Poll: Official 2025 Mexico City Grand Prix Race Thread - Autódromo Hermanos Rodríguez - Race 20/24

Rate the XE race out of ten


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If the attackers front axel is ahead of the defenders mirror then it's the attackers corner and is entitled to the racing line.
Yeah, and Max didn't have that. At best it was 50/50 so he should leave room. But this is Max all over - throw it up the inside and make it impossible for anyone to tell who was infront at the apex (dumb rule) and therefore get away with it. It's his whole racing repertoire.
Max was only pushed off because Leclerc and Hamilton moved left. Before then he had space to be where he was. No reason for a car fully alongside to yield.
Max wasn't pushed off. Let's not rewrite the incident. He was squeezed, but given racing room. See his onboard here, half his car was on track the whole time (video starts at correct time);


EDIT: Even he said he was 'squeezed' not pushed off on the radio shown there.

I don't know if he seriously thought he could out-brake all three cars on his right and make the corner first, or if he simply didn't want to yield and therefore took to the run off area to gain an advantage. I'm leaning towards the latter.
 
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Not surprised that you're complaining about it but don't even know the rules.

If the attackers front axel is ahead of the defenders mirror then it's the attackers corner and is entitled to the racing line.

Max basically used Lewis' car/from wing as a bumper/brake. It's unlikely he's keeping it on the track if Lewis isn't there. He then cut the corner and gained massively on the next corner.

Then Lewis tried to get back at him/locked up, but mainly due to Max defending too deep (causing him to go off the track too).

I don't have too much of an issue with lap 1 and turn 1-3 with Max. He was squeezed, and did have to brake on the kerb. I think Leclerc was more deserving of a penalty there as he never gave the place back to Lewis.

However Lewis getting a 10 second penalty and Max getting nothing over their (lap 6?) fighting was stupid.
 
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Max wasn't pushed off. Let's not rewrite the incident. He was squeezed, but given racing room. See his onboard here, half his car was on track the whole time (video starts at correct time);

I'd describe having half his car off track as being "pushed off" personally, you can describe it as "squeezed" if you prefer but to me that is distinction without difference. Either way it was certainly enough to significantly limit his ability to break and change direction which, along with him giving up a place, is why the stewards let this slide I think. If this happens more often then I think they're going to have another look at it but I guess there aren't that many tracks where it could be done anyway.
 
to me that is distinction without difference.
All I’m saying is that “pushed off” implies completely off the track with no racing room. Which was not the case. He decided to hang it out on the outside (still technically on track) and like I said above - I just don’t understand what he thought would happen when they all got to turn one.

Verstappen gained P3 with that turn one run off and he never gave the place back to Lewis — instead fought him for the next 3 corners. He quite rightly should have been penalised for leaving the track and gaining an advantage.
 
Max basically used Lewis' car/from wing as a bumper/brake. It's unlikely he's keeping it on the track if Lewis isn't there. He then cut the corner and gained massively on the next corner.

Then Lewis tried to get back at him/locked up, but mainly due to Max defending too deep (causing him to go off the track too).

I don't have too much of an issue with lap 1 and turn 1-3 with Max. He was squeezed, and did have to brake on the kerb. I think Leclerc was more deserving of a penalty there as he never gave the place back to Lewis.

However Lewis getting a 10 second penalty and Max getting nothing over their (lap 6?) fighting was stupid.

I think he'd just about make the corner even if Lewis wasn't there, he kept most of the car on the track and that bump didn't really slow him that much though as I said during the race I was surprised he didn't get a penalty as it was a late lunge.

As for Lewis' penalty I think 10sec sounds right though I would have thought it would be 5sec for leaving the track and gaining an advantage, he didn't even try to make that corner and went straight down the escape road, and another 5sec for not following race director instruction for re-joining.
 
Max basically used Lewis' car/from wing as a bumper/brake. It's unlikely he's keeping it on the track if Lewis isn't there. He then cut the corner and gained massively on the next corner.

Then Lewis tried to get back at him/locked up, but mainly due to Max defending too deep (causing him to go off the track too).

I don't have too much of an issue with lap 1 and turn 1-3 with Max. He was squeezed, and did have to brake on the kerb. I think Leclerc was more deserving of a penalty there as he never gave the place back to Lewis.

However Lewis getting a 10 second penalty and Max getting nothing over their (lap 6?) fighting was stupid.
The Stewards investigated it and determined that Max was far enough ahead at the right point to claim the corner, so Lewis needed to back out. Whether the rule itself is a good rule, that's a different discussion.

Saying otherwise without any data or evidence isn't a helpful exercise.
 
The Stewards investigated it and determined that Max was far enough ahead at the right point to claim the corner, so Lewis needed to back out. Whether the rule itself is a good rule, that's a different discussion.

Saying otherwise without any data or evidence isn't a helpful exercise.

Can you explain where Lewis was supposed to go? He's already started taking the corner at the racing line way before Max does the divebomb.

I very much doubt Max is making that corner on track without using Lewis as a buffer/to correct his trajectory.

It was just typical Max. Just like his defence which ended up giving Lewis a 10 second penalty. He brakes too late at the wrong angle to ensure Lewis couldn't get by/had to take evasive action, but in doing so didn't make the corner himself.

He only gets his nose ahead because he brakes too late for the corner (meaning he doesn't stay on track). It's just cheating.
 
So, who in RB paid off the stewards??
Max did Classic Max and couldn’t be bothered to brake for turn 1….
No penalty
But Hamilton gets 10s whilst being wheel-banged by……
Verstappen
 
Max did Classic Max and couldn’t be bothered to brake for turn 1….
The 20m long lock up and huge flat spot on his front left would like a word.

