No-nonsense router for 1Gbps Wi-Fi

Linas

Linas

Linas

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Hello all,

I am looking for simple router for 1Gbps connection (Hyperoptic), I have my desktop and NAS wired at the moment with reasonable speed (~600-800Mbps), but any wi-fi connection is simply not acceptable:
  • With provided Hyperoptic ZTE router I get max 60/40Mbps
  • With my old Asus DSL-N66U it is slightly better, but less reliable 30-140/40Mbps
  • Tried Asus RT-AC51U (massive mistake), getting even less 17-23/30Mbps
What is more, never mind the speed, but connection keeps dropping. So when I put the laptop on table in the kitchen and I am lucky to get internet I am then afraid to move it!

My goal is to keep 4 LAN connections at 1Gbps, but have something more capable for Wi-Fi, at least stable 200Mbps. It is small flat (50m2) with paper walls and I never though it is going to be such a big issue to get reasonable wi-fi connection. The second goal is to get something which doesn't look like aliens have invaded my desk (referring to Gaming/Nighthawk space ships). I know looks are very personal thing, but for me they just look a bit "silly". Finally, I don't need any features - VPNs, FTP servers, Coulds and all other shenanigans - just 4x1Gbps LANs + 4x Wi-Fi devices @~200Mbps.

I know there are many similar threads, but have red few pages and all people are looking for something differed. It seems that consensus is to get total overkill with RT-AC5300's and Nighthawk X10's, but neither I need 4Gbps AC connection at 60Ghz, nor I ever going to use any of additional features those routers are offering + subjective looks.

I was thinking about http://www.netgear.co.uk/home/products/networking/wifi-routers/R6400.aspx
But again... don't really want to cheap-out and then get yet another router. One thing which worries me is that at least on amazon there are quite few negative reviews about crashy and buggy software (not sure if anything can be worse then DSL-N66U....).

Any advice would be appreciated.
 
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You’re problem is with the WiFi element of your router so I’d disable WiFi on it and, if your devices you want to connect support it, then you could go all out for something like a Ubiquiti UniFi HD AP which supports up to 2.53Gbps plugged into the router to provide your WiFi access.
 
Thanks,
If I understood correctly I just add AP to my router.... but then don't I need to move AP to the room I need to use it to get best speeds i.e. kitchen? Or is it so much more powerful I don't need to worry about the range?

The problem I have - I cannot drill any holes or pull any cables. Maybe power line adapter, or that is not necessary?
 
Thanks,
So I guess the idea of power line adapter was rejected? :)

One other thing - so if I am going to be using Mesh/AP, there seems to be no reason to keep router either. I mean Hyperoptic router is provided just to add Wi-Fi "out of the box" and except of that pretty useless (edges out at 910Mbps as well). My point - is there anything to be gained by replacing router with 1Gbps switch?
 
To directly answer the questions in your last post... Powerline adapters are awful, forget them. Don't plug directly to the Hyperoptic RJ45/ethernet port with a switch, you need a firewall between you and the outside world. The Hyperoptic supplied router maxing out around 910Mbps is normal - that's a 1Gbps NIC routing at wire speed, minus overheads for TCP etc.

Let's take a step back. You have Hyperoptic 1Gbps (lucky devil), and have - at a minimum - a 1Gbps wired desktop and NAS, plus some wireless devices. What wireless devices do you have, specifically? Are they wireless AC, N, G or other? If not AC, are they easily upgradeable? What is your use case for the network? I can understand wanting stable wifi, but 200Mbps for wireless devices? Easily doable, btw, but that's awfully specific. Is there a reason you had in mind? What's your budget?

Until we know the answers to those questions, my ideal network would look like this (and actually does at home, minus the 1Gbps fibre :( ):

(Hyperoptic WAN) > pfSense running on a low powered box > a metal TP-Link TL-SG1008P gigabit PoE switch (8 port) > Ubiquiti Unifi UAP AC Pro.

You will pay initially for a decent box to run pfSense on, but it'll repay you many times over for years to come. In the scheme of things budget around the cost of a so-called 'high end' consumer router and you're in the right ballpark. A Quotom mini PC with a 2c4t Pentium G4560, i3 or i5; or a Pondesk mini PC with G4560 or above will do admirably. The former are available through various river shaped online stores. Alternatively you could easily build a nice SFF PC with a 12v power supply, micro-ATX commercial mobo (Asrock are good) then throw in a £50 G4560, 2GB to 4GB RAM, a small mSATA SSD or SDCard and a 2nd hand Intel Pro dual port NIC from an auction site, and you're good to go. Any of those will route gigabit traffic WAN > LAN with single digits of CPU usage, and route full gigabit openvpn directly from the router using 256 bit AES without breaking a sweat.

