The poor run going back to last season was not all down to bad luck.
Besides, I'm not here to give balanced opinions
AmorIN!
Poll: AmorOut - Who next?
- Thread starter Robbo
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Besides, I'm not here to give balanced opinions
AmorIN!
Forest game wasn't as bad as all that. It's an accurate reflection of where we are. ie far short of being able to routinely beat teams away from home. We have addressed some weak spots (keeper, attacking forwards) but not others. The "others" are now glaring as they hamstring the team. LWB and specifically Dalot are now a big issue in terms of chance provision for our giant striker. We bought a 6'5" lad who's better in the air than Hojlund only to still not cross the ball in open play. The "system" seems better understood and becoming more flexible as the players learn it and i think we are generally seeing better application and appetite.
We still have 34yo Casemiro looking like our best midfielder when almost every other club has better. Fernandes is neutered as an attacking force and Ugarte/Mainoo have gone from starting combo to 10 minute last resort cameos. Thats a big issue. We are yet to see Amorim improve a player in my opinion so that needs addressing. Maybe Dorgu is the candidate for that?
The league is more competitive than ever. The table is very confusing and very congested. four points separate 11th and 2nd. United need to smash Tottenham on Saturday to build on the improvement otherwise it's really back to square two on the Snakes and Ladders board.
The thing that worried me again about the Forest game was that we were simply outfought for the most part. They had more energy and industry than us. We have one game a week. Theres no excuse.
I didn't particularly notice that. It felt quite even but as I said, when you see a player like Anderson you realise what we miss in a midfield of Cas and Bruno. Amad got a bit bullied by Hudson Odoi at times but he did fight. Cunha had a good game defensively. Dalot is the obvious weakness - for such an athlete he is far from imposing. We would have lost that match last season. Shaw actually played very well in the first half and you know i can't stand him, De Ligt is our most consistent player but Yoro was slightly off it. The other disappointment was Sesko. He looked a bit off the pace with his touch and sharpness.
We simply must beat Spurs. Tough because we never win in London these days. They are under more pressure.
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I'm back to being ambivalent again.
While I like Amorim as a person, if we're being completely honest, he looks well out of his depth and hasn't really shown anything of substance. His record since taking over is relegation battle territory. I find the whole not watching penalties thing a bit weird, it makes him look weak, and a weak man cannot manage this club. I maintain that if Graham Potter was in his place, there would be riots outside the stadium over his performance so far.
Of course the squad is nowhere near good enough either, and as we've seen, take away any of our best players and things start to look pretty awful once again. However, whether the squad is good or bad, the manager's job is to make it perform as more than the sum of its parts, and he absolutely does not do that. If anything it's the opposite, he makes them worse.
I wanted to give him 10 games and he just about did well enough in the end, aside from a couple of particularly dark moments (Grimsby and Brentford) - now I want to see some progression and decent performances. Everton was a real setback and it reversed the good feeling from the past few weeks.
Realistically top 6 is a step too far for this squad, but if Amorim is doing his job we should be fairly close to that. We're likely to lose on Sunday and then the knives will be