I thought it was a combination of both. Emissions based, but over £40k gets that additional premium of £310/year for the first 5 years. Besides @lordrobs is talking about company cars, so presumably BIK? Which definitely takes into account emissions.
Will WLTP impact our car choices from September?
- Thread starter lordrobs
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I thought it was a combination of both. Emissions based, but over £40k gets that additional premium of £310/year for the first 5 years. Besides @lordrobs is talking about company cars, so presumably BIK? Which definitely takes into account emissions.
Yeah it was BIK that I was concerned with. The source I was reading showed notable BIK difference on like for like vehicles between the old NEDC test and the new calculated NEDC equivalent from the WLTP tests.
So you're suggesting a return to the 1980s in order to reduce the level of testing for WLTP?
BIK.
Plus car manufacturers have to compete with each other in the market, so why would they allow worst-case figures to be published?
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Soldato
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Indeed first year is based on emissions and also diesels jump a band if they don’t meet RDE2 (real drivinh emissions step2) which is a 2020 requirement, pretty all diesels will jump a band for this reason.
There are very few public figures. The variation from NEDC to WLTP varies greatly, anywhere from a reduction of 7% to an increase of 40% with the models tested so far.
The Golf R is losing 10BHP:
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/motoring/volkswagen-golf-r-power-drops-296bhp-amid-wltp-changes
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/motoring/volkswagen-golf-r-power-drops-296bhp-amid-wltp-changes
Shame, that's what I wanted to see was how much it impacts different cars etc.
It's impossible to do realworld testing, you need consistent conditions otherwise the results aren't comparable.
Yep, and much closer to real world driving, hence the expression.
Don't forget though that RDE (Real Driving Emissions) also comes in to effect alongside WLTP.
Under RDE, a car will be driven on public roads over a wide range of conditions using portable measuring equipment (PEMS). RDE will complement WLTP to ensure that pollutant emission levels, measured during the laboratory test, are confirmed on the road, making Europe the only region in the world to implement such mandatory testing.
Hence a lot of the modifications manufacturers are having to make, as real world emissions have to be the same a lab (within allowable limits) measured levels.
RDE step 1 (with a NOx conformity factor of 2.1) applied as of 1 September 2017 for new car types (models that are introduced on the European market for the first time). It will apply in September 2019 for all types.
RDE step 2 (with a NOxconformity factor of 1.0 plus an error margin of 0.5) will apply in January 2020 for new types, and then from January 2021 for all types.
A conformity factor is defined as a “not to exceed limit” that takes into account a margin for error, which is present simply because PEMS equipment does not deliver exactly the same results for each test. For example, PEMS are not as accurate as a full laboratory system so they will not measure to the same level of repeatable accuracy as a lab test.
In practice, car manufacturers must set their design objectives well below the legal limit to be certain of complying, so it will mean massive changes in the way manufacturers go about designing power trains and vehicles.
You might be able to get a cheap VW soon, because they have been busy trying to fix diesel gate they are a bit behind with WLTP testing but they are still building the cars.
Apparently they are renting space at an unfinished airport in Belgium to store 200k-250k diesel cars on top of their usual (full) storage locations for models that have not yet been WLTP certified and cutting production at various plants.
Apparently they are renting space at an unfinished airport in Belgium to store 200k-250k diesel cars on top of their usual (full) storage locations for models that have not yet been WLTP certified and cutting production at various plants.
This has effected my order at the moment the whole factory is such down till September but then they are only producing a few models when it re-opens. So I just have to wait at the moment, it's not the end of the world though.
However, in order to meet these new rules I hope they don't make too many changes to the car but I guess they have some of the best people working on it.
However, in order to meet these new rules I hope they don't make too many changes to the car but I guess they have some of the best people working on it.
Soldato
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Audi so I assume VW group hasn't got enough equipment or trained operators to test everything within the timescales they need to
Apparently they gambled on getting an extension, they didn't get one
Rumours are that they need a year basically to test everything that was current catalog, so they pulled loads of models and will test and reintroduce pretty much based on sales volume and model changes already planned
Things like facelifts (TT is due one soon) mean some will be out of production for longer as they wont test current knowing they will need to do it all again imminently
Apparently they gambled on getting an extension, they didn't get one
Rumours are that they need a year basically to test everything that was current catalog, so they pulled loads of models and will test and reintroduce pretty much based on sales volume and model changes already planned
Things like facelifts (TT is due one soon) mean some will be out of production for longer as they wont test current knowing they will need to do it all again imminently
Perhaps one of those in the industry can explain Suzuki's plans to cope with WLTP as I'm not sure what single-type approval means in this context.
Dale Wyatt: Suzuki UK boss -
“We will go to single-type approval [process for low-volume car makers] for our cars. We have a six-month lead time on our cars, so we don’t have the flexibility to cope with such strict measures. We should be back to where we need to be by the end of the year.
Dale Wyatt: Suzuki UK boss -
“We will go to single-type approval [process for low-volume car makers] for our cars. We have a six-month lead time on our cars, so we don’t have the flexibility to cope with such strict measures. We should be back to where we need to be by the end of the year.
Pretty much what it says, they will go for almost type approval per vehicle, or at very least in small batches, in each different country they sell their vehicles, rather than full Europe/world wide type approval.
It basically means that in certain areas, one of which is emissions, the standards to meet are slightly less restrictive.
It basically means that in certain areas, one of which is emissions, the standards to meet are slightly less restrictive.