A rise in forum toxicity.

[Tefal]

So over the past year (2017) I've noticed there seems to be a general rise in toxicity across multiple forums (Not just ocuk).

In fact it reached the point where I've signed out of nearly every forum I used to frequent over the past few months as they'e just not fun any more.

What I mean by toxicity is there now seems to be a trend of ignoring what a poster has said and simply attacking them with a variety f names or labels. Usualy totally unrelated to the post or thread at hand and instead specifically at the poster.

Yes we used to have this for all the forums existence (lol dvdbunny etc) but there usualy was an attempt to actually rebut the post, especially in speakers corner, which seems to be missing now.

When ledge used to post in SC on any thread about evolution while derailing it he was always debated fairly well people posted evidence and valid arguments not just called him names (though many did that at the same time).

But now people are often jist outright attacked often for the perception of what they belive rather than what they actually wrote and as i say this is across many forums from overclockers to swinging sites its happening everywhere.


Especially where politics van be applied which now seems to be approached as if a party or ideology is a football team somone supports, most arguments against each other are just name calling or factually incorrect.

A good example on here is any post made by labr@t, where he will be routinely attacked regardless of the posts content. (Now I suspect this paragraph will end up as an example too, So I would make it clear I am not agreeing or dissagreeing with anything he has posted and take no sides he is jist a very obvious example when ever you read the forums these days).

Now im sure somone will point out that I myself have often posted in this way in the past and its true, i have previously got into the whole one upmanship and put downs thing. And I was wrong too its a cheap form of gratification I'll admit but it always seemed to be limited to one or two posters at a time now it seems to be the sole content of a thread.


I'm curious if anyone else has noticed simmilar here or elsewhere and has any ideas as to why this has been happening?

I Have wondered if its to do with the great rise in Twitter where it now seems to be who can to put people down in front of an audience. And if this short posting style where content doesnt matter but more the reception of it is the actually goal is bleeding into forums more and more.

I would like to point out this isn't a criticism or attack on ocuk or its moderating staff.
As frankly this level of posting is something that Can't really be easily moderated against without killing a forum.


Anyway if be curious to hear others views and please keep it civil.

 

[Rroff]

I've seen a lot of debate over whether this is a rising trend - recently was involved in a conference over people in the work place exposed to online abuse especially software development.

Personally though I don't think its hugely changed sort of ratio wise - as long as I can remember forums, etc. online its always been there just the increased number of people makes instances of it more apparent because there are more people.

I also find it concerning that there seems to be a lack of ability to distinguish between what can sometimes be a bit abrasive and blunt out of frustration but ultimately constructive criticism with presented reasoning and those that are just responding to anything someone has to say with "I hope you die of cancer" or whatever. Writing off criticism of their position, etc. as the other person being nasty so saying hateful things rather than take it onboard and apply some critical thinking.

 

[Blackjack Davy]

I havn't noticed things have gotten worse I remember 9/11 anyone trying to rationally debate with americans at the time against anything other than lets kill all muslims/the french are traitorous ******** got basically screamed into oblivion.

When anything contentious comes up emotions get the better of rational thought and politics recently have definitely been contentious. Thats not to excuse it but it does happen.

 

[~>Dg<~]

i get where you coming from.media has changed.i see it daily sometimes wonder why i add posts.

anyone can add anything input wise from phone or anything. that is the issue.that reply to a serious or well thought our post could be from a 8 year old on his mobile.that is the internet now ! everyone thinks everything is a trigger or a gag.that silly reply could be a trigger for something serious yet how can someone so young think that his joke can have such serious concequences.

maybe in the future there will be a limit on the internet to people of age.16+ . sounds very 1984 , draconian but common sense at some point needs to prevail.

 

[.Lethal]

Plenty of these things have gone on in the past. When you look back at your old posting habits when getting one ups on Joe random user, the things you've become more aware of now, actually went on just as often back in the past.

 

[Angilion]

I was going to reply, but I have some seeds to eat as a pastime activity

 

[dowie]

But now people are often jist outright attacked often for the perception of what they belive rather than what they actually wrote and as i say this is across many forums from overclockers to swinging sites its happening everywhere.

That is quite a frequent problem on here.. I think someone accused me of being a BTL landlord recently on an unrelated topic (I'm not a BTL landlord anyway).

