Trains in the UK vs other countries

It would be non-renewal of franchises at the end of their current contract.

Or just wait for Stagecoach to decide they don't like the East Coast franchise and hand it back with no real penalties, forcing the government to run the service at least in the interim.
 
Nasher said:
We are the piggy bank of Europe, which is why they are so worked up about us leaving. If Corbyn does get in and transport gets privatised like he wants, it's another kick in the balls for them.
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What's Brexit got to do with private train companies? Are you saying it's the EU's fault?
 
Feef said:
Aye trains here are pretty decent. Use them once a week to go out to teach at an industrial park, occasionally a delay of about 1 minute, always clean, comfortable enough, and everyone is too absorbed in their phones to make any noise :p Took a longer journey round to the east coast as well, which was very comfortable.

That said, if I have to head up to Taipei/Taoyuan, I'll still usually take a bus - it's cheaper, you get your own reclining armchair and TV with a bunch of copies of SNES games, and operates 24 hours. I'll take the high speed train if I'm going to catch a plane (300km/h, whee)

For a price comparison, Tainan - Taipei (320km ish) is about £35 on the high speed rail (1h30), £10 on the bus (5-6 hours) or £20 on a regular train (4 hours ish).

Certainly don't miss paying for returns from London to Edinburgh when I was at university...
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I went from BKK to Chiang Mai via sleeper train. Approx 430 miles so similar distance from Glasgow to London.
Thai price for excellent sleeper with power, bed, restaurant etc = 880 baht ie £19
UK price from Glasgow to London equivalent sleeper today = £95 or 4200 baht

But yeah i agree the Taiwan buses are excellent. Big giant armchair, games console, tv, and is very cheap.

Makes you think about the service and standard of living of UK compared to other countries eh.
 
h4rm0ny said:
Ah, of course. Obvious in retrospect. Thank you.
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To expand on this, the franchise holders don't really own anything to do with the railways. Rolling stock is leased because it would not be possible to get someone to invest in new trains and then bid for a ten year franchise, stations are owned by Network Rail. Franchise operators collect fares, supply drivers and other staff, operate stations etc.

It's a weird mix of private and public that seems to just remove accountability from the system.
 
Caged said:
It gives a false impression to just do an exchange rate conversion when you're taking money you've earned in the UK and spending it in Thailand.

Run things through http://salaryconverter.nigelb.me for a better understanding, e.g.
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Well in live in Taiwan, so I'm talking about money earned here and spent here. That site, as far as I can see, doesn't have Taiwan as an option to compare. So for me, the bus or train options would be half an hour's salary, and the high speed option would be about an hour and a half's pay. Which in my last job in the UK would barely get me from London to Cambridge.

I'm aware I'm not earning what many locals do, but even they could afford the 4 hour train to Taipei with less than 3 hours work. Can you make a 4 hour train journey in the UK on 3 hours of minimum wage?

Actually, if you can, I'd be genuinely curious to know the route :p
 
Nasher said:
If Corbyn does get in and transport gets nationalised like he wants, it's another kick in the balls for them.
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Except we'd be paying through the absolute hind teeth to the foreign governments that own our infrastructure.

Oh look. Another example of the UK selling off its vital infrastructure coming back to haunt us. And this is way before we're paying a massively inflated guaranteed strike price to the French government.
 
They would just wait until the current contracts expire and not renew them, then they wouldn't have to pay anything.

But why we are paying someone else to build our power stations I don't know. The UK were the ones that pioneered nuclear power. I'm sure there is some under the table deals going on here.
 
KNiVES said:
The railways are miles better in France because they strike often, not in spite of them.

It's sad that we've lost our union support in this once proud workers' nation.
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From personal experience, I'd say in spite of :).

The reality of course is that its somewhere in the middle.
 
Feef said:
Well in live in Taiwan, so I'm talking about money earned here and spent here. That site, as far as I can see, doesn't have Taiwan as an option to compare. So for me, the bus or train options would be half an hour's salary, and the high speed option would be about an hour and a half's pay. Which in my last job in the UK would barely get me from London to Cambridge.

I'm aware I'm not earning what many locals do, but even they could afford the 4 hour train to Taipei with less than 3 hours work. Can you make a 4 hour train journey in the UK on 3 hours of minimum wage?
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I would suggest that the metric used for comparing British trains should be distance rather than hours. Otherwise you're giving an unfair weighting to them. ;)
 
platypus said:
Except we'd be paying through the absolute hind teeth to the foreign governments that own our infrastructure.

Oh look. Another example of the UK selling off its vital infrastructure coming back to haunt us. And this is way before we're paying a massively inflated guaranteed strike price to the French government.
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I totally agree we should be doing this ourself. However, whilst the setback in time affects us, the cost overrun seems to be falling on the backers. EDF are forecasting a fall in returns on this, so at least that part isn't falling on the tax payer.
 
Nasher said:
But why we are paying someone else to build our power stations I don't know. The UK were the ones that pioneered nuclear power. I'm sure there is some under the table deals going on here.
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Chiefly because our government would rather pay more in the long-term by which time they'll be gone, than more up front where they'll be blamed for the billions spent on nuclear power rather than hospital beds / police officers / Cause of the Moment.

Plus EDF and the Chinese are smart enough and have the money to see an opportunity when it presents itself and get in there.
 
h4rm0ny said:
EDF are forecasting a fall in returns on this, so at least that part isn't falling on the tax payer.
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From which EDF will only be seeking ways to recoup this lost return. We might have saved ourselves an increase in the cost of electricity for a number of years due to the genius of this [vastly] inflated strike price, but whats to stop EDF turning around in a years time and saying "we can't afford it without more investment from elsewhere"?
 
platypus said:
From which EDF will only be seeking ways to recoup this lost return. We might have saved ourselves an increase in the cost of electricity for a number of years due to the genius of this [vastly] inflated strike price, but whats to stop EDF turning around in a years time and saying "we can't afford it without more investment from elsewhere"?
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Us saying: "well you agreed a very generous price for the power already and if you don't like it, load your reactor onto a ferry and take it home to France". Actually, they couldn't even do the latter if it were possible - they have a contract which they need to honour. The UK government doesn't sit there like the rest of us, powerless when our energy supplier ups their price per unit. The price has been fixed. Very generously for EDF and China, in fact.

EDF and China are already making out like bandits over this. If their haul shrinks by 4%, they'll suck it up. They have to. They can't change their minds about building it and they can't just say "we've decided to alter the agreed price.
 
Without knowing the intimate details of the contract, I'd be very surprised if they haven't built some sort of eventuality into it for just that.
 
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