Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

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Rroff said:
This is why their S-400 complexes, etc. tend to be inactive or only partially active a lot of the time :s and why civilian aircraft are routed like 200+ miles from them :s

EDIT: I see Russia is claiming they were shot down by resistance/"saboteurs" rather than friendly fire.
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Looks like an SU-35 has now being shot down too

Oryx is happy with the evidence and has already added to his list




 
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Rilot said:
What is starting to concern me is what happens once all this is over. Russia could descend in to civil war with places like Chechnya breaking away and a struggle for power erupting between the establishment and new people such as the boss of Wagner.
That could get messy real fast and would produce a humanitarian crisis of significant magnitude.
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This is far from easy to implement, but I would like to see a deal that offers western support to Russia (economic and even military) in exchange for Putin leaving the picture, the release of all political prisoners, expropriation of wealth accumulated through corruption since 1990, a dezification program and free and fair elections which excludes anyone closely associated with the current regime.
 
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Stretch said:
This is far from easy to implement, but I would like to see a deal that offers western support to Russia (economic and even military) in exchange for Putin leaving the picture, the release of all political prisoners, expropriation of wealth accumulated through corruption since 1990, a dezification program and free and fair elections which excludes anyone closely associated with the current regime.
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The people benefitting from corruption are going to do everything in their power to hold on to their benefits. I can’t see any offers from the West helping (would like to be wrong).
 
Rilot said:
What is starting to concern me is what happens once all this is over. Russia could descend in to civil war with places like Chechnya breaking away and a struggle for power erupting between the establishment and new people such as the boss of Wagner.
That could get messy real fast and would produce a humanitarian crisis of significant magnitude.
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Caucasus blowing up - who would have thought :P
 
Stretch said:
This is far from easy to implement, but I would like to see a deal that offers western support to Russia (economic and even military) in exchange for Putin leaving the picture, the release of all political prisoners, expropriation of wealth accumulated through corruption since 1990, a dezification program and free and fair elections which excludes anyone closely associated with the current regime.
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You forgot getting down on one knee..... :)
 
Stretch said:
This is far from easy to implement, but I would like to see a deal that offers western support to Russia (economic and even military) in exchange for Putin leaving the picture, the release of all political prisoners, expropriation of wealth accumulated through corruption since 1990, a dezification program and free and fair elections which excludes anyone closely associated with the current regime.
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Yeah there's more chance of George Bush being tried at ICC than any of this lmao
 
Stu999 said:
The people benefitting from corruption are going to do everything in their power to hold on to their benefits. I can’t see any offers from the West helping (would like to be wrong).
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Yeah. I understand the challenges. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

The conditions required to make it possible are clearly some way off, but things can change very quickly and one way or another we will need to respond to that change.
 
Rilot said:
What is starting to concern me is what happens once all this is over. Russia could descend in to civil war with places like Chechnya breaking away and a struggle for power erupting between the establishment and new people such as the boss of Wagner.
That could get messy real fast and would produce a humanitarian crisis of significant magnitude.
Click to expand...

I'm coming round to the view that a collapse of Russia is inevitable. The country has too many problems, and too many disparate regions. But any collapse, or any civil war, is going to be extremely messy with huge humanitarian cost; and it's not just going to be in Russia - across the post Soviet various -stans there are frozen conflicts, many created deliberately as a form of control, which are poised to explode and the only reason they haven't so far is because Russia has been playing Policeman.
 
Mr Jack said:
I'm coming round to the view that a collapse of Russia is inevitable. The country has too many problems, and too many disparate regions. But any collapse, or any civil war, is going to be extremely messy with huge humanitarian cost; and it's not just going to be in Russia - across the post Soviet various -stans there are frozen conflicts, many created deliberately as a form of control, which are poised to explode and the only reason they haven't so far is because Russia has been playing Policeman.
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And as usual we dash in and disturb that status quo thinking we are their saviours, whereas we just make another rod for our own back. Why the hell we keep interfering in other people's problems only to further exacerbate our (more than sufficient) own, I don't know. Gadaffi plainly told us what fiddling about with him in Libya would unleash, and he was spot on. Whilst unable to control the emptying of Africa into the west we go and poke another hornet's nest.
 
I don't even want to think of the potential consequences and logistics of dealing with Russia's ageing nuclear capabilities if the country does fall apart including their ongoing commitments to the maintenance and running of nuclear power plants in various other countries.
 
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