Charlie Gard

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Minstadave said:
Interestingly the Gard's are now pushing the wasted time angle:

http://www.charliesfight.org/

There is one simple reason for Charlie’s muscles deteriorating to the extent they are in now – TIME. A whole lot of wasted time. Had Charlie been given the treatment sooner he would have had had the potential to be a normal, healthy little boy.

GOSH will be tied up in court for a long time as these guys are living in a dream world.
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Reading down they are flat out stating that information was kept from them/their private doctors that would have made the difference in the court case too. GOSH will be tied up in court for a long time indeed.
 
hardkore said:
Oh the irony.

Tell me then, what is it i'm failing to understand?
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What is ironic about it?

Do you understand what was really being offered to Charlie? Do you understand why GOSH acted to block the treatment - just because they're mean?

It wasn't a treatment, it was an experiment, one that was unlikely to do anything or at best just make him live longer as a severely damaged child.
 
ubersonic said:
You can't know that for sure, the thing that needs to be remembered is that he had an incredibly rare condition that doctors in this country had no real experience with, the US doctors however had encountered and treated very similar and equally rare conditions. The odds were high that the treatment offered would have made a difference, the question is how much, not that that will ever be known because the UK hospital chose to block his transfer.
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Read the court judgements and the latest statement from GOSH. There was zero chance that the treatments being offered in the US would make any difference.

The first US doctor to claim that he could treat Charlie backtracked as soon as he realised the extent of Charlie's condition.

The more recent US doctor has never visited Charlie or read his medical reports. He's a fraud.

The only doctors who have ever claimed that they could treat Charlie are those speaking from ignorance.
 
Minstadave said:
He was prevented from going by the court. Physically you could still get him there.
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TheOracle said:
How?
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yea I'd be interested to know that too. how exactly could you get him there in his condition if the courts have blocked it? are there black market operators who will provide the medical care needed to transport people in such poor health?
 
Thekwango said:
yea I'd be interested to know that too. how exactly could you get him there in his condition if the courts have blocked it? are there black market operators who will provide the medical care needed to transport people in such poor health?
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Sorry I may have been unclear. Practically you could get him there if you physically wanted to fly him to the US you could take him, you'd need a special flight and ITU team to do it.

Legally he can't go.
 
Minstadave said:
Sorry I may have been unclear. Practically you could get him there if you physically wanted to fly him to the US you could take him, you'd need a special flight and ITU team to do it.

Legally he can't go.
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sorry to be a pedant but no you couldn't. where would you get the medical team from, if the courts have blocked it.
 
Minstadave said:
Sorry I may have been unclear. Practically you could get him there if you physically wanted to fly him to the US you could take him, you'd need a special flight and ITU team to do it.

Legally he can't go.
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This is where confusion comes from. If you can't take him legally, then he can't go.

So why did the other poster say he had the chance at going? I've read nothing that states he EVER at ANY point had the chance at going.
 
Thekwango said:
sorry to be a pedant but no you couldn't. where would you get the medical team from, if the courts have blocked it.
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What I was trying to say is there is nothing about his physical condition that would stop you taking him. You could put him on a plane and take him if it was allowed, even now.

I thought that was what the earlier poster was asking.

Legally as soon as the potential came up to go it was stopped. He never had the possibility to go from a legal sense.
 
The treatment has been used with limited success in cases of this disease, and has never been used for the specific variant that Charlie has. It was always a very long shot.
 
Caged said:
What experts are they in dispute with?
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The experts in the type of condition he has, the whole reason his parents wanted to take him from one world class hospital all the way to another world class hospital was so he could be treated by the best doctors in the field (while the staff at GOSH are marvelous they are not really trained/equipped for the type of condition Charlie has nor have they encountered it's type much before).
 
ubersonic said:
(while the staff at GOSH are marvelous they are not really trained/equipped for the type of condition Charlie has nor have they encountered it's type much before).
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Any evidence for that too? GOSH has a subspeciality paediatric mitochondrial disease service.

What special training and equipment does a paediatric metabolic service need to provide for mitochondrial depletion syndromes?
 
ubersonic said:
The fact they are in dispute with the experts kinda implies they may not be completely correct...
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But they're not in dispute with the experts. They're in dispute with one American doctor who had not visited Charlie, had not read his medical information, and had a financial interest in the drugs he was going to use for Charlie's treatment:

A new legal case was brought after American doctor Michio Hirano said he had new information and that experimental drugs could give the baby a chance of survival. But today his parents Connie Yates and Chris Gard ended their legal fight after it became clear the new evidence was not what they had hoped.

In a statement this afternoon, Great Ormond Street said they were disappointed when Dr Hirano admitted he had not visited Charlie or read his up-to-date medical information before giving evidence in court.

‘Throughout, his parents’ hopes have been sustained by advice received from overseas,’ the hospital said.

...In a lengthy statement explaining their position, GOSH said they were ‘optimistic’ when they first heard the doctor speak of new information, but this turned to ‘surprise and disappointment’ when he took the witness box on July 13, before he had even seen Charlie in person.

‘He stated that not only had he not visited the hospital to examine Charlie but in addition, he had not read Charlie’s contemporaneous medical records or viewed Charlie’s brain imaging or read all of the second opinions about Charlie’s condition (obtained from experts all of whom had taken the opportunity to examine him and consider his records) or even read the Judge’s decision made on 11 April.

‘Further, GOSH was concerned to hear the Professor state, for the first time, whilst in the witness box, that he retains a financial interest in some of the NBT (Nucleoside Bypass Therapy) compounds he proposed prescribing for Charlie.

‘Devastatingly, the information obtained since 13 July gives no cause for optimism. Rather, it confirms that whilst NBT may well assist others in the future, it cannot and could not have assisted Charlie.’
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(Source).

The doctor is a dodgy opportunist who intended to profit from the false hope he was selling Charlie's parents.
 
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