Alternative medicine strikes again

I'm fairly sure Charles sees an actual doctor whatever his hobbies are.

Of course he does (the Royal Physician), as the health of the monarch-in-waiting is too important to be left in the hands of the alternative medicine practitioners.....but if Charley announced that every time he got ill, it would harm the sales of his own homeopathy treatments (it's a hobby, and a business he owns).
 
Maybe the US could do with a similar gagging law on advertising cancer treatments. Funny thing is the one we have is really old, older than the NHS.
 
Medicine in this country is taken a little more seriously it seems. Luckily having a Phd in fictitious medicine studies does not make you a Dr of medicine over here. We also lack the full fat used car dealer culture that they seem to have over there, where everything has a price and if you can sue for it, then you deserve to get it!

Unfortunately it may just be a matter of time......Tory plans are to privatise the NHS and pursue trade agreements with Trump (which would involve healthcare businesses). Trump's plans and appointments involving healthcare don't bode well for the UK if the Tory plans go ahead.
 
One type of treatment isn't going to work for everyone as there are many factors involved and everyone is different.

If that was true in the way you believe, standardised medical treatments would be useless. And yet... they're actually fantastic. Because they work.

But to say this and other alternative therapies don't work is naive in my opinion, because they can and do work with plenty of people who can testify to that.

Testimonials are not evidence.

Take a look into how many people die due to conventional chemo therapy rather than the actual cancer itself

People don't die due to conventional chemotherapy; they die due to cancer.

After the billions spent on cancer research, the years looking into this and the number of people searching for cures and treatments, is chemo really the best we can come up with as a species to treat and cure cancer, seriously - does no one find that even slightly odd?

Chemo is just one of many successful cancer treatments offered by medical science.

Do we honestly believe cancer is that hard to figure out?

There are more than 100 different types of cancer. Yes, it's hard to figure out.

The key issue here is profit; if there were cheap and readily available cures for cancer, do you think the drug industry would want people to know that, of course not

Nonsense. There are cheap and readily available cures for lots of things, thanks to medical science. And guess what? They're widely available.

But surely you may say - the Drs would realise this and wouldn't stand for that? The Drs go by what they're told and taught in medical schools and by conventional journals and monitored/sponsored peer testing and trials - those that do discover or point point out alternatives are quickly put down and ostracised by their peers, it's by design and has been going on for decades.

Doctors get cancer too. Doctors' families get cancer too. You are telling me that doctors are knowingly suppressing a cure that they themselves would benefit from. Utter madness.
 
You're saying that as if it was a true statement, it is used as treatment in Russia and associated countries.

...where it has a success rate of ~50%.

If you're dying of antibiotic resistant bacteria in this country and you've run out of options you can with the help of about £5k travel to Georgia (the country below Russia) and give it a go: http://www.mrsaphages.com/staphylococcus-treatment/

Oh wow, a mere £5k and a flight to Georgia for a treatment with a success rate of ~50%! That sure as hell sounds viable to me. Why isn't everyone doing this?!

Alternatively... I could just pick up some antibiotics at the local chemist for £6.
 
You're saying that as if it was a true statement, it is used as treatment in Russia and associated countries.

...where it has a success rate of ~50%.

In Russia, mixed phage preparations may have a therapeutic efficacy of 50%. This equates to the complete cure of 50 of 100 patients with terminal antibiotic-resistant infection.

If you're dying of antibiotic resistant bacteria in this country and you've run out of options you can with the help of about £5k travel to Georgia (the country below Russia) and give it a go: http://www.mrsaphages.com/staphylococcus-treatment/

Oh wow, a mere £5k and a flight to Georgia for a treatment with a success rate of ~50%! That sure as hell sounds viable to me. Why isn't everyone doing this?!

Alternatively... I could just pick up some antibiotics at the local chemist for £6.

Alternatively you could work on the comprehension, I say antibiotic resistant bacteria, the link says 50% success on terminal antibiotic resistant bacteria and you reply with a glib dismissal that you'll go down to the chemist and pick up... some antibiotics...
 
seems odd that the book is allowed - the 1939 cancer act specifically makes this illegal.

The 1939 Cancer Act is about direct advertising. It doesn't make cancer cure books illegal:

At its heart, the current incarnation of the Cancer Act is designed to protect cancer patients and the public from being bombarded with adverts for cancer treatments, from any source, including medical professionals, pharmaceutical companies, alternative practitioners, or anyone else.

This is an important point: the Act functions across the board, preventing pharmaceutical companies from hawking the latest cancer drugs through advertisements in the pages of UK newspapers or on TV, as well as shutting down UK-accessible websites claiming that magic crystals can treat tumours.

...But what about the claim that the Act is ‘suppressing the cure for cancer’ – something we often hear through our social media channels?

As we’ve previously discussed at length, there is no conspiracy to ‘hide the cure’.

Any person or company with a genuine cure for cancer would stand to make huge amounts of money – not to mention save millions of lives and shower themselves with scientific and humanitarian glory in the process.

