I don't trade shares anymore. That's because the industry I work in is heavily regulated and there is far too much red tape and process to do so. I would also have to hold the shares for a minimum timeframe which means it's too risky for bets like this. I heard about Gamestop yesterday and I've been reading/watching a lot on it. It's fascinating. Good luck everyone. Here's hoping it works out for you.
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- Thread starter mcast123
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Wouldn't that have a net zero effect, i.e. they win but the higher price still means they have to pay more to close their short? Or can they use some sort of leverage on that? I'll happily admit to not understanding the intricacies of what's going on here.
Flipside , is it legal to manipulate stock like WSB.
Its a question of what is manipulation. The reason this all started was because hedge funds shorted over 100% of the available shares which meant that if enough people bought the shares and didn't sell then they had them over a barrel. Thats not manipulation, thats taking advantage of market position. Shorting over 100% of a stock however... that is guaranteed to tank the price of a company. Basically labels it as a sinking ship.
Again, is that illegal manipulation, I have no idea but I'm pretty sure that stopping people from buying and only allowing selling under the guise of "protecting peoples money" is very dodgy and other people have pointed out, exchanges like RH have been quite happy to let them lose huge amounts on other shares. Difference is that their sugar daddies are on the line this time.
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Pretty much just highlights how shady some trading practices are really.
Soldato
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212 back on
I can see why this delusion that WSB are sticking it to the big financial institutions is attractive....but it's not based in reality. Some little player hedge fund is going to lose a short gamble. The big players are making bank off the volatility and will take these redditors to the cleaners.
It would be stupid to think that people in the business are not making huge amounts off this. They know the markets better than anyone and will be playing this. That doesn't mean that the people involved in shorting the stock originally won't be on the hook for billions.
I think people are more excited by the idea that there might be some heads rolling from the people in the top layer of society and perhaps it might lead to more scrutiny of their behaviours and practices. In the next decades a change will come. More and more money is going to fewer and fewer people and eventually the little guy won't have anything. If you take away everything from enough people they will bite back. The fallout from COVID and climate change will change the world, in which way I don't know but I know which way I'm hoping it will go.
Yeah I'm in the same position, it's bloody annoying and the consequences of going rogue are harsh so I won't do it. The only thing we can get away with really is Crypto.
So yeah, I'm on the boring tortoise investment path as opposed to the hare
That i can understand, but wasn't the issue that they only let some people trade in one direction?
Fair enough, refuse custom. However still letting people use it but only trade in one direction is simply market manipulation isn't it?
People are going to angry buy this stock when it opens.
This. Income inequality is getting worse and worse. That aside, a society where the wealthiest give back is fine but at the moment they're just hoarding more and more of the wealth which is exactly what has triggered uprising, unrest and reovlution in the past. Good for the people getting involved with this, just be careful!
Soldato
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The plan was always to dump on friday but with everything that happened yesterday I got a feeling that there is going to be a lot of people emotionally trading instead. Wouldn't be surprised if surges hard.
The whole thing went from a meme, to exposing massive inequality in very real terms. People are upset and rightly so.
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I’ve got a sell order of $500 in I’m really hoping, super greedily, that it doesn’t close on open.
This really is the Lazarus come back I was hoping for.
This really is the Lazarus come back I was hoping for.
It is getting pretty horrendous. The world has a swathe of problems and massive amounts of poverty, whilst the richest are hoarding billions and billions of pounds...and for what? Millions (maybe billions?) of people in the poorest parts of the world are struggling day to day, whilst a few are just stacking their coffers with billions upon billions of pounds.
I'm not advocating for some extreme communist regime here, but the alternative just seems insane (having potentially trillions being shifted around between the wealthiest 0.0001% of the world whilst large parts of the rest of it suffers).
I jumped out yesterday during the manipulated nose dive, lost 50% of my 1 share so regret that now, but I don't really want to be sat here all afternoon/evening watching the price! I just want some sense of normality to resume as all my other shares have lost loads of their gains the past few days, boo.
Good luck to all that are in, don't get too greedy, take some money and put it aside for when Covid is over
Good luck to all that are in, don't get too greedy, take some money and put it aside for when Covid is over
For anyone who has been wondering what the hell happened.
1. The apps such as Robinhood and Trading212 are a platform to sell.
2. Once you buy or sell it goes to a clearing house. There are 2 parts to a clearing house the retail side ( APEX ) and DTC for the street ( Settle 95% of all trades. )
3. DTC need to make sure there is a orderly market place. Ie. You click sell you know your getting paid, that is what they guarantee. They do this by requiring a 2% deposit for every single trade made by a clearing house. This is held for 2 days. The clearing house is the one who has to put this money up in cash.
4. AS GME and AMC are so volatile and so many trades are happening DTC demanded a 100% deposit on every single trade made which needs to be held for 2 days. So the clearing house has to physically send in cash 100's of billions of dollars to DTC. The Clearing houses couldn't afford this so they told all the apps to stop allowing these trades.
Now this brings it to the questions which need to be asked.
1. Why was DTC allowed to up the deposit amount just to basically protect its self. As if Melvin goes bust the losses fall onto the DTC and the Clearing house as they have to cover those loses. They basically manipulated the market to save them selves and did a forced bailout of wallstreet by using retail investors money by allowing the stock to drop so low by stopping buys thus allowing melvin and the other shorters a way out at a price a fraction of the price of what the market dictated.
2. If they were worried about the liquidity why was the stock not fully suspended to everyone why did the stock exchange or SEC not step in, then freeze the stock for a day to allow the clearing houses to get more capital from the banks. which is exactly what they are doing now. By only stopping retail it was market manipulation to help save wallstreet.
3. Because there will not be these big firms failing or not failing as hard as they originally would, they will continue to do this as they know they can just stop the market when their losses get to big. So there needs to be a ban on shorting or at least only upto a a certain percentage of the stock as the losses are literally unlimited which will mean the institutions will step in every single time to help them.
Also for the first time ive actually seen the point of blockchain. If they were using this there would be no need for these middlemen holding money for 2 days as buys and sells would be instant.
1. The apps such as Robinhood and Trading212 are a platform to sell.
2. Once you buy or sell it goes to a clearing house. There are 2 parts to a clearing house the retail side ( APEX ) and DTC for the street ( Settle 95% of all trades. )
3. DTC need to make sure there is a orderly market place. Ie. You click sell you know your getting paid, that is what they guarantee. They do this by requiring a 2% deposit for every single trade made by a clearing house. This is held for 2 days. The clearing house is the one who has to put this money up in cash.
4. AS GME and AMC are so volatile and so many trades are happening DTC demanded a 100% deposit on every single trade made which needs to be held for 2 days. So the clearing house has to physically send in cash 100's of billions of dollars to DTC. The Clearing houses couldn't afford this so they told all the apps to stop allowing these trades.
Now this brings it to the questions which need to be asked.
1. Why was DTC allowed to up the deposit amount just to basically protect its self. As if Melvin goes bust the losses fall onto the DTC and the Clearing house as they have to cover those loses. They basically manipulated the market to save them selves and did a forced bailout of wallstreet by using retail investors money by allowing the stock to drop so low by stopping buys thus allowing melvin and the other shorters a way out at a price a fraction of the price of what the market dictated.
2. If they were worried about the liquidity why was the stock not fully suspended to everyone why did the stock exchange or SEC not step in, then freeze the stock for a day to allow the clearing houses to get more capital from the banks. which is exactly what they are doing now. By only stopping retail it was market manipulation to help save wallstreet.
3. Because there will not be these big firms failing or not failing as hard as they originally would, they will continue to do this as they know they can just stop the market when their losses get to big. So there needs to be a ban on shorting or at least only upto a a certain percentage of the stock as the losses are literally unlimited which will mean the institutions will step in every single time to help them.
Also for the first time ive actually seen the point of blockchain. If they were using this there would be no need for these middlemen holding money for 2 days as buys and sells would be instant.
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Soldato
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People cant visualise what a billion dollars actually means and just how ridiculous it is for an entity to have that amount. The best explanation I have seen actually came from a late Twitch streamer:
Soldato
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Perhaps, this could be said for yesterday first thing too, where it jumped up to 470 and then you know the rest.
I wonder if something similar will happened today. A final jump up, and everyone leaves fearing another dip as yesterday.
The difference today being that we've seen even a dip down to 120 has totally recovered in absolutely no time.
People appear to be able to buy again through robinhood and maybe t212.
The news we more gloom yesterday than it is today.
Friday was the day most said to sell, is that still the plan, will enough fear this and just sell out of fear that others will do the same
Weekend is coming up. Does anyone want to be stuck holding this stock for that many days while the markets are closed (to normal people)