UK: Two Systems of Justice

[RaohNS]

Robinson is a bit of an asswipe but people would have done better listening to him in the early days when he was calling out Muslim grooming gangs. That could have prevented hundreds/thousands of girls from being raped.

I enjoy watching the Oxford/Cambridge union videos of various persons and will say I found his one of the more intriguing.

Beyond that he's not worth the time of the day.

 

[Pudney]

One was a hate crime, the other has either not been prosecuted (freedom of expression) or treat only as a public order offence.
I believe people have been jailed for the first. Given a maximum of a £50 fine for the second.

A poppy isn't mean to be a political or religious "thing". It is a way to remember those who died in armed conflict (without judging the relative merits). Dishonouring that wouldn't be a hate crime based on the definition as it currently stands. That's why it's different. That doesn't make it more acceptable, or make one less or more important. It's just different. In the same way being convicted of burglary (as a random example) is different to being convicted of hate crime. Neither are acceptable but the punishment is different.

 

[platypus]

Who threw him out of the pub, the police, or the landlord deciding he didn't want a racist thug in his pub?

Looks like the rozzers kicked him out despite the landlord saying he was no issue? I wonder which pub it was. There are a couple of EDL pubs in Cambridge.

 

[FishFluff]

The guy has had so many warnings and has been treated so lightly in the past. As far as i am concerned, he has been treated so as to not create a matyr and stir up the hate groups he has manage to put together. His treatment can be compared to the treatment of other hate preachers.

But enough about scorza...

 

[Tunney]

A poppy isn't mean to be a political or religious "thing".

Many would disagree, including FIFA and the tabloids ("remembering our dead", etc.).

 

[Dis86]

A poppy isn't mean to be a political or religious "thing". It is a way to remember those who died in armed conflict (without judging the relative merits). Dishonouring that wouldn't be a hate crime based on the definition as it currently stands. That's why it's different. That doesn't make it more acceptable, or make one less or more important. It's just different. In the same way being convicted of burglary (as a random example) is different to being convicted of hate crime. Neither are acceptable but the punishment is different.

Could you pass that memo on to UEFA?

And I don't disagree that they're very different, however consider this, which one do you think would offend more people in this country?

 

[zoomee]

It's not my point, it's a point made by the Gatestone Institute.

not biased at all then is it?

http://www.alternet.org/investigati...s-spreading-islamophobic-hate-across-atlantic

The Gatestone Institute, a New York-based think tank, has become one of the most important hubs in America’s Islamophobia industry, pumping out reams of dangerous anti-Muslim propaganda of the kind lapped up by far-right mass murderer Anders Breivik. The transatlantic dimensions of Gatestone’s influence have so far gone largely unnoticed, but its close links to several British groups, including the Quilliam Foundation, Stand for Peace and the Henry Jackson Society deserve close scrutiny.

 

[Dis86]

That website is hilarious 'post election stress'.

 

[zoomee]

That website is hilarious 'post election stress'.

Almost as hilarious as yours and scorza's blatant bigotry but hey

http://www.middleeasteye.net/columns/white-supremacists-heart-whitehall-789183852

The Gatestone Institute is well known as being one of the driving forces (aka funders) of both the Quilliam Foundation and the Henry Jackson Society here in the UK - BOTH well known anti-islamic organisations.

http://rightweb.irc-online.org/profile/gatestone_institute/

More about Nina Rosenwald here:
https://www.thenation.com/article/sugar-mama-anti-muslim-hate/

Want me to carry on or you going to keep 'sympathising with the racists?'

 

[robgmun]

Yes, being a racist idiot puts him in a very unfortunate position.

Two posts before a fail the SJW's are out in force with their special form of bigotry today!

Let me tell you something before you make a further fool of yourself, he's now part of the quilliam foundation

 

[Malevolence]

Anybody care to hazard a guess why Lady Justice is blindfolded? I'll give you a clue, it's got nothing to do with 50 Shades of Grey.

If we're all happy that in modern Britain we are all equal, but some are more equal than others, then fine, I'll go back in my box.

Justice atop the Old Bailey isn't blindfolded though.

 

[Destination]

Anybody care to hazard a guess why Lady Justice is blindfolded? I'll give you a clue, it's got nothing to do with 50 Shades of Grey.

If we're all happy that in modern Britain we are all equal, but some are more equal than others, then fine, I'll go back in my box.

Why don't you go fund him, start a campaign, raise the profile of the racists and get him off his charges...
Chaudry is in jail. No-one is defending that ****.

justice might be blind, but she isn't deaf, she can hear racists a mile away.

