Would this be legal (Advertising at night)

ChroniC · 16 Nov 2017 at 20:33

My first thought is no, since it's not being done now and I'm sure I'm not some genius who has thought of this first.

Anyway. Was talking to a friend about his business and I wondered if using a very high powered focused light to create a bat symbol style thing in the clouds of their logo. Would it be illegal.

I'm guess some light pollution rules mean its not above board probably do with planes etc but I cannot find anyway of Googling the answer.

Anyone know.

robfosters · 16 Nov 2017 at 20:37

I'd imagine it depending on what technology you used. It have to be pretty hefty stuff to project high enough into the sky for everyone to see.

ChroniC · 16 Nov 2017 at 20:40

Not in this day and age. The led market has got so strong that given enough Diy'ing you can create a serious lumen stream of light that would be very noticeable on clouds. Focused enough it wouldn't send out much scatter at all.

For instance Googling quickly you can see a grand will apparently get you 120000 lumens. (I appreciate some of these sats can be wildly exaggerated)

Rroff · 16 Nov 2017 at 20:43

ChroniC said:
Not in this day and age. The led market has got so strong that given enough Diy'ing you can create a serious lumen stream of light that would be very noticeable on clouds. Focused enough it wouldn't send out much scatter at all.

For instance Googling quickly you can see a grand will apparently get you 120000 lumens. (I appreciate some of these sats can be wildly exaggerated)

Not quite in the same league as you are talking about but its pretty amazing what can be got out of a CREE LED, etc. these days.

ChroniC · 16 Nov 2017 at 20:45

Rroff said:
Not quite in the same league as you are talking about but its pretty amazing what can be got out of a CREE LED, etc. these days.

Exactly the larger 150w mains powered ones will light up fields.
It doesn't even have to be at night, just 5pm - 7pm so not to cause a problem. However it must be an issue otherwise everyone could do it and then the sky would be daylight.

Rroff · 16 Nov 2017 at 20:46

Was watching this video the other day https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-hQXaxO-cc (not sure why now).

EDIT: From a quick look - seems about $500/£429 per ~30,000 lumens realistically - beyond that its probably over exaggerating the output a bit.

ChroniC · 16 Nov 2017 at 20:52

With low laying cloud id expect a mile radius would be able to see it.

Vonhelmet · 16 Nov 2017 at 20:58

I’m guessing the cost of the electricity needed would outweigh the benefits.

Besides, who is looking at the sky when it’s dark and cloudy?

LabR@t · 16 Nov 2017 at 21:08

Dear God, I hope this don't catch on. The light pollution is already terrible.

ChroniC · 16 Nov 2017 at 21:10

Vonhelmet said:
I’m guessing the cost of the electricity needed would outweigh the benefits.

Besides, who is looking at the sky when it’s dark and cloudy?

People driving.

Dirk Diggler · 16 Nov 2017 at 21:11

No way this would be tolerated, the NATS department would outlaw it. Maybe better projecting onto a prominent building on a busy traffic route?

Vonhelmet · 16 Nov 2017 at 21:15

ChroniC said:
People driving.

Unless they’re in a convertible with the top down, are they going to see something projected on the clouds?

ChroniC · 16 Nov 2017 at 21:34

I had assumed so.

String said:
No way this would be tolerated, the NATS department would outlaw it. Maybe better projecting onto a prominent building on a busy traffic route?

This is why I want to read something specific. There is little to no light aircraft flying over small towns in the dark. The light stream would only be useful on cloudy days and no large aircraft would ever see it, as it would not be powerful enough to reach 30k feet etc.

dowie · 16 Nov 2017 at 21:37

String said:
No way this would be tolerated, the NATS department would outlaw it. Maybe better projecting onto a prominent building on a busy traffic route?

has been done a few times on prominent buildings AFAIK - can still get in trouble for it but meh... projector + van and be prepared to have the kit confiscated I guess...

Werewolf · 16 Nov 2017 at 21:38

String said:
No way this would be tolerated, the NATS department would outlaw it. Maybe better projecting onto a prominent building on a busy traffic route?

That would be my thought.

It would probably be classed as a hazard to aircraft and result in a very quick visit from the police.

Hotwired · 17 Nov 2017 at 00:09

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/artificial-light-nuisances-how-councils-deal-with-complaints

Abyss · 17 Nov 2017 at 00:17

You would need advertising consent / planning permission due to the size of the advert. It's highly unlikely a local authority would approve it.

FL630 · 17 Nov 2017 at 00:18

A few problems, clouds vary considerably in height, "texture", density etc etc.

One day you may have perfect uniform, dense, overcast cloud at 2000ft, perfect for this task. Half an hour later this has dispersed into a very gradual start to the cloud which would make the image all fuzzy I'd imagine. Half an hour later there could be some convective activity and suddenly the base of the cloud is all lumpy and your image is distorted. Shortly after the convective activity has raised the clouds by 1000ft and it's enlarged the advert, but not for long as the clouds are breaking up and it's vanished before you know it.

Also, you'd never be able to shine a light that bright into the sky, as mentioned above the aviation authorities would stop it before it even made it off the planning papers.

Bat signals are cool though.

ChroniC · 17 Nov 2017 at 07:45

String said:
No way this would be tolerated, the NATS department would outlaw it. Maybe better projecting onto a prominent building on a busy traffic route?

Hotwired said:
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/artificial-light-nuisances-how-councils-deal-with-complaints

From that it seems that you could do it and just wait for them to serve you an abatement notice and then comply. The time it took for them to achieve that and the relatively cheap cost of doing it, it might be worth a go.

Pawnless Endgame · 17 Nov 2017 at 08:12

A big halogen bulb or anything LED-based I imagine would be ok.

Lasers are dangerous territory though because of aviation. Your friend would need to check that he isn't on a flight path.