E46 / E92 M3 advice

Robbo · 23 Jun 2019 at 19:24

Evening all.

I am looking to change my car in a few months and I really like both the E46 and E92 M3's.

I have no issue with the age of the E46, the interior is perfectly fine and they still look great. However, has the ship sailed on these due to their age now? Can a decent one be had for around £10k or will they all be a bit rough/ruined with aftermarket tat. I'd like a standard one if possible. I'm happy to spend on it, but don't want to be throwing thousands at the car every few months.

Same situation regarding the E92 M3 as above really, I know they are newer so should last a bit longer, their prices seem to have dropped a bit lately too.

Any owners about(I know there are a few), how have you found them reliability wise of late?

I know mrk had a few issues with his E46 (a new engine I believe).

Dis86 · 23 Jun 2019 at 19:42

E92 for that v8 every time.

tom_nieto · 23 Jun 2019 at 20:12

If you’re considering both and truly don’t have a preference, you should buy the newer car every time. The E46 is awesome. So much character and will probably be much more desirable in 20 years, but as a car for now I think you’ll have to consider spending a lot of cash even on a good one as things start requiring refreshing. They’re just of that age unfortunately. You might get really lucky though (or spend top dollar on one to start with). There are a couple of owners here who are fastidious with the care of their e46 M3s with different day to day uses for them. The similarity between them is that they’ve spent a lot of cash keeping them at their very best. This would be the same for any high performance car of this era (the newest e46 is 13 years old, the oldest being 19!).

The E92 is also a fantastic car, but will probably depreciate more before starting to rise. You’ll stand a much better chance of getting a nice one of these I reckon.

Buy an E46 because you absolutely have to have that particular M3. If you’re not too fussed, then go newer. No one would criticise either choice as they’re both great.

Akagi · 23 Jun 2019 at 20:24

If you get an E92 it is an absolute MUST to get the rod bearings replaced, so budget for that as well. I recommend BMR Performance to do the work.

It's a serious weakness in these engines, the shells wear through and eventually it will spin a bearing and grenade the engine.

ninezerofive · 23 Jun 2019 at 20:55

E46 manual coupe all the way, best M car in history. Will always be more valuable than E92.

They are such a bargain in UK, can pick up decent one for 10k, in EU the prices start at 20k.

UK will catch up soon though.

Simon · 23 Jun 2019 at 22:16

Acme said:
If you get an E92 it is an absolute MUST to get the rod bearings replaced, so budget for that as well. I recommend BMR Performance to do the work.

It's a serious weakness in these engines, the shells wear through and eventually it will spin a bearing and grenade the engine.

Oh not more internet scaremongering. It’s not a must the moment you buy one.

StonedPenguin · 24 Jun 2019 at 00:24

I've owned an E92 manual (07) and currently own a DCT (13), Only had the manual about 6 months but 2 years in nearly with the DCT now and reliability wise its been absolutly fine, Not a single issue, I've covered around 22k, Wanted for nothing other than consumables, Warranty costs coming in around £1500 per annum, thats near 3k saved so to speak.

At some point the throttle actuators will need replacing but thats not a huge job, I've read countless threads on Rod bearings and came to the conclusion the americans seem to have more issues than we do over here, Although some forums will have you believe the countrys full of m3s at the roadside in a puddle of oil after having spun a rod.. :rolleyes:

few things ive learnt:

The s65 engine needs a proper warmup (4-5 miles from cold) before your able explore the rev range safely.

When the iDrive tells you to add 1L of oil, add 0.5L max and drive it for a day or two and see what the reading says then.

OEM exhaust mod sounds almost as good as a full akra for the cost of ~£200 vs ~£7k...

Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S are a must on these, Night and day difference to MPSS, The grip is immense.

Takes a little while to get to grips with the power.. 0..3k a snore 4..6k entertaining 6..8.4k an absolute beast

25-28mpg on a long run driven like my gran, 18-20 around town, 13-16 driving hard.

DCT is faster and more suited to the car imo

Simon · 24 Jun 2019 at 00:33

Pretty similar to me I’ve done 20k in 2.5yrs. I replaced throttle actuators at 48k but nothing else needed.

Great car if a little heavy on fuel. Lifetime average on mine is 19.8mpg (real not computer) used every day.

chaparral · 24 Jun 2019 at 05:20

Simon said:
Pretty similar to me I’ve done 20k in 2.5yrs. I replaced throttle actuators at 48k but nothing else needed.

Someone told me it cost £3800 to have these replaced on his E92 m3
Was done by local BMW dealer

Akagi · 24 Jun 2019 at 08:47

Simon said:
Oh not more internet scaremongering. It’s not a must the moment you buy one.

It is if it hasn't been done already IMO. Every single set of bearing shells I've seen removed from one of those engines with as little as 50K on the clock have significant scoring/marking or are worn through to the copper.

I'd just be worrying about it constantly until I got it done if they are in unknown condition.

Simon · 24 Jun 2019 at 09:10

Acme said:
It is if it hasn't been done already IMO. Every single set of bearing shells I've seen removed from one of those engines with as little as 50K on the clock have significant scoring/marking or are worn through to the copper.