Also with some topics if you criticise something you'll inevitably get people saying "what about [insert different topic]" or just trying to deflect onto say an opposing issue

For example I've criticised say the US authorities and don't get any whataboutery nonsense yet if I criticise say UAE authorities then certain posters seem super keen to try and derail the topic with "what about..."

likewise I can and do criticise Trump on here but criticising Hillary during the election would inevitably get multiple quotes of "what about Trump..." rather than anything to do with what has actually been posted

I also find it concerning that there seems to be a lack of ability to distinguish between what can sometimes be a bit abrasive and blunt out of frustration but ultimately constructive criticism with presented reasoning and those that are just responding to anything someone has to say with "I hope you die of cancer" or whatever. Writing off criticism of their position, etc. as the other person being nasty so saying hateful things rather than take it onboard and apply some critical thinking.

I agree, also if the criticism has some validity then trying to ignore it and respond instead with offence at the manner in which it was presented is a cheap way of trying to deflect from it.

 

[Efour]

Very few people seem to have long term memory of other posters and seem to treat every thing as one of posts with no history or background.

That usually results in the form *********/sjw/alt right internet labeling that is sadly all that most people seem to know these days.

Yes you/we live in a strange post Brexit UK landscape. I think everyone is just a bit on edge these days.

 

[spoffle]

People are becoming more toxic and incidentally more fragile at the same time. I blame social media such as Facebook (Facebook groups specifically) and Reddit (to much lesser degree) for kick starting the trend of online safe spaces and echo chambers that cause people who frequent certain ones the ability to surround themselves with only the beliefs and opinions that they want to hear.

I feel like this is increasing the delta between the echo chamber safe spaces, and "reality" or objective truth, and in turn causes different views and opinions that don't align with what they're used to seeing and hearing in their echo chambers and safe spaces, that they find it to be extremely offensive because their ability to deal with different views has started to diminish.

I'm probably explaining my thoughts on this in a really convoluted manner, but I'm absolutely knackered right now and my brain is a bit frazzled.

I've seen a lot of debate over whether this is a rising trend - recently was involved in a conference over people in the work place exposed to online abuse especially software development.

Personally though I don't think its hugely changed sort of ratio wise - as long as I can remember forums, etc. online its always been there just the increased number of people makes instances of it more apparent because there are more people.

I also find it concerning that there seems to be a lack of ability to distinguish between what can sometimes be a bit abrasive and blunt out of frustration but ultimately constructive criticism with presented reasoning and those that are just responding to anything someone has to say with "I hope you die of cancer" or whatever. Writing off criticism of their position, etc. as the other person being nasty so saying hateful things rather than take it onboard and apply some critical thinking.

People are completely losing ability to take criticism. It's getting much much worse with the advent of online safe spaces and echo chambers in the mainstream.

People seem to be extremely offended if you say something that isn't praise, and I can only see it getting worse with how schools are giving kids participation awards. It's really not preparing them for the real world, where you've got to accept that you're gonna be completely **** at some things.

 

[LabR@t]

So over the past year (2017) I've noticed there seems to be a general rise in toxicity across multiple forums (Not just ocuk).

In fact it reached the point where I've signed out of nearly every forum I used to frequent over the past few months as they'e just not fun any more.

What I mean by toxicity is there now seems to be a trend of ignoring what a poster has said and simply attacking them with a variety f names or labels. Usualy totally unrelated to the post or thread at hand and instead specifically at the poster.

Yes we used to have this for all the forums existence (lol dvdbunny etc) but there usualy was an attempt to actually rebut the post, especially in speakers corner, which seems to be missing now.

When ledge used to post in SC on any thread about evolution while derailing it he was always debated fairly well people posted evidence and valid arguments not just called him names (though many did that at the same time).

But now people are often jist outright attacked often for the perception of what they belive rather than what they actually wrote and as i say this is across many forums from overclockers to swinging sites its happening everywhere.


Especially where politics van be applied which now seems to be approached as if a party or ideology is a football team somone supports, most arguments against each other are just name calling or factually incorrect.

A good example on here is any post made by labr@t, where he will be routinely attacked regardless of the posts content. (Now I suspect this paragraph will end up as an example too, So I would make it clear I am not agreeing or dissagreeing with anything he has posted and take no sides he is jist a very obvious example when ever you read the forums these days).

Now im sure somone will point out that I myself have often posted in this way in the past and its true, i have previously got into the whole one upmanship and put downs thing. And I was wrong too its a cheap form of gratification I'll admit but it always seemed to be limited to one or two posters at a time now it seems to be the sole content of a thread.


I'm curious if anyone else has noticed simmilar here or elsewhere and has any ideas as to why this has been happening?

I Have wondered if its to do with the great rise in Twitter where it now seems to be who can to put people down in front of an audience. And if this short posting style where content doesnt matter but more the reception of it is the actually goal is bleeding into forums more and more.