The TP-Link switch I recommended is just the cheapest of its type, yet comes with a metal enclosure (rather than plastic like its more expensive competitors) and is very solid and reliable. I've had two for a few years now and they just work. The PoE will allow you to power your Unifi access point over ethernet so you can mount it on a wall or ceiling somewhere convenient. If you're very cost conscious you could get a non-PoE variant (TL-SG108) for about £20 and use the access point's included PoE injector instead. That's an extra power cable and two ethernet cables instead of one though, so personally I prefer the PoE switch.

The Ubiquiti Unifi UAP AC Pro is a solid choice, as others have already mentioned. It's small, neat and easily sited for best signal broadcasting without taking up space or looking too out of place. For context, I live in a 3 bedroom brick semi-detached and my Pro is in the front of the living room downstairs. My MacBook Pro sits in my back bedroom at the other end of the house and upstairs, and it's only wireless N (2012 model). That gets a solid 22MB/sec (200+ Mbps) all day every day. My newer wireless AC devices all sync at 1.3Gbps and get my full ISP speed (>350Mbps) no problems.

You can get very good sticky wall mount pads/stickers these days (3M) that remove the need to screw/nail cables to walls. Personally I'd just lightly tack cable with those little plastic cable pins and fill the holes before I left, but ymmv. Overall:

A 10w - 50w pfSense box: £200 to £400 depending on spec and where you buy/build it from
A switch: £50
Solid AC wifi AP: £115

So that's £300 to £500 all in, but if you hunt around for 2nd hand stuff you could halve that. Don't forget some cat5e (or better) cabling if you need it. I'd also be looking at why you're only getting 600Mbps to your desktop and NAS. Are they CPU bound, or have rubbish NICs?
 
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Great info! Thanks,

Yes you right - I am not actually complaining about 910Mbps, though if I connect directly into PC NIC I have managed 965Mbps few times. Additionally, I have noticed that when I am backing-up to NAS there is massive slowdown on entire network. NAS is rated for 100MB/s and from reviews achieved solid 80MB/s up/down - the best I am seeing is 10-20MB/s, but that comes with repercussion on the rest of the network and strangely specifically hurts wi-fi the most. I tend to believe it is because straight router switching capacity is limited and very quickly it starts degrading entire network, so it is fine routing WAN to LAN (somewhat capped at just about 1Gbps), but not switching LAN to LAN (where normal switch would be capable 4/8Gbps). So obvious next step in my mind was to get rid of the router (at least between PC and NAS). Where I have made mistake, I assumed that switch would have firewall - which I now understand was wrong.

Devices... 2x laptops with wireless N, 1x has AC, last device would be for guests - I assume AC/N laptop. Then 3/6 phones/tablets - all AC, but I don't really care what speed phones are getting (don't even count them as devices) as long as reception is decent. Again I agree - 200Mpbs is just a wish - would prioritise reliability over speed, the only occasion I need more speed is p2p downloading and back-ups to NAS. You can imagine backing-up ~200GB to NAS @30Mbps takes a while.

Next the cabling - Hyperoptic comes over cat6e, I use cat7 - that is because I like flat appearance + whenever Hyperoptic tries to blame the speed on my internal cabling I can tell them to hold the horses. The reason I am getting 600Mbps is that "Hyperoptic does not guarantee 1Gbps - it is up-to". Now that I disagree with, because their marketing material states otherwise - I have complained to them and they offered me to get commercial dedicated line for £280/Month if I wanted guaranteed 1Gbps - after mentioning OFCOM and ASA, they quite quickly settled on flat £40/Month for my current line (instead of £63) - but I had to accept my network speed might be (quite a bit) less then headline 1Gbps. Didn't want to push further as the next available option is "up-to 86Mbps" from sh**-ber optic BT.

Budget - that is tough question. I would turn it around - I want as little as possible devices with as few as possible features. I don't need VPN (maybe some day I am going to change my view on privacy), I don't need any other features. I assume that most basic features like firewall, load balancing would be pretty standard. I would realistically say £200, maybe £250 if I am really impressed with something.

Going back to suggested setup I am really struggling to see what I am getting from pfSense? I understand it is router/firewall - but looking to the price that seems to be one obvious component I am going to skip. In summary it seems I am going to stick with:

WAN > Hyperoptic Router (as firewall) >Switch/AP> Switch between NAS and PC/wireless devices to AP

Unless somebody can suggest some cheap firewall/switch to replace router - what I have found so far is that most firewalls with integrated switches are very industrial and very expensive. I understand that is where pfSense fits, but it is a bit too expensive and sounds too complex. Other thing L3/L4 switches, but those guys starts at 24x ports and cost thousands - a little bit overkill I reckon :rolleyes:.
 
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Got more details on the NAS?

Some will have a gigabit interface but not enough grunt to use it... I use a older Netgear for OS X Time Machine and that tops out at 10-15MB/sec.
 
It is WD HomeCould. It is sh** NAS to be honest - great data dump (16TB), but not very fast. Have a lot of features, but none of them work very well. I have done a bit of research before getting it and now going back to some reviews I can reconfirm during reviews it achieved 53MB/s - write and 88MB/s read. My one achieves ~10MB/s write and 20MB/s read if I am lucky + whenever there is any traffic between NAS and PC Wi-Fi virtually disappears.
 
