First McDonalds, now Butlins

If the policy is not to allow neck scarves or other loose fitting items either then I don't see a problem here.

A hijab IS a loose fitting item and I think the attendant is in a no win situation here. If they allow a head scarf then why not a neck scarf.

If the attendant had also been asking other customers to remove loose fitting items then there is continuity of the rules being applied.

I think a lot of people don't have a clue what they are talking about though. Do they know the difference between a hijab, niqab and burqa?

A hijab is literally the least offensive piece of clothing you can think of. It's basically the same thing your granny would wear when it was common IN THIS COUNTRY for most folks to wear something on their head when leaving the house.

Why does everybody have to polarise over Muslim women these days. You're either white knighting and over protective or you're a closet bigot. There's no middle ground these days.
 
LabR@t said:
Agreed, religion is a mental defect left over from a time when it was useful to control the masses.
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I just got back from Prague and enjoyed a guided tour whilst there. The tour guide explained that the Czech Republic is the most atheist country in Europe with only a small percentage identifying as religious (Catholic) and only half of those bother going to Church regularly. That's despite Prague being littered with beautiful gothic churches on every corner.
 
TallPaul1878 said:
If the policy is not to allow neck scarves or other loose fitting items either then I don't see a problem here.

A hijab IS a loose fitting item and I think the attendant is in a no win situation here. If they allow a head scarf then why not a neck scarf.

If the attendant had also been asking other customers to remove loose fitting items then there is continuity of the rules being applied.

I think a lot of people don't have a clue what they are talking about though. Do they know the difference between a hijab, niqab and burqa?

A hijab is literally the least offensive piece of clothing you can think of. It's basically the same thing your granny would wear when it was common IN THIS COUNTRY for most folks to wear something on their head when leaving the house.

Why does everybody have to polarise over Muslim women these days. You're either white knighting and over protective or you're a closet bigot. There's no middle ground these days.
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Most things break down to a binary decision it seems, except gender. Lol
 
“During our stay at the resort there was another lady who was wearing a scarf around her neck and was allowed on the rides; many people were wearing hoods and the tie strings were hanging … yet they were still allowed on the rides,” Nasser said.

In June? :confused:

Also why is this even news?
 
TallPaul1878 said:
I just got back from Prague and enjoyed a guided tour whilst there. The tour guide explained that the Czech Republic is the most atheist country in Europe with only a small percentage identifying as religious (Catholic) and only half of those bother going to Church regularly. That's despite Prague being littered with beautiful gothic churches on every corner.
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Left over relics from a bygone age, I do like the architecture of the old churches, it does amuse me all the symbolism and nonsense attached to it though.
 
LabR@t said:
Most things break down to a binary decision it seems, except gender. Lol
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I've always wondered where this gender diversity is going to go in the next 20 years. I mean it's highly unlikely that these people are going to have children.

I've no problem with it personally, live and let live and all that, but I do think it's a big social experiment right now, especially where kids are concerned. But that's a topic for a different thread and I don't get involved in them for the same reasons I posted above. Everyone is a raving lunatic about it.
 
How dare Butlins ask such a thing!

The hijab is a sign of freedom for women, they wear it with pri.....oh wait no they don't. It's a symbol of oppression.
 
LabR@t said:
Left over relics from a bygone age, I do like the architecture of the old churches, it does amuse me all the symbolism and nonsense attached to it though.
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I've no animosity to anyone over their beliefs. So long as you don't push it on me or my kids then you can think what you want.

I can understand why people might be religious, it might bring them comfort when dealing with a bereavement etc. At the end of the day religious belief exists all over the world in many different forms.
 
LateX'Dog said:
How dare Butlins ask such a thing!

The hijab is a sign of freedom for women, they wear it with pri.....oh wait no they don't. It's a symbol of oppression.
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A hijab is nothing more than a head scarf that your granny might wear. It shows all of the face and usually is worn by highly westernised Muslim women. You can get dark coloured hijabs and also light coloured and patterned hijabs. They're not the same as a niqab or burqa. This wasn't a girl walking around in a "ninja suit"

It wasn't all that long ago that it was considered inappropriate in this country to leave the house without a hat or headscarf amongst white British Christians.
 
The father has started a crowd justice campaign to fund his legal case. He adds that there were no trailing parts to his daughter's hijab as it was tucked in her coat and the family were so upset by the matter they left the holiday park a day earlier than planned.

The man did make a formal complaint to Butlins, but was told by Bourne Leisure Ltd that it was in fact the company policy that anyone wearing loose garments that can't be removed should not go on the dodgems. It is claimed this is due to an incident last year when someone's scarf became caught in the chassis and caused them injury.

However the company did send “sincere apologies" for making the family feel unwelcome.

A spokesperson for Butlins has said "our team are trained not to compromise when it comes to the safety of our guests. In this instance our team member quite rightly put the guest’s welfare first.

“There was no question of discrimination and any suggestions of this are utterly rejected in the strongest terms. We are sorry if the family feel they were badly treated.

"We explained our policies to them at the time, in writing afterwards and also to the Equality Advice and Support Service, who have told us they are satisfied with the explanation given to them." [LINK]
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Four key points jump out at me here:
  • Moammer Nasser (the father) has started a crowd funding campaign.
  • He acknowledges that there were "trailing parts to his daughter's hijab" but says that they were "tucked in her coat" at the time.
  • Butlins assert that there was an incident the previous year when someone's scarf became caught in the dodgem car chassis and caused them injury.
  • The Equality Advice and Support Service are said to be satisfied with the explanation given to them by Butlins.
It seems the me that one can claim to have suffered discrimination these days if almost anything happens slightly to irritate you - Gender, skin tone, sexual orientation, religion, age . . . I sure that there are other things that I can't remember but you probably get the idea.

Religion seems to be just about the most ridiculous. Nobody should be taken seriously because they choose to believe in some imaginary superbeing / creator who they claim told them from a burning bush or on a stone tablet that they must or must not wear some item of clothing or they risk eternal damnation.
 
When I'm confirmed as a mod - I've said too much, ignore that - I will absolutely ban anyone who doesn't post in their own thread within 15 posts.

OP is looking likely to be first up against the wall.
 
Mark A said:
“During our stay at the resort there was another lady who was wearing a scarf around her neck and was allowed on the rides; many people were wearing hoods and the tie strings were hanging … yet they were still allowed on the rides,” Nasser said.

In June? :confused:
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Hipsters gonna hipster
 
My house, my rules. Simple as that. If I don't want you wearing certain items, you're taking them off or not coming in. Your excuse for wearing that item is your problem, not mine.
 
always late said:
My house, my rules. Simple as that. If I don't want you wearing certain items, you're taking them off or not coming in. Your excuse for wearing that item is your problem, not mine.
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Awesome. Now explain how a private house is like a business that’s open to the public and we can close the loop on this one.
 
Vonhelmet said:
Awesome. Now explain how a private house is like a business that’s open to the public and we can close the loop on this one.
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It was a metaphor. It's their business, they can conduct it how they want. Whether it's good for business is a different matter, but you can't tell a private company how to behave imo.
 
always late said:
It was a metaphor. It's their business, they can conduct it how they want. Whether it's good for business is a different matter, but you can't tell a private company how to behave imo.
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Except private businesses are forbidden from discriminating in various grounds, religion included.

You talk like laws don’t apply full stop... of course you can tell a private company how to behave. What a ridiculous suggestion.
 
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