NK vs USA

StriderX said:
Pfft, have you seen america?

They love war, they love guns, they love killing eachother especially.
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I just don't think you understand American culture or why they have certain mindsets; like a lot of people who bash America constantly on here and other places. Guns are considered an important freedom, alongside free speech, and are representative for them of a non-oppressed civilian population who live in a democratic republic. They spend a lot of time learning about their early history in school, a big part of which was the American war of independence. They were in all fairness paying tax to a King and a country when they had no democratic representation (taxation without representation). They used guns to take back their freedom from that oppression, and the right to bear arms was then put in their constitution. If you try to take their guns away, rightly or wrongly, in their eyes you're only one small step from taking their freedom away because they lose the ability to fight against oppressive governments. That's why "they love guns".

Also things like hunting and target shooting is way more popular because of the large amount of open land they have over there. Guns are also needed for home defense because poverty is more extreme over there, crime is also more extreme. It's a realistic concern that someone could break in and murder you while in the middle of a robbery, over in the UK that's basically unheard of. They don't love killing each other, a lot of murders are gang related due to the drug smuggling from South America and extreme poverty in some areas.

Lastly I think war is glorified a bit too much, but to be fair when they intervene it's generally for a good reason. Communism was bad. Saddam Hussain was bad. The Taliban, Al-Qaeda and ISIS are bad. The world would definitely be a worse place if the Russians or Chinese were in charge.
 
Roar87 said:
I just don't think you understand American culture or why they have certain mindsets; like a lot of people who bash America constantly on here and other places. Guns are considered an important freedom, alongside free speech, and are representative for them of a non-oppressed civilian population who live in a democratic republic. They spend a lot of time learning about their early history in school, a big part of which was the American war of independence. They were in all fairness paying tax to a King and a country when they had no democratic representation (taxation without representation). They used guns to take back their freedom from that oppression, and the right to bear arms was then put in their constitution. If you try to take their guns away, rightly or wrongly, in their eyes you're only one small step from taking their freedom away because they lose the ability to fight against oppressive governments. That's why "they love guns".

Also things like hunting and target shooting is way more popular because of the large amount of open land they have over there. Guns are also needed for home defense because poverty is more extreme over there, crime is also more extreme. It's a realistic concern that someone could break in and murder you while in the middle of a robbery, over in the UK that's basically unheard of. They don't love killing each other, a lot of murders are gang related due to the drug smuggling from South America and extreme poverty in some areas.

Lastly I think war is glorified a bit too much, but to be fair when they intervene it's generally for a good reason. Communism was bad. Saddam Hussain was bad. The Taliban, Al-Qaeda and ISIS are bad. The world would definitely be a worse place if the Russians or Chinese were in charge.
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I read this in Donald Trump's mono voice and it was epic, I'm not even joking. Try it right now and I dare anyone to disagree, bigly or otherwise. That last paragraph (bolding mine) is outstanding.
 
Roar87 said:
I just don't think you understand American culture or why they have certain mindsets; like a lot of people who bash America constantly on here and other places. Guns are considered an important freedom, alongside free speech, and are representative for them of a non-oppressed civilian population who live in a democratic republic. They spend a lot of time learning about their early history in school, a big part of which was the American war of independence. They were in all fairness paying tax to a King and a country when they had no democratic representation (taxation without representation). They used guns to take back their freedom from that oppression, and the right to bear arms was then put in their constitution. If you try to take their guns away, rightly or wrongly, in their eyes you're only one small step from taking their freedom away because they lose the ability to fight against oppressive governments. That's why "they love guns".

Also things like hunting and target shooting is way more popular because of the large amount of open land they have over there. Guns are also needed for home defense because poverty is more extreme over there, crime is also more extreme. It's a realistic concern that someone could break in and murder you while in the middle of a robbery, over in the UK that's basically unheard of. They don't love killing each other, a lot of murders are gang related due to the drug smuggling from South America and extreme poverty in some areas.

Lastly I think war is glorified a bit too much, but to be fair when they intervene it's generally for a good reason. Communism was bad. Saddam Hussain was bad. The Taliban, Al-Qaeda and ISIS are bad. The world would definitely be a worse place if the Russians or Chinese were in charge.
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So many people you hear always seems to miss that part since the guns were owned back in the day to protect them from the Government.
 
V F said:
So many people you hear always seems to miss that part since the guns were owned back in the day to protect them from the Government.
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PFFT, once the Fed was instituted in the late 1800s/early 1900s, that idea became a fleeting reality.

It was also ok to own slaves back then (1700s) as well, entirely justified by even the most liberal of founders, guess that's OK today too.
 
Chinese troops are massing on the border too. It looks like the US and China have come to an agreement.
 
delta0 said:
Chinese troops are massing on the border too. It looks like the US and China have come to an agreement.
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Not necessarily - as per my other post it could just be a precaution just incase the US goes in seriously - in which case China would want to stabilise their border to prevent combat overspill and manage the displacement, etc. or a show of force to make the US feel less inclined to make moves against NK and disrupt the balance of things in the region and so on.

On the other hand China is losing a lot of patience with NK and being China that is likely a lot more than it shows on the surface, so its possible they will pre-empt US action and do something themselves.
 
NK is very dodgy, action against them is incredibly worrying. Any strike by the US and they're pot committed - pretty much have to go all in or South Korea and Japan are going to deal with an even worse fall out. Really hope he doesn't do anything yet but if he does it had better not be some token targeted strike like Syria but full on shock and awe... MOABs everywhere.
 
dowie said:
NK is very dodgy, action against them is incredibly worrying. Any strike by the US and they're pot committed - pretty much have to go all in or South Korea and Japan are going to deal with an even worse fall out. Really hope he doesn't do anything yet but if he does it had better not be some token targeted strike like Syria but full on shock and awe... MOABs everywhere.
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Its a tricky one - they are working with Iran quite a bit so in the long run they will likely have not insignificant strategic capabilities which would be better nipped in the bud on the other hand the longer they are left alone the more their stockpiles of fuel and ammo will run down - which are degrading faster than they are being replaced.

Participant said:
Couldn't China be amassing troops to defend NK from the USA rather than defend its own borders?
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Seems unlikely - China has made increasing noises about being frustrated by NK - Its possible the kim jong nam assassination was to pre-empt any potential moves by China (or others) to depose of the ruling elite and put their own figure head in via subversion.
 
Diddums said:
This is quite interesting.

http://gizmodo.com/what-time-is-the-new-korean-war-1794323131
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Interesting twist there - looks like China is putting pressure on NK to back down saying the US isn't messing about which is having the effect of NK believing the US is potentially going to actually come at them? and instead ramping up rather than ramping down.

EDIT: I like the conclusion: "Happy Easter weekend, everyone!" this might be one to remember.
 
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