He didn't get penalty for the incident where they touched......
Its like some people users in here make it up as they go along to favour their fav driver, rather than watch and learn what the penalty was for.
Its not like they didnt cover it in the post race analysis either, oh wait yes they did.
 
Can you explain where Lewis was supposed to go? He's already started taking the corner at the racing line way before Max does the divebomb.

I very much doubt Max is making that corner on track without using Lewis as a buffer/to correct his trajectory.

It was just typical Max. Just like his defence which ended up giving Lewis a 10 second penalty. He brakes too late at the wrong angle to ensure Lewis couldn't get by/had to take evasive action, but in doing so didn't make the corner himself.

He only gets his nose ahead because he brakes too late for the corner (meaning he doesn't stay on track). It's just cheating.
How is it cheating? You need to separate emotion from fact because it was well within the rules.

He made the lunge and would've made the corner (you can see in the on-board that the bump with Lewis caused him to oversteer), but Lewis chose to keep going.

Lewis then out-braked himself, and gained a place and a gap to the car behind, which is what he was penalised for. Lewis/Ferrari did it to themselves.

 
As for Lewis' penalty I think 10sec sounds right though I would have thought it would be 5sec for leaving the track and gaining an advantage, he didn't even try to make that corner and went straight down the escape road, and another 5sec for not following race director instruction for re-joining.

Why would it be 5s? 10s is the normal penalty so that's what he got.
 
Why are people focussing on the max incident deserving a penalty when Leclercs corner cut on Lap 1 T1 was completely intentional and done purely to regain the position he had lost to Hamilton, he could have easily made the corner if you watch it back but he would have lost the position. Leniency is needed for T1 lap 1 but this was very obvious and should be a clear penalty regardless. I guess it would have been had it been a different team as Ferrari are hardly going to grass up Leclerc for gaining a position on Hamilton.
 
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Max got lucky with 1st lap leniency but still had the sense to back off a bit and that likely went some way to the no further action decision.

I'd have expected Lewis to have done the same given his experience but he didn't, and this was compounded by the Ferrari engineer/pit wall not instructing him to give some time back. I believe this ultimately led to the penalty.

As for whether Max used Lewis for his brakes...... Yeah a little but I guess he did enough to convince the stewards his car remained under control and would have remained so if Lewis wasn't there. It's fine margins and I guess he played the odds again and won out. To be fair, it was a dive Lewis should have seen coming.

As a rule though, I think it needs to go in the bin.

I'm also unsure why there was no interest in Leclerc's gains. Very inconsistent.

I'm not sure what's happened to Oscar. The difference in performance has me convinced it's more than the pressure for competing for the WDC. Something has materially changed since "repercussions-gate" Singapore.
 
I swear tracks of old just had more gravel traps etc..if someone goes off they are basically out of the race. I don't know why most tracks now have ridiculous run off areas.

Yes old tracks were different and in some ways better, but mainly due to safety things changed...

As much as we love to see grass run offs as it instantly gives less grip and a physical/instant penalty rather than virtualised track limits, the problem with grass run offs - especially in the wet - was that it did little to slow the cars down before impacting barriers. Gravel traps came in mainly to slow the cars down quickly before hitting the barrier and was a cheaper solution to completely redesigning or altering track layouts and moving crowd barriers back. These worked well for safety but introduced problems of there own.

Gravel traps ended F1 cars races even if they had a minor track excursion which a lot of fans didn't like, especially when they turned up to watch race and paid F1 ticket prices. In addition, it left cars beached and difficult to recover before we got so addicted to throwing VSCs and SCs which presented higher dangers for drivers and marshalls.
Gravel traps can also cause higher G forces and more harmful crashes when cars and bikes dig in and decelerate under higher forces. They can also cause injury to motorcycle riders. A lot of the tracks used for MotoGP have to be up to a certain standard for the safety of motorcycle crashes which are different to cars. One example would be shallow curbs. So you can see where this is going... every track today is a compromise. A compromise based on modern machinery, safety compliance (which is a moving goal post) and track layout.

Somewhere around late 2000s, into the 2010s it seemed to change where the priority was to favour tarmac run off areas if possible, with much larger run off areas of pure tarmac. You see this in the more modern, purpose built tracks where they've had space to build like in the middle east and have not been limited by the landscape or existing buildings etc. The benefit of large tarmac run offs is fairly obvious. Firstly it's flat. This means it's safer in that cars will not rock through uneven ground and have more chance of remaining in good contact with the floor. For motorcycle riders this is preferrable to minimize injury when sliding. Secondly it provides the best possible grip and friction to decelerate cars/bikes assuming the tyres are able to make contact with the ground. It's also probably cheaper to lay than gravel or grass and easier to maintain.

If one could chose, I guess it would be grass but with very large run offs for safety. This would probably mean the crowd and barriers would be quite far back which might detract from the atmosphere. There is an argument to say, have a look at the street circuits. They allow non existent run off so why can't we have what we want?
 
I thought they could either give 5, 10 or even drive through penalty depending on circumstances

They can but the standard penalty is 10s and has been for quite a while. They only give 5s if there is some mitigating circumstances or if it is deemed to be a very minor breach of the rules, and they still reserve the more severe penalties for worse offences, deliberate actions, and repeated actions.
 
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Well that was a nice change from the boring race we've been having the last few times.

Lando nailed the start. I am shocked he didn't lose his position at this track with the big run to T1. Brilliant stuff honestly.

Good stuff overall and the rest of the season is poised very nicely!
 
George sounded like he was enjoying himself in that race. ;)

"I've got a BLEEEEEP up my BLEEEEEEP BLEEEP"

Toto: "George don't bring ze Mercedes hozpitality into this on live radio pleeeze"
 
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