 

[Dis86]

Almost as hilarious as yours and scorza's blatant bigotry but hey

http://www.middleeasteye.net/columns/white-supremacists-heart-whitehall-789183852

The Gatestone Institute is well known as being one of the driving forces (aka funders) of both the Quilliam Foundation and the Henry Jackson Society here in the UK - BOTH well known anti-islamic organisations.

http://rightweb.irc-online.org/profile/gatestone_institute/

More about Nina Rosenwald here:
https://www.thenation.com/article/sugar-mama-anti-muslim-hate/

Want me to carry on or you going to keep 'sympathising with the racists?'

I fail to see where I've sympathised...however yet again you're letting your prejudices shine through.

I stand by my point, that first link was a pathetic joke of a site. Whilst at no point however have i disputed what you're stating about the topic at hand. However yet again...prejudice from you.

 

[Dis86]

Why don't you go fund him, start a campaign, raise the profile of the racists and get him off his charges...
Chaudry is in jail. No-one is defending that ****.

justice might be blind, but she isn't deaf, she can hear racists a mile away.

But he was defended though. Very heavily by a number of organisations such as CAGE as has already been stated. That's the point.

 

[RDM]

The Gatestone Institute is well known as being one of the driving forces (aka funders) of both the Quilliam Foundation and the Henry Jackson Society here in the UK - BOTH well known anti-islamic organisations.

Isn't Quilliam run by Muslims? It is an anti-Islamist organisation but I didn't think it was anti-Islam, just perceived as so by those that are not as keen on its view of the viability of a moderate Islam compatible with British values.

 

[Dis86]

Isn't Quilliam run by Muslims? It is an anti-Islamist organisation but I didn't think it was anti-Islam, just perceived as so by those that are not as keen on its view of the viability of a moderate Islam compatible with British values.

It's founder and a large number of its board members are muslim, yes. It's the fact that they speak out about and against certain organisations that certain members on here quite obviously have sympathies for that causes issues.

 

[Pudney]

Many would disagree, including FIFA and the tabloids ("remembering our dead", etc.).

Could you pass that memo on to UEFA?

FIFA

And it will be interesting to see the outcome of the disciplinary process as it is about remembering UK armed forces who have died in conflict. It isn't about advancing any agenda whether they died in a politically valid way (e.g. the poppy is equally about those who died in the Iraq war).

And I don't disagree that they're very different, however consider this, which one do you think would offend more people in this country?

Quite frankly justice isn't about how many people get offended. It should be an irrelevant factor to the process of law, particularly as some people will get offended at the most inane things! Your example of urinating on a war memorial is a particularly good example actually (or burning a poppy). It is incredibly offensive, but is that on par with racially aggravated assault or other forms of "hate" crime? The answer should normally be no, particularly given the urinating or burning doesn't actually interfere with another person's life.

 

[Dis86]

FIFA

And it will be interesting to see the outcome of the disciplinary process as it is about remembering UK armed forces who have died in conflict. It isn't about advancing any agenda whether they died in a politically valid way (e.g. the poppy is equally about those who died in the Iraq war).



Quite frankly justice isn't about how many people get offended. It should be an irrelevant factor to the process of law, particularly as some people will get offended at the most inane things! Your example of urinating on a war memorial is a particularly good example actually (or burning a poppy). It is incredibly offensive, but is that on par with racially aggravated assault or other forms of "hate" crime? The answer should normally be no, particularly given the urinating or burning doesn't actually interfere with another person's life.

Nor does dumping a pigs head outside a mosque. From your statement there it should just be dealt with as littering. At the end of the day religion is just another motive for committing a crime against someone. Why is it a special flower? Burning a poppy, burning a quran, burning a bible. It's simply aiming to do something to offend someone via the same method. Yet 2 of those (one in particular) will net you a significantly longer sentence than the other. Why?

Also thanks for the correction, it shows my extreme level of interest in football!

 

[Caged]

lmao white knighting Tommy Robinson

 

[Pudney]

Nor does dumping a pigs head outside a mosque. From your statement there it should just be dealt with as littering.

What sentence are you unhappy about specifically for this crime as they normally appear minor convictions? Some examples below.

I've found one from 2011 where the person was given a suspended sentence (seems sensible):

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-14236223

Another where a person chained a pig's head AND left graffiti (which would be criminal damage), this resulted in a four month prison sentence:

http://news.sky.com/story/man-jailed-for-hanging-pigs-head-outside-mosque-10471521

A 2012 case where the perpetrator was given a 12 week suspended sentence (I feel like this website doesn't appear entirely unbiased given its name I'd hasten to add):

https://edlcriminals.com/2013/07/29...eps-of-a-muslim-community-centre-spared-jail/