Yes a lot of loopholes have been tightened up for contractors, but the point I was making is that there are more contractors in their 20s than there used to be, people that age were rarely milking the outside I35, high dividend, dodgy offshore loans etc etc. The contracts they are getting today still pay a lot more than perm roles used to, this is still people in their 20s raking in six-figure earnings compared to them getting paid say £50k salary in the old days at that age as they couldn't get that level of seniority/remuneration that early.
How are people affording cars?
- Thread starter flibbage0
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This is one of the great myths of our time! It was probably true 30 odd years ago but most normal modern cars will run for donkeys years and run up moon millage without pulling on mega bills. My 18 year old Mondeo has thrown up one significant bill in the 14 years I’ve owned it (the classic dmf eating itself, funny how the replacement has done nearly twice the miles the first managed ….). The rest has just been consumables, yes it’s tired and I can see why a lot of people would replace it but for the few hundred quid a year in service and mot costs I couldn’t buy anything better!
Soldato
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Healthcare is undoubtedly an outlier here. Sod all pay rises over the last 15 years. In the NHS we effectively have a single monopoly employer so until it collapses and gets privatised the vast majority (especially clinicians) are stuck with what we have!
Im not sure that is true, old modern cars, particularly diesels, have the potential to throw some mega bills in quick succession.
It’s a matter of when and not ‘if’ you’ll need new injectors, turbos and DMF’s/clutch before considering anything electric and none of these our cheap when you have to pay someone to fix them, in addition to all the usual consumables, worn suspension parts etc etc.
While they are very repairable, the cumulative in cost IS significant and in normal times outweigh the value of the car.
I'm currently looking at buying an Indian Vintage motorbike. Was talking to the salesman in the dealership and I asked him this very question. He's been with the dealership for 2 years and he says he's seen outright cash purchases on bikes less than 5 times.
Kinda considering the purchase at the moment. I could pay cash but then there's an opportunity cost in the market, although the market is returning nothing at the moment.
Kinda considering the purchase at the moment. I could pay cash but then there's an opportunity cost in the market, although the market is returning nothing at the moment.
I have only had 2 cars ,both Skoda Fabia sdis estates since being on here, the last one i took to 270k with no injectors ,non turbo cars so no probs there the one i run now has manual windows ,no central locking ,the immobiliser did start staying on so i had it deleted.
Apart from that it gets through wishbones and droplinks as i live down an unmade road but on the whole i just service it and it just plods on .it will even go up fraddon hill on the A30 (the one with mcdonalds at the bottom) in 5th gear with a good run up !
A modern turbo if looked after will do 150k+ which is well beyond the point most people are selling up because ‘bills’. The dmf issues seem to be greatly reduced I assume by car makers sneaking out upgraded parts of without admitting that the originals were junk! (My first one did about 50k the replacement 100k already and no hint of the death rattle) injectors do seem to be a lottery.
It’s not even really “modern” cars that can do that. My old 2003 330d managed 166k on the original turbo. No idea if the previous owner (@NickXX) did a clutch/flywheel change though.
That’s not a modern diesel then is it? Modern diesels are significantly more complex.
When the injectors went on mine it was on 90k/10 years which early but not pre-mature. The engine ran fine until the day it left me stranded in the side of the road. It still doesn’t change that it’s a £1200 bill on top of its usual maintenance. Normally such a car which wouldn’t (prior to about 18 months ago) be worth much more than that.
The issue is that these bills tend to land at a time when other maintenance items need doing such as the timing belt and other wear components which will all be coming to the end of their useful life (suspension parts mainly).
Like I said that’s before considering a plethora of electronic and emission control systems that must work to keep the car on the road and are never cheap to repair.
While all of these points are repairable and individually they are not horrendous. Cumulatively you are sinking a lot of money into a car that likely to continue generating bills going forward and value as pretty much bottomed out.
If your happy to go trawling the classifieds and breakers for used parts or do the work yourself then sure you’ll be able to keep an older modern car on the road but in reality that just isn’t going to happen for the vast majority of people. Most will just not bother with the more expensive maintenance items such as timing belts, run it until it throws a big bill and get short of it.
The next thing in about a decade will be writing off cars because their headlights have failed and cost £lol to fix. Gone are the days of changing a £2 bulb on modern cars and LEDs still have a finite life, the there is all the leveling and matrix functions to add on.
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Per month, amirite
I jest of course, but in the current car market, doing what you do would net me something awful. Anything remotely interesting and somewhat reliable would be around 5% of my gross annual earnings at a minimum.
Soldato
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I often wonder what is going on with the sort of cars I see parked up on the street. I earn a decent living but there is no way I could afford the PCP on a flash Audi/BMW/Merc. Even the monthly on a finance deal on a 10 year old flash car is too much.
Everyone is crying poverty and yet you wouldn't think it from the cars knocking around.
Everyone is crying poverty and yet you wouldn't think it from the cars knocking around.
And don’t forget the number of households with 2/3 of the things! It seems every 18 year old near me has a Mercedes’ a class!
I disagree. yes the fundamentals are maybe more robust but they are a lot more on modern cars and they more complex. Once you get to 60,000 miles and in into the period when timing belts/chains need replacing and thats a £1000 bill or the air suspension goes and each wheel is a £1400 bill and once one has gone, it will likely follow that the other 3 will need replacing soon etc.
Older modern hi tech cars can soon start costing £5k a year to keep on the road and thats £400 a month you could be paying to a new car with full warranty.
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Which normal cars cost 5k per year in repairs to run? By normal I mean not a Range Rover or an S Class or an M5.
Maybe not "normal" then but even "normal" cars have lots more tech on board. A run of the mill modern suzuki has sensores, variable cruise control, 360 degree cameras etc. And the engines are many times more complex than older cars.
Yes the example I gave was a q7.
Modern cars once they are 10+ in age will definitely cost more to keep on the road than cars from 2012 do in 2022.
I agree but not to the point where it's going to cost £5000 a year in repairs to keep these cars going. To some extent the increase in complexity is offset by the increase in reliability.
How often do you need to replace a camera or a sensor on a Suzuki?
No idea, older Suzukis never had any of this tech.
If you have no idea how reliable this tech is how can you arrive at the conclusion cars are going to cost £5000 a year in repairs to keep on the road?!
Id expect it to be very reliable, I would not be surprised if the average Suzuki needs a replacement camera once in it's life if at all.
There are various Lexus models on autotrader which are from the mid 2000s with reversing cameras fitted. I bet most are the original factory part.