I'd just be worrying about it constantly until I got it done if they are in unknown condition.

So you are saying every time one is sold then the bearings need to be changed

Of course you have only seen bad one. No one posts good ones. And many people post pictures of ones showing normal wear thinking they are knackered.

Generally people are getting them done for peace of mind at 50-60k. Anyone who knows what they are listening for will hear rod knock on a cold start anyway.

Oh and the ‘fix’ is people putting identical ones in. It’s more to do with many were ragged from cold in the early days and only being noticed now.

Simon · 24 Jun 2019 at 09:11

chaparral said:
Someone told me it cost £3800 to have these replaced on his E92 m3
Was done by local BMW dealer

£470 for two by rebuild.org with updated gears (OEM are plastic and wear out) and about 1.5hours work for swapping.

Akagi · 24 Jun 2019 at 10:27

Simon said:
So you are saying every time one is sold then the bearings need to be changed

Of course you have only seen bad one. No one posts good ones. And many people post pictures of ones showing normal wear thinking they are knackered.

Generally people are getting them done for peace of mind at 50-60k. Anyone who knows what they are listening for will hear rod knock on a cold start anyway.

Oh and the ‘fix’ is people putting identical ones in. It’s more to do with many were ragged from cold in the early days and only being noticed now.

Well obviously not if there is proof it has been done fairly recently.

Just seems that twice a week I see a post from my mate Barry "Another M3 in today, look at those bearing shells!" - Admittedly there were one or two which had "normal wear" but almost every one was shot.

Vita · 24 Jun 2019 at 11:27

Acme said:
Well obviously not if there is proof it has been done fairly recently.

Just seems that twice a week I see a post from my mate Barry "Another M3 in today, look at those bearing shells!" - Admittedly there were one or two which had "normal wear" but almost every one was shot.

Bread and butter springs to mind.

Whilst I am not disagreeing that the bearings need to be done at some point in an m3s mind, I am going to disagree that the whole issue gets blown out of proportion as only the bad experience has been posted the majority of the time.

There is a lot of scaremongering these days and it's a little sad as a lot of people fall victim to it.

Robbo · 24 Jun 2019 at 11:30

So could these rod bearings and throttle actuators be done for £2kish at a specialist?

If they’re the only unusual mechanical things that need attention that isn’t too bad.

Sounds a bit concerning though. Quite a few for sale have paperwork showing the rod bearings have been done, which I suppose is a good start...

Simon · 24 Jun 2019 at 11:31

Ah yes the people who make it into a big issue with no motive? (Other than to get a load of business from worried people to change them)

Simon · 24 Jun 2019 at 11:31

Robbo said:
So could these rod bearings and throttle actuators be done for £2kish at a specialist?

If they’re the only unusual mechanical things that need attention that isn’t too bad.

Sounds a bit concerning though. Quite a few for sale have paperwork showing the rod bearings have been done, which I suppose is a good start...

Pretty much. The rest of it seems to be reliable including the DCT box

Gibbo · 24 Jun 2019 at 11:37

Acme said:
Well obviously not if there is proof it has been done fairly recently.

Just seems that twice a week I see a post from my mate Barry "Another M3 in today, look at those bearing shells!" - Admittedly there were one or two which had "normal wear" but almost every one was shot.

Mine went on around 105k, was also because of high RPM, but again knock presented itself when at idle, so engine shut down and recovered. Changed shells myself, tuner provided parts FOC as I advised against increase in RPM and they did not listen, car has done over 10k since and no more issues.

I would only change ROD bearings on an E46 or E92 if it had zero history of being done in the past and was over 80k, I would only do it on a lower mileage if the car was a particular bargain because of previous poor ownership or was known as a track car and again had not being done.

On a car under 75k miles with good service history I'd not bother, I'd enjoy the car and get it done once miles reached around 80k or I head knock knock on a cold idle etc.

Gibbo · 24 Jun 2019 at 11:40

Simon said:
Pretty much. The rest of it seems to be reliable including the DCT box

This E92 is generally a very reliable car, only issues are the over played rod bearings and the actuators and both can be done easily for under 2k, pays to shop around and again no point in doing actuators until they fail because they won't harm engine if they fail I believe, correct me if wrong and I'd only worry on rod bearings on higher mileage cars or poor example, otherwise just drive and enjoy.

E46 M3 has more issues I'd say, SMG can be a pain to track faults (my two M3 SMG's reliable however), boot floors but I'd only buy an E46 with proof of repair, again rod bearings but again most being done and I'd not worry on less than 80k, mine went at 105k and had done loads of track work and being over-revved.

They are M cars and though generally reliable they can eat money like no tomorrow but at same time if you leave stock they are not so bad.

MissChief · 24 Jun 2019 at 11:42

An E46 is nice but as said, getting on a bit so will likely need more work doing just to keep it fresh.

My choice would be an E92 Saloon. I think they look mean as ****. The stance is just perfect and if I had the cash that’s where my money would go. Although I also have a desire for a Vauxhall VXR8 for some reason. Actually I know the reason, all 6.2 Litres of it.