Linas said:
Great info! Thanks,

{Helpful use-case info snipped for ease of reading the thread.}
Click to expand...

OK that's far better of a picture for us to work from, thanks. As I said, my post was the 'ideal' given lack of extra information. With a symmetrical 1Gbps fibre link I'd personally want everything running overkill and with the best stuff available. In your circumstances, and in light of your detailed use-case information, I would do one of the following (depending on your personal preferences and how many cables you'll tolerate about the place):

{Hyperoptic WAN} > Hyperoptic device with WiFi disabled > TP-Link PoE switch linked above > Unifi UAP AC Pro. Total cost around £160.

{Hyperoptic WAN} > Hyperoptic device with WiFi disabled > TP-Link basic switch linked above > Unifi UAP AC Lite using included PoE injector for power. Total cost around £95.

The difference between the UAP AC Pro and Lite is primarily that the Pro has slightly beefier processing, a second RJ45 port (for daisy chaining) and the Pro can take power from a standard PoE switch. The Lite uses proprietary PoE rather than standard, so you need to use the included injector (a tiny brick that you plug into the wall, then run one ethernet cable from it to the AP and a second shorter cable from the injector to your switch to 'tie' the AP to the network). Those two options come in well under budget, give you solid dependable wireless, allow you to keep a firewall and means you have plenty of scope to upgrade/change in future. Note that as your Hyperoptic device is running NAT (meaning it takes your single public IP address and 'shares' it to multiple clients on your LAN) you have a degree of protection from that also, in addition to a real firewall. Not to mention any software firewalls running locally on your devices.

As for the NAS it sounds underpowered and unable to cope with the load. A 100Mbps link can drag down a whole local network to the same speeds, although newer hardware (on the switch side) can work around this. For example with my TP-Link switch I have all cat6 1Gbps devices, except for my 3x Hikvision 4k UltraHD CCTV cameras, which were installed (not by me) with plain cat5 cable and they only have 100Mbps NICs. They all run - obviously - at 100Mbps, but the rest of the LAN is free to run at 1Gbps without issues. Can you upgrade the NIC in the NAS? Does it take PCI or PCIe add-on cards? If so I'd be buying an Intel Pro NIC second hand from a reputable business seller on an auction site. I say second hand, btw, in case you didn't know, because brand new they're very expensive server class hardware. When businesses/datacentres replenish hardware they sell off the perfectly decent older stuff online for bargain prices (£20 up usually).

ETA: Your last post suggests that when transferring files over ethernet between your NAS and desktop, your wifi dies. That strongly suggests the Hyperoptic box is struggling to cope and dropping services while sweating under load. Adding the Unifi UAP AC (whatever model) will take wifi completely away from your 'all in one' box and allow it to work properly regardless. You started this thread looking for a 'no-nonsense router' but the fact is consumer grade 'all in one' boxes are pants - even the expensive ones. You're asking one little box with a CPU in the MHz range to do switching, routing, packet filtering, state tables, wifi, and up to a dozen other things at once. The more you delegate these functions to separate devices, the better your network will be - and the faster and more efficiently it'll operate.
 
Yep, that sounds like what I needed, thanks
  1. Hyperoptic router dedicated for firewall
  2. Switch dedicated for LAN passthrough
  3. AP point dedicated for Wi-fi
The point on NAS - no it is closed box design, at best I can swap-out hard drives- its 1Gbps though, but obviously not powerful enough for task.
 
If you want a very cheap router to replace the Hyperoptic one, but with switching and routing horsepower then Mikrotik is going to be the answer. I have no experience but those on here that do rate them highly.

Spend a little more and for <£100 you can introduce a Ubiquiti Edgerouter or USG into @Rainmaker ’s suggestion for great routing performance.
 
@BigT I’d agree, but the OP has decided it’s a waste of money to pay for a separate router. On a further note regarding the UniFi access points, I just did a random speed test over 5GHz WiFi using my iPhone X:

A52048_B3_D4_D5_4_B21_B951_CF66542_C9878.png


As I said, you’ll have no issues with a UniFi AP. :)
 
Hi all,

These are still good items as this was 1,5 years ago or you advise something different nowadays? I have basically the same problem. 3 level townhouse, paper walls. The hyperoptic router is on the middle level in the corner. The following things using the network: 4 laptops most of them less than a year old, 5 phones, 1 fire tv 4k, 3 Chromecast on 3 different level. We have 2 google nest 1 Alexa echo show. these are on the wifi. I have a 12 tb Myhome cloud a ps4 pro and a 4k android tv plugged into the ports. I have a serious problem with the speed of the wifi on the 3rd and the 1st level. I plugged in a netgear basic range extender but it`s useless basically. I don't have any sockets for cables around and I can't drill holes as well. What do you suggest to handle the situation nowadays?

Thank you in advance.

Krisztian
 
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