And cancer affects us all: to suggest that scientists, doctors, nurses, charity and pharma company employees are wilfully hiding a cure while their family members, friends and colleagues die of the disease is offensive in the extreme.

The Cancer Act exists to prevent direct advertising of any treatments to the public – evidence-based or not, proven or unproven. But it doesn’t stop adverts and information reaching the doctors, nurses and pharmacists responsible for treating patients (whether private or NHS), the politicians and hospital governors who make decisions about how NHS resources are used, or researchers working to develop and test new therapies.

So, even if there were a conspiracy – which there isn’t – it’s hard to see how the Act could prevent genuinely effective treatments from ultimately reaching the patients that need them.

(Source).
 
Alternatively you could work on the comprehension, I say antibiotic resistant bacteria, the link says 50% success on terminal antibiotic resistant bacteria and you reply with a glib dismissal that you'll go down to the chemist and pick up... some antibiotics...

£5k and a trip to Georgia is still not a viable solution.
 
£5k and a trip to Georgia is still not a viable solution.

You quote me but don't read me which is awkward, I've been saying I would like it to be available in this country.

The only way you can take a punt on phages right now if is you do have that money to spend. Clearly it's not an option if you don't.
 
I did think that as I wrote it. However pancreatic has very poor survivability so I stand by it, lucky man.

Pancreatic cancer killed my mother but not before eating all of her other organs first. So I support anything which works and despise people who try to con people with snake oil.
 
Homeopathy I find despicable and is reckless endangerment and should be outlawed as such.


The other woo woo stuff is out of hand as well and even the UK Government has fallen prey to it. I'm pretty sure there was a thread on here a few years ago about about the bloke who sold dowsing bomb/mine detectors to our military who actually used them!. He was exposed in the US by James Randi so he came over here and ran the same scam.
 
The other woo woo stuff is out of hand as well and even the UK Government has fallen prey to it. I'm pretty sure there was a thread on here a few years ago about about the bloke who sold dowsing bomb/mine detectors to our military who actually used them!. He was exposed in the US by James Randi so he came over here and ran the same scam.

That was pretty nuts - even early on a simple google search showed fairly definitely he was a charlatan. Yet still many countries bought his stuff.
 
Alternatively you could work on the comprehension, I say antibiotic resistant bacteria, the link says 50% success on terminal antibiotic resistant bacteria and you reply with a glib dismissal that you'll go down to the chemist and pick up... some antibiotics...


As it happens the guy I was talking about works with a Russian phage group who have sent him some of the theraputic cocktails. One of the major reasons why Russian-style phage therapy would never fly in the UK is that they have no idea which phages are in the cocktails. It's a soup of things which is pretty crudely purified (still has bacterial DNA in it, and I'd be surprised if it didn't have bacterial cell components too) and contains an unknown number of phage types including phages which probably have no medical relevance. One of the themes of his PhD has been metagenomically sequencing them to find out what is in there because, as I said, the manufacturers have no clue.

It's probably worth pointing out that the source for that 50% claim was published in "Chemistry and Life", which doesn't appear to be a peer reviewed journal.
 
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I'm not a relevant russian doctor so I couldn't say otherwise. However they seem to be having meaningful results despite or because of their procedures.

Russian crudeness aside phages are already being produced for food treatment by american companies so presumably there is an acceptable way to isolate, cultivate and purify phages for use whether it is the russian way or otherwise.
 
If alternative medicine worked companies would alter it enough to be patentable and sell it. The argument that it's not profitable isn't a great one. [..]

Fake "medicine" is already hugely profitable, so anyone arguing that it works but is suppressed because it can't be used to make a profit is deluded or lying.

If a company did discover an actual cure for all forms of cancer they'd have such a huge halo effect they could sell aspirin for £1 a tablet and people would still buy it.

Not that such a thing exists. Anyone who genuinely wonders why people haven't found a single cure for the hundreds of different forms of cancer when even the same form can act differently in different people and every single form is the patient's own cells obviously knows damn all about cancer. It's really easy to kill cancerous cells. Killing them without killing non-cancerous cells, i.e. killing the patient, that's a different thing entirely.
 
shame, should be.
in fact alternative medicine should be illegal unless proven to work.

Trouble is, that would make the conspiracy theorists position even stronger. (And their position is already quite strong, otherwise this wouldn't be an issue)

Also,

ALL medicine was "Alternative" until it was accepted.

If you had told Hypocratus that Disease (well some anyway) was cause by tiny creatures that could be killed with mould, they would have thrown you in the Adriatic.

More recently, a chap called Dr Semmelveis was kidnapped by his collegues, thrown in a Lunatic asylum and beaten to death for daring to suggest that Drs should wash their hands.

A total ban would have the effect of stifling research. since "Proving that something works" is actually quite surprisingly difficult. (Also a lot of "Alternative medicine" comes down to dietary theories, Where does medicine end and cookery begin|??)

(I refer you to this book https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Books/Ba...F8&qid=1484895626&sr=8-1&keywords=Bad+Science Even "Proper" scientists and researchers can generate ambiguous results that are open to massive abuse)
 
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