I would like to point out this isn't a criticism or attack on ocuk or its moderating staff.
As frankly this level of posting is something that Can't really be easily moderated against without killing a forum.


Anyway if be curious to hear others views and please keep it civil.

It's media in general it's beginning polarised and in my mind childish at times. Social media is running roughshod over innocent until proven guilty for starters.

I blame social media and the education system.

 

[Tefal]

People are completely losing ability to take criticism. It's getting much much worse with the advent of online safe spaces and echo chambers in the mainstream.

People seem to be extremely offended if you say something that isn't praise, and I can only see it getting worse with how schools are giving kids participation awards. It's really not preparing them for the real world, where you've got to accept that you're gonna be completely **** at some things.

So would this be a case of that?

I post what could be seen as criticism and your repose is, well this?

 

[robgmun]

There's always a bunch of disgusting apologists in almost every political thread, usually the same people time and again just different usernames. It's pretty sicking and it goes all the way back to the 9/11 thread. They change the labels they throw around to the latest social justice tread but it's always the same MO, so blinded by there supposedly moral superiority that they don't see their cultural hari-kari

 

[Fusion]

Tribalism and factions have existed since the beginning of time. Relentless expansion of media coverage is possibly highlighting more division and stirring things up one way or another.

Anyone that’s been online for more than five minutes knows this has been a part of the culture since the year dot. Whatever the year, it was always “better” 3/5/10/x years ago.

 

[panthro]

I've noticed it with certain posters who just tend to try and find fault or just pick apart anything certain members will say, but it's nothing new. Angus Higgins ([anyone])?

 

[Tefal]

Tribalism and factions have existed since the beginning of time. Relentless expansion of media coverage is possibly highlighting more division and stirring things up one way or another.

Anyone that’s been online for more than five minutes knows this has been a part of the culture since the year dot. Whatever the year, it was always “better” 3/5/10/x years ago.

I' not saying it was never the case as i said in the op I used to do it too.


I'm Saying that it now seems more widespread and a higher % of content as a whole.


Maybe I'm just getting older

There's always a bunch of disgusting apologists in almost every political thread, usually the same people time and again just different usernames. It's pretty sicking and it goes all the way back to the 9/11 thread. They change the labels they throw around to the latest social justice tread but it's always the same MO, so blinded by there supposedly moral superiority that they don't see their cultural hari-kari

A good example of what I mean.

Just an attack on people with no substance or even relation to the topic?

 

[mid_gen]

Some people are too lazy for rational thought and are ruled by the social and other online media echo chambers they inhabit, sadly.

LabRat is a classic example. Has surrounded himself with an input stream of right-wing outrage, and just regurgitates it here without applying any semblance of rational thought, and in the case of the Internation Men's Day thread, outright lies.

Deserves all the mockery he gets. You can't force someone to think for themselves, but you can call them out on their ignorance.

 

[Ayahuasca]

Just like socialising in person if you say stupid things or come across as a hypocrite then people will remember and have prejudice.

The Labr@t example is a poor one as he’ll often post and run or ignore the well balanced debate, also one of the main perpetrators in having the flake word banned on here.

 

[Fusion]

also one of the main perpetrators in having the flake word banned on here.

Im struggling to understand why this term would be banned. It’s a label, a generalisation. It’s not an expletive, it’s not even coarse-in the slightest? Banned? I fear that some people in wider society would be quite happy to ban other critical terms, too. Not a good development.

 

[NVP]

I blame twitter for the downfall of the Internet. It has a rare witty post that others then try to copy without any tact, that's now bled across the net as these children have "grown up" with it. It's a lot more complex, however I'm not the best at explaining.


I was so hoping this was a bait thread where you'd wait for LabR@t to post and then unleash the flamethrower hahaha

Good to have you back BTW.

 

[Nitefly]

There's always a bunch of disgusting apologists in almost every political thread, usually the same people time and again just different usernames. It's pretty sicking and it goes all the way back to the 9/11 thread. They change the labels they throw around to the latest social justice tread but it's always the same MO, so blinded by there supposedly moral superiority that they don't see their cultural hari-kari

Perhaps I shall be deemed as trying to be morally superior, but isn’t this pretty much the sort of thing the OP was alluding to? Angry gunna angry

Edit - ^ beaten!

@Tefal welcome back! For what it’s worth, quite a few of us noticed your absence - so I think that underneath all the face level hostility people still do remember others and do care (was going to put a smiley face here but it looked mega creepy.... ooo go on then)