Thai cave rescue - One of the divers has died

Energize said:
Not exactly a like for like comparison is it? Hardly a surprise that a country of office workers has lower work related fatalities than countries where manual labor is prevalent.
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I am tempted sometimes to go into health and safety as an occupation - half the "accidents" at work in this country don't just happen to happen :s so many are due to a mixture of complacency, stupidity and laziness.
 
Energize said:
Not exactly a like for like comparison is it? Hardly a surprise that a country of office workers has lower work related fatalities than countries where manual labor is prevalent.
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With proper health and safety regulations, those Thai figures could be slashed to a very impressive minimum.
 
Evangelion said:
With proper health and safety regulations, those Thai figures could be slashed to a very impressive minimum.
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Maybe, but that's besides my point. Most statistics don't demonstrate the effect of H&S legislation because they compare two completely different demographics, over time health and safety always tends to improve because of external factors such as advances in medicine and technology.
 
IronWarrior said:
So in the end, they did the most simple thing, put the kids in some swimsuits, gave some basic lessons, gave them a oxygen tank, tied lines to them and swam and pulled them out and 4 in one go too.
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Please don’t minimise what is an utterly heroic effort on the side of the divers and the kids. Any child who makes it out of this had the strength of character up there with the best of humanity. The divers likewise. There are links here to a well known and respected diving group YouTube page. The (highly) qualified cave divers on there are on record saying that they would never, EVER attempt this dive under normal conditions. It’s so far out of what is an acceptable level of risk in the sport that the two Brits who found the kids and all the support teams are basically venerated as heroes amongst the cave diving community. Cave diving is a “sport” that requires total focus and huge balls. It’s not ******* road cycling. This is one of the biggest rescue stories of a generation. Utterly incomprehensible. And it ****** me off to hear people speak like it’s nothing. The scope for panic and terror in this situation cannot be underestimated.
 
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AndyT said:
Please don’t minimise what is an utterly heroic effort on the side of the divers and the kids. Any child who makes it out of this had the strength of character up there with the best of humanity. The divers likewise. There are links here to a well known and respected diving group YouTube page. The (highly) qualified cave divers on there are on record saying that they would never, EVER attempt this dive under normal conditions. It’s so far out of what is an acceptable level of risk in the sport that the two Brits who found the kids and all the support teams are basically venerated as heroes amongst the cave diving community. Cave diving is a “sport” that requires total focus and huge balls. It’s not ******* road cycling. This is one of the biggest rescue stories of a generation. Utterly incomprehensible. And it ****** me off to hear people speak like it’s nothing. The scope for panic and terror in this situation cannot be underestimated.
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I think he thinks it is like the BBC illustration - a few feet of clearance and short sections - in reality there are sections where they are going down into as much as 30m of water for dozens or even 100s of meters, much of it silted with visibility down to a few feet or worse in places, some of it requiring contortions through tight sections impossible to do while an air tank is strapped on and potentially impossible to turn around combined with water levels and where is and isn't safe liable to change within minutes. With sections where just getting snagged on the nearby rocks could easily result in people dying.
 
Rroff said:
I think he thinks it is like the BBC illustration - a few feet of clearance and short sections - in reality there are sections where they are going down into as much as 30m of water for dozens or even 100s of meters, much of it silted with visibility down to a few feet or worse in places, some of it requiring contortions through tight sections impossible to do while an air tank is strapped on and potentially impossible to turn around combined with water levels and where is and isn't safe liable to change within minutes. With sections where just getting snagged on the nearby rocks could easily result in people dying.
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Exactly, I’ve been saying this over and over. All it takes to understand this situation (in the tiniest, most tame way) is to close your eyes and imagine what it would be like. Crawl under your bed, wear a blindfold and hold your breath. I play hide and seek with my eldest daughter and I’m a resonably fit for a 35 yr old. It takes me ages and a lot of grunting to get in and out from under her bed at the best of times. Under water, in pitch black with a current against me? No thanks. Not to mention it’s a bigger bloody hole to climb into than the worst constrictions these kids have to contend with.

My wife made a good, if slightly morbid point. If all four kids were out alive it’s possible that the media would be at level 11 with the reporting. It’s worrying in a way that “they” haven’t immediately commented on the condition of the boys who are already out. Hopefully this is just the cynic in us expecting the worst....
 
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What these guys have achieved is absolutely spectacular, they are real heroes, the conditions they are working in are unbelievable. These guys had one of their own die on their shift and yet they choose to carry on, they need some extremely high recognition for this.
 
IronWarrior said:
So in the end, they did the most simple thing, put the kids in some swimsuits, gave some basic lessons, gave them a oxygen tank, tied lines to them and swam and pulled them out and 4 in one go too.
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while it sounds simple it isn't really - there is poor visibility, they have to remove their kit to get through the tight section in order to fit + they're carrying the air supply for the kid they're escorting too... given the visibility they can probably barely see the kid they're escorting and it must be a nightmare when they get to that part of the dive and need to remove kit, make sure the kid can follow them through etc..etc.. at any point the kid could get into difficulty, panic etc.. if anything goes wrong then they're in an incredibly dangerous situation

AndyT said:
My wife made a good, if slightly morbid point. If all four kids were out alive it’s possible that the media would be at level 11 with the reporting. It’s worrying in a way that “they” haven’t immediately commented on the condition of the boys who are already out. Hopefully this is just the cynic in us expecting the worst....
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4 kids are out alive, they've already reported on that. I'm not sure why you're being cynical about it, the fact is there are still 8 more waiting to be rescued - it isn't over yet. I'm sure there will be plenty of celebrations when the other 8 are rescued.
 
AndyT said:
My wife made a good, if slightly morbid point. If all four kids were out alive it’s possible that the media would be at level 11 with the reporting. It’s worrying in a way that “they” haven’t immediately commented on the condition of the boys who are already out. Hopefully this is just the cynic in us expecting the worst....
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It's night in Thailand.
 
Loves Love Island said:
4 kids are out alive, they've already reported on that. I'm not sure why you're being cynical about it, the fact is there are still 8 more waiting to be rescued - it isn't over yet. I'm sure there will be plenty of celebrations when the other 8 are rescued.
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Hey, bud, you need to calm down on your posting and reflect inwardly a little. I am hoping with all my heart that these kids get out, but on the one hand the odds are stacked and the info is light. Also you know that my point was related to something my wife said, which given the fluidity of the situation is not incomprehensible, so I made the statement mulling it over on here.
 
AndyT said:
Hey, bud, you need to calm down on your posting and reflect inwardly a little. I am hoping with all my heart that these kids get out, but on the one hand the odds are stacked and the info is light. Also you know that my point was related to something my wife said, which given the fluidity of the situation is not incomprehensible, so I made the statement mulling it over on here.
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I'm not sure why you think I need to calm down? Nor am I particularly clear what you're on about now? Could you clarify perhaps - what exactly are you cynical about? It seems a bit nonsensical thats all.
 
Loves Love Island said:
I'm not sure why you think I need to calm down? Nor am I particularly clear what you're on about now? Could you clarify perhaps - what exactly are you cynical about? It seems a bit nonsensical thats all.
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CALM THE **** DOWN ALREADY, JEEZ MAN, PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO SLEEP HERE!
 
Loves Love Island said:
I'm not sure why you think I need to calm down? Nor am I particularly clear what you're on about now? Could you clarify perhaps - what exactly are you cynical about? It seems a bit nonsensical thats all.
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Haha, OK, the “calm down” point, to be fair, was as much related to your love island drivel as anything else. It’s perception. You seem excitable. In any case, you seemed to have taken me elucidating the fairly reasonable musings of my wife as evidence that I was taking some awful cynical position on this whole operation. I am aware of the risks of the dive, as much as a layperson with some experience of open water diving can be, having read the opinions of people who know much better than us. It’s also not unheard of for reports to be innacurate in the immediate aftermath of big events. I was simply expressing an idea. It’s also a novelty when “the love island guy” quotes you.
 
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You guys are reading far too much in to each others' posts.



Also "Love Island Guy" - this needs to be a thing :D
 
Diddums said:
You guys are reading far too much in to each others' posts.



Also "Love Island Guy" - this needs to be a thing :D
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Yes, you are right, and I don’t want to derail this thread. I hold out the OloveIsland branch of peace.
 
Man, you people really hate the fact that these boys was given some diving lessons, given swimsuits and a oxygen tank and swam out with two other divers leading the way and helping them.

Anyway, Elon Musk's little sub is made and should be over there by now, who knows if they will use it.

The leading British Drivers, Rick Stanton helped with the specifications for the sub to be made.

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1016063173139427329 (I thought we had twitter embed now?)

Wait till the end of the video or skip to it.

That said, no chance in hell would I go inside this thing, if I had a choice, I come out like the first 4.
 
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