Police rolling out technology which allows them to raid a victim's phone without a warrant

Le5Alv3.gif
 
There was a recent incident involving Lauren Southern being detained and denied access to UK by Kent police.

Searched her luggage and took away her phone before holding her in a detention cell under terrorism act.

Interestingly they requested that she provide them with password.

She stood her ground and said would not provide without legal representation and despite continued requests from police they eventually backed down and never got her password.

Good for her.
 
The police can compel persons to hand over passwords in the UK...failure to hand over the password(s) can put you in prison for up to two years in general cases or five years in terrorist or child indecency cases

In the case of Lauren Southern I think the police backed down as they knew they were abusing the relevant terrorism act used to detain her and did want a (potentially very embarrassing) court case to confirm this....
 
Rroff said:
Actually a significant factor here - as by law you will have certain things you have to adhere to when dealing with client data or other business data and the same will apply to the police if they obtain that data.
Click to expand...

Pretty much all data protection type legislation have exemptions for police purposes.

Destination said:
That, indeed, does seem to be what the article is suggesting.
Click to expand...

That is only usually done in very exceptional circumstances with consent of the victim. In cases where it's non-consensual, there must be really good grounds, such as text messages that might undermine a rape prosecution for instance.
 
Victims' phones? I think any phones really. This is the establishment's thinly-veiled way of saying that our privacy and liberty is being increasingly curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.
 
Burnsy2023 said:
That is only usually done in very exceptional circumstances with consent of the victim. In cases where it's non-consensual, there must be really good grounds, such as text messages that might undermine a rape prosecution for instance.
Click to expand...

They don't seem to have done well with those recently, "accidentally" failing to disclose them etc...
 
dowie said:
They don't seem to have done well with those recently, "accidentally" failing to disclose them etc...
Click to expand...

This is the whole point to those disclosure issues. If you download the whole contents of the phone, it's difficult to know what evidence is there that has not been analysed and therefore disclosed to the defence. That's not malicious, that due to not having the time to do a full analysis.
 
Burnsy2023 said:
This is the whole point to those disclosure issues. If you download the whole contents of the phone, it's difficult to know what evidence is there that has not been analysed and therefore disclosed to the defence. That's not malicious, that due to not having the time to do a full analysis.
Click to expand...

Well it is incompetent at the very least (it could easily be malicious too in one of the publicised cases not too long ago) and is probably part of the reason for the announcement an hour ago that the director of prosecutions won't be getting her contract renewed... not to mention it has presumably caused even more work since all rape cases have now had to be reviewed. Pretty naff performance all around by the police and CPS.
 
So the tl:dr here is that they can download the contents of your phone if you unlock it for them, and encrypting your phone will screw their ability to do this without your permission (even if said permission is forced under threat of jail time)
 
This will not comply with GDPR and will not be allowed to continue very very soon I would imagine.

If I ever record something on my phone that could be used as evidence if I report it, then it gets put on a disc or USB stick and that is handed over with no mention of what device was used to record it. Pretty simple really.
 
Its not new its the fact they don't need a warrant.

Its just a 0 and 1 bit read of the phone. Also deleting information does not necessarily wipe all information it can be reformed with a bit read, you will get a few errors but the plod will be able to build a picture so to say.
 
mrk said:
This will not comply with GDPR and will not be allowed to continue very very soon I would imagine.
Click to expand...

The General Data Protection Regulations (GDPR) wont apply to these situations.....


But as you will be aware, things are a little more complex around policing. The GDPR does cover personnel records, and any non- policing activity, but it does not cover the use of personal data for law enforcement purposes. Unlike the DPA, it does not cover a lot of your work. Instead – as you’ll have heard from DCMS if you were here yesterday - there is a separate legal instrument, the Law Enforcement Directive. This covers the use of data for law enforcement purposes, but, in simple terms, in the UK its scope could be limited to data processed for certain European Justice and Home Affairs measures.
Click to expand...

The Law Enforcement Directive will tighten things up a bit but has to be weighed against things like the Criminal Procedure and Investigations Act 1996 which says police have to make 'reasonable lines of enquiry', whether these point towards or away from a suspect.

And given that has already been a spate of high profile cases where police did download complaints phones which did contain (previously unknown) material that heavily undermined the case I think the police will still be quite able to argue that they need to carry out rather indiscriminate downloads of digital devices (in certain circumstances) if they are to comply with their (other) duties....


So in reality - witness videos an incident and that's the only involvement they or their device had would likely mean - police have to only download the relevant video (not as easy as it sounds by the way).... probably easier for owner to provide it stand alone on removable media.

But if there's a 'reasonable' belief that photos, messages, social media etc may be relevant to a case then police will be looking to complete a full download for review this is particularly the situation with many sexual offence cases where the wider actions of the complainant(s) and suspect(s)/ defendant(s) can be very relevant .............

In practice this will mean that complainants in cases will be invited (by the police) to hand over their devices for a download and informed of the nature of this for certain matters. If they decline they will be told that there is a good chance that such a decision may make it highly likely that the prosecutor (the Crown Prosecution Service) may decline to pursue a prosecution as they will not be likely satisfied of a reasonable prospect of conviction in the circumstances......

Suspects phones (and other digital devices) will just likely be downloaded in a similar fashion albeit with a bit more paperwork around 'proportionality'
 
Last edited:
So with wireless charging now standard and crap like this I'm thinking maybe epoxying up the usb port is a sensible step?
 
Rroff said:
It would be fascinating watching someone try to get their head around the content on my phone - not because its encrypted - just the vast amount of data and different types of data spread over a massive range of subjects, etc. a lot of it would likely make little sense without my life experiences as a guide as to how it all goes togther. I don't just have a few contacts, family photos and the odd conversations on there heh.
Click to expand...


Yeah but to most people in the world the contents of thier gallery being shared around would be enough to mortify them
 
asim18 said:
LOL "deter from knife crime" like its some sort of drug, these people have absolutely no clue as to the causes of knife crime do they. :(
Click to expand...

I think they might know a bit more about it than you.

The decision to treat knife crime as a public health issue – rather than simply a police matter – appears to have underpinned both the direction and support.
Click to expand...

Source: https://www.theguardian.com/members...tland-reduced-knife-deaths-among-young-people

See also: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/capital-turns-to-glasgow-for-help-on-knife-crime-th0hctkwp

But sure, continue your paranoid ramblings into how we're being driven into a police state, despite the massive cuts in funding, resources and overall support.
 
You can encrypt your phone, but then it's an offense to refuse to give them the password lol (for the criminal at least, not sure about the victim).
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom