Anybody else resenting AMD because of DLSS?

[humbug]

It isn't just going to be a case of once directml is finished/implemented, job done for the pc version too.... Work will still need to be put into the pc version with each and every game.....and as people have already mentioned, there is a "chance" that directlml version won't be as good as nvidias dlss i.e. either the performance uplift will be minimal or if it is drastic, expect IQ to suffer and if so, no pc gamer will want to use directml.

It's like what everyone kept saying when it was first announced amd would be powering all the consoles, "every game on the pc will run so much better on amd hardware going forward".... how did that end up?

DirectML is an open standard, Nvidia and AMD alike can use it, compare that with DLSS which is Nvidia exclusive and doesn't work on the consoles.

Nvidia's market share is PC exclusive, AMD market share is PC and exclusively consoles.

With that in mind which do you think is going to become "the" standard for this type of technology, DirectML or DLSS? What happened to Games Works? What happened to PhysX? What happened to G-Sync Modules in screens?

Nvidia keep trying to carve out a market for features where you have to be an exclusive Nvidia user, AMD keep throwing a spanner in Nvidia's "Works" by making these technologies available to everyone.

If you want any of Nvidia's feature technology to stick, ever, just once.... its Nvidia who will have to change their approach, its AMD's model, not Nvidia's which is successful.

 

[Nexus18]

Speaking of AMDs GPUopen approach.

Whatever happened with their tech such as the tressfx, particle effects etc.? As wasn't this suppose to be a case of any developer can just take the code and implement it in their game with ease and for free? I think it was only alien isolation that used particle and fire effects and tomb raider + deus ex for the hair/tressfx??? If there is more, it certainly isn't widespread....

So yet another case of things supposedly being really easy to implement for pc games and that they would be used in every game yet it never quite turns out that way!

 

[nvidiamd]

Ahead by how much? is it comparable to the 21% AMD cards have in Valhalla?

I think it is even more in Hitman 3.

 

[Hotwired]

It's like what everyone kept saying when it was first announced amd would be powering all the consoles, "every game on the pc will run so much better on amd hardware going forward".... how did that end up?

Kinda awkward to put yourself there because AMD is in fact competing at the high end again and wasn't previously

Price is whatever the performance matches. But the performance is there.

 

[nvidiamd]

DirectML is an open standard, Nvidia and AMD alike can use it, compare that with DLSS which is Nvidia exclusive and doesn't work on the consoles.

Nvidia's market share is PC exclusive, AMD market share is PC and exclusively consoles.

With that in mind which do you think is going to become "the" standard for this type of technology, DirectML or DLSS? What happened to Games Works? What happened to PhysX? What happened to G-Sync Modules in screens?

Nvidia keep trying to carve out a market for features where you have to be an exclusive Nvidia user, AMD keep throwing a spanner in Nvidia's "Works" by making these technologies available to everyone.

If you want any of Nvidia feature technology to stick, ever, just once.... its Nvidia who will have to change their approach, its AMD's model, not Nvidia's which is successful.

Tbh AMD is playing the open source card because this is the only card they have. With more money and human resources, they will do exactly what Nvidia is doing.

 

[ebilcake]

I think it is even more in Hitman 3.

Only 10% at 1440p, minimums look way better on the 6800XT vs the RTX3080, would make no difference which card you use in this case as both are averaging over 100fps.

 

[humbug]

Tbh AMD is playing the open source card because this is the only card they have. With more money and human resources, they will do exactly what Nvidia is doing.

Yes, irrelevant.... it works.

 

[humbug]

DLSS will be dead inside 2 years.

 

[Nexus18]

DirectML is an open standard, Nvidia and AMD alike can use it, compare that with DLSS which is Nvidia exclusive and doesn't work on the consoles.

Nvidia's market share is PC exclusive, AMD market share is PC and exclusively consoles.

With that in mind which do you think is going to become "the" standard for this type of technology, DirectML or DLSS? What happened to Games Works? What happened to PhysX? What happened to G-Sync Modules in screens?

Nvidia keep trying to carve out a market for features where you have to be an exclusive Nvidia user, AMD keep throwing a spanner in Nvidia's "Works" by making these technologies available to everyone.

If you want any of Nvidia's feature technology to stick, ever, just once.... its Nvidia who will have to change their approach, its AMD's model, not Nvidia's which is successful.

I don't disagree, open source will always win for the reasons you said there but see this post of mine:

Speaking of AMDs GPUopen approach.

Whatever happened with their tech such as the tressfx, particle effects etc.? As wasn't this suppose to be a case of any developer can just take the code and implement it in their game with ease and for free? I think it was only alien isolation that used particle and fire effects and tomb raider + deus ex for the hair/tressfx??? If there is more, it certainly isn't widespread....

So yet another case of things supposedly being really easy to implement for pc games and that they would be used in every game yet it never quite turns out that way!

i.e. just because something is free/open source doesn't automatically mean that you can just go of and twiddle your thumbs, amd/microsoft will still need to put the work in if they want it to be a case of every game offering this and to a good standard on the PC version otherwise it will end up only in a handful of games like the majority of their other "GPUopen" "features"

Kinda awkward to put yourself there because AMD is in fact competing at the high end again and wasn't previously

Price is whatever the performance matches. But the performance is there.

I'm referring to the posts throughout the time where everyone and tbh, even myself thought that nvidia would be left behind in the dust because amd had the consoles so naturally you would think better optimisation for desktop pcs with amd hardware but given that nvidia are still matching/beating amd depending what you look at it, clearly having amd in consoles hasn't helped to the way we initially thought.

 

[nvidiamd]

Only 10% at 1440p, minimums look way better on the 6800XT vs the RTX3080, would make no difference which card you use in this case as both are averaging over 100fps.

We were talking about 6800 vs 3070. What is the difference at 1440p? I know that you get more FPS in this game but the gap is huge. And that was a game where none of the two companies got involved, unlike games like CP2077, AC Valhalla or Dirt5.

 

[nvidiamd]

I don't disagree, open source will always win for the reasons you said there but see this post of mine:



i.e. just because something is free/open source doesn't automatically mean that you can just go of and twiddle your thumbs, amd/microsoft will still need to put the work in if they want it to be a case of every game offering this and to a good standard on the PC version otherwise it will end up only in a handful of games like the majority of their other "GPUopen" "features"



I'm referring to the posts throughout the time where everyone and tbh, even myself thought that nvidia would be left behind in the dust because amd had the consoles so naturally you would think better optimisation for desktop pcs with amd hardware but given that nvidia are still matching/beating amd depending what you look at it, clearly having amd in consoles hasn't helped to the way we initially thought.

It is not about being open source but about being pushed by Microsoft. For example even with DLSS open source, if Microsoft will develop another form of upscaling, the DLSS will lose the competition.

 

[ebilcake]

We were talking about 6800 vs 3070. What is the difference at 1440p? I know that you get more FPS in this game but the gap is huge. And that was a game where none of the two companies got involved, unlike games like CP2077, AC Valhalla or Dirt5.

27% swing for AMD in that case, again much higher minimums on the 6800 vs the 3070. Hitman 3 is an AMD game.

Not enough to ruin the experience on a 3070 but it's getting there.

 

[nvidiamd]

27% swing for AMD in that case, again much higher minimums on the 6800 vs the 3070. Hitman 3 is an AMD game.

Not enough to ruin the experience on a 3070 but it's getting there.

It is not AMD it was sponsored by Intel but probably was well optimized for consoles and that's why it runs much faster on AMD cards.That may be the case for every game where Nvidia doesn't get involved in the PC release.

 

[humbug]

I don't resent AMD for constantly peeing on Nvidia's camp fires.

I do resent Nvidia constantly trying to lock me into their hardware, i'm grateful AMD are there to frustrate Nvidia in that, even if it is for entirely their own reasons.

DLSS will be dead soon enough, good riddance.

 

[Nexus18]

It is not about being open source but about being pushed by Microsoft. For example even with DLSS open source, if Microsoft will develop another form of upscaling, the DLSS will lose the competition.

Not disputing that, it's inevitable that dlss will die out unless nvidia keep sponsoring games to use it or/and it really is as easy to enable in unreal engine 4 based games as unreal engine/nvidia say.... either way, I expect dlss to be around for a good couple of years yet, even if only in a handful of games.

But key wording there is for it to be successful it will still need to be pushed by microsoft and amd (more so from amd for the pc side probably) i.e. they'll most likely have to be amd/microsoft sponsored games otherwise it will just end up like amds other so called easy to implement "openGPU" features i.e. left on a shelf to never be touched again.

Doesn't take a genius to work out that microsoft don't care about PC, the console will always come first.

It is not AMD it was sponsored by Intel but probably was well optimized for consoles and that's why it runs much faster on AMD cards.That may be the case for every game where Nvidia doesn't get involved in the PC release.

Again, people have been saying this since the ps 4 and xbox one were announced/released.... and it's always been a case of nvidia wins some/amd loses some and vice versa, there hasn't been a case where amd have completely and utterly left nvidia in the dust until maybe godfall and perhaps hitman + valhalla (wouldn't say the gap for them 2 last games was that big though) and nvidia will close the gap when the rest of their desktop gpus get resize bar feature enabled as has been seen with the 3060 when paired with amd cpus.

 

[humbug]

Most of us probably have screens with technology in them developed by AMD, i do. we all have Tessellation and Vulkan capable GPU's, thanks to AMD. And we are all quite happy.

DLSS will not be missed.

 

[nvidiamd]

Not disputing that, it's inevitable that dlss will die out unless nvidia keep sponsoring games to use it or/and it really is as easy to enable in unreal engine 4 based games as unreal engine/nvidia say....

But key wording there is for it to be successful it will still need to be pushed by microsoft and amd (more so from amd for the pc side probably) i.e. they'll most likely have to be amd/microsoft sponsored games otherwise it will just end up like amds other so called easy to implement "openGPU" features i.e. left on a shelf to never be touched again.

Doesn't take a genius to work out that microsoft don't care about PC, the console will always come first.

I am not saying that DLSS will die unlike what others think. It may be the case that Nvidia will make it DirectML compatible because it is not that hard and it could become the new standard of upscaling.
The thing with UE4 plugin is not such a great news as many think. It shows that Nvidia is not willing to spend more money and human resources for devs to enable DLSS in their games. Or at least they will try to get the feature for free before paying.
And some devs may do that but if AMD brings their own upscaling and it is any good and open source, then the devs will put pressure on Nvidia because they won't work for free to put two codes inside their games. This is how DLSS will die ( if it will die and not transform into the next standard ).

Again, people have been saying this since the ps 4 and xbox one were announced/released.... and it's always been a case of nvidia wins some/amd loses some and vice versa, there hasn't been a case where amd have completely and utterly left nvidia in the dust until maybe godfall and perhaps hitman + valhalla (wouldn't say the gap for them 2 last games was that big though) and nvidia close the gap when the rest of their desktop gpus get resize bar feature enabled as has been seen with the 3060 when paired with amd cpus.

The thing is we don't have too many new released games where AMD or Nvidia were not involved. One can think that the gap shown in AC Valhalla is the real gap between the two cards while someone else can think that the gap shown in The Medium is the real gap. We will wait and see, i am sure Nvidia will be involved in a lot of major releases on PC so their cards should be fine most of the time. But let's see the games where they don't get involved and also are not sponsored by AMD.

 

[Mesai]

DLSS will be dead soon enough, good riddance.

Why?

 

[nvidiamd]

I don't think DLSS will die even in the next generation of cards. There are a lot of tricks to be played for marketing for example Nvidia can sponsor some games that use both (assuming that by that time we will have 2) methods and show that DLSS has more FPS gains and better IQ, even when that will no longer be the case.
They have a big wallet and they won't dump the tech that easy.
But in time, it will die if it doesn't go open source.

 

[Lightnix]

Why?

Hopefully because there will be some vendor independent alternative. But I don't think DLSS is going anywhere, I think it'll coexist with whatever the cross-platform alternative is as a premium version with probably slightly better quality and performance. More of a value-add than a need-to-have feature. Seeing as Nvidia can farm it out to the tensor cores which is just hardware AMD doesn't have, it seems like there's going to be room to make DLSS a more competitive option for a while yet.