information before making judgement calls.

All this insistence that every news reported event is terrorism until proven otherwise just plays into terrorists hands, causes undue friction on to whole groups of people and isolates people even more.

Lets just debate the facts, rather than fill the gap with incorrect speculation.

This latest bomber scum pledged allegiance to Allah, IS\ISIS and some leader, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi i think in a video on his phone.

Facts, awesome.

Amp34 · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:23

Hey, I think the point went that way >>>

If you run you may catch it.

Dis86 · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:25

Amp34 said:
As we debated in the other thread not discussing someone religion when it is irrelevant to a case is not withholding information.

The point still stands though. The authorities have plenty more information than us and have plenty more time with that information than us. Why not just wait 12 hours until the authorities actually release proper information before making judgement calls.

All this insistence that every news reported event is terrorism until proven otherwise just plays into terrorists hands, causes undue friction on to whole groups of people and isolates people even more.

Lets just debate the facts, rather than fill the gap with incorrect speculation.

Oh without a doubt the facts should be debated. The issue i'm trying to point out though is that the German authorities and media have a recent track record of being somewhat obtuse!

dowie · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:27

it seems to have been more Islamists than not in the past week or so

three obvious Islamist attacks:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
this suicide bombing(Germany) - Muslim/Islamist(Syrian), loves ISIS

the train attack (Germany) - Muslim/Islamist(Afghan), loves ISIS

the truck attack in Nice (France) - Muslim/Islamist(French/Tunisian), loves ISIS
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

one non Islamist attacks:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Shooting in Munich (Germany) - Muslim(Iranian/German), unsure of position on ISIS but also interest in school shootings, far right and seemingly mental issues & bullied etc...
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

two that might be Islam or backwards culture related but unclear:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
the holiday maker attack (France) - angry Muslim(Tunisian), unsure if Islamist or an ISIS supporter... was seemingly provoked because he believes shorts are inappropriate and worth trying to kill someone for.

knife attack (Germany) - Muslim (Syrian), unsure of position on ISIS but seemingly thought it was OK to kill a woman who wasn't interested in him sexually.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I do think that there is some merit in looking to reduce immigration from some countries with very different values to the west and then reassessing in future.

Dis86 · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:30

Hmm Dowie...there seems to be a connection between all those attackers.

Xordium · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:31

dowie said:
it seems to have been more Islamists than not in the past week or so

this suicide bombing(Germany) - Muslim/Islamist(Syrian), loves ISIS
the train attack (Germany) - Muslim/Islamist(Afghan), loves ISIS

the holiday maker attack (France) - angry Muslim(Tunisian), unsure if Islamist or an ISIS supporter... was seemingly provoked because he believes shorts are inappropriate and worth trying to kill someone for.

the truck attack in Nice (France) - Muslim/Islamist(French/Tunisian), loves ISIS

vs 2 non Islamist attacks:

Shooting in Munich (Germany) - Muslim(Iranian/German), unsure of position on ISIS but also interest in school shootings, far right and seemingly mental issues & bullied etc...

knife attack (Germany) - Muslim (Syrian), unsure of position on ISIS but seemingly thought it was OK to kill a woman who wasn't interested in him sexually.

How are the last two not related to Islam?!? Surely it's Islam's strange ideas on such things that justified the acts. People don't have to pledge their allegiance to ISIS to be bonkers ... the Koran can justify people doing that without ISIS input.

Amp34 · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:36

dowie said:
it seems to have been more Islamists than not in the past week or so

three obvious Islamist attacks:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
this suicide bombing(Germany) - Muslim/Islamist(Syrian), loves ISIS

the train attack (Germany) - Muslim/Islamist(Afghan), loves ISIS

the truck attack in Nice (France) - Muslim/Islamist(French/Tunisian), loves ISIS
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

one non Islamist attacks:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Shooting in Munich (Germany) - Muslim(Iranian/German), unsure of position on ISIS but also interest in school shootings, far right and seemingly mental issues & bullied etc...
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

two that might be Islam or backwards culture related but unclear:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
the holiday maker attack (France) - angry Muslim(Tunisian), unsure if Islamist or an ISIS supporter... was seemingly provoked because he believes shorts are inappropriate and worth trying to kill someone for.

knife attack (Germany) - Muslim (Syrian), unsure of position on ISIS but seemingly thought it was OK to kill a woman who wasn't interested in him sexually.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So three non islamist attacks and three Islamist attacks. You're also forgetting the shooting in Boston that people were questioning being terrorism before the facts came out.

So that's more unrelated than related. Which is my point.

Several of those attacks have also been perpetrated by people with histories of mental illnesses.

All I'm asking is that people refrain from writing multiple pages complaining about muslims/terrorism and the bias of the media before the facts of an incident are know.

dowie · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:36

Xordium said:
How are the last two not related to Islam?!? Surely it's Islam's strange ideas on such things that justified the acts. People don't have to pledge their allegiance to ISIS to be bonkers ... the Koran can justify people doing that without ISIS input.

have modified my post... you're right re: one of them I think, quite possibly Islam related. the Munich shooting on the other hand isn't so clear cut and the guy was bullied + arguably as inspired by other mass shootings by mental people who weren't Muslims.

dowie · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:39

Amp34 said:
So three non islamist attacks and three Islamist attacks. You're also forgetting the shooting in Boston that people were questioning being terrorism before the facts came out.

No that is three Islamist attacks, one non-Islamist attacks and two that might not be inspired by ISIS per say but religion/culture seem to be a factor

What Boston shooting? I'm commenting on European attacks in the past week-ish- there are shootings in the US pretty much daily and there are Islamist related attacks on a daily basis in the middle east too.

Amp34 · 25 Jul 2016 at 20:40

Dis86 said:
Hmm Dowie...there seems to be a connection between all those attackers.

That the media have reported them because they may at the time of occurrence have been terrorism related. Unlike the dozens of other incidents that have occurred during that time that certainly weren't?

Out of interest how many murders have happened in Western Europe in the last month?

Xordium said:
How are the last two not related to Islam?!? Surely it's Islam's strange ideas on such things that justified the acts. People don't have to pledge their allegiance to ISIS to be bonkers ... the Koran can justify people doing that without ISIS input.

How do we know Islam has anything to do with them? They could just be violent individuals that happen to be muslim. We don't know, but using preconceived notions to assume they are isn't the right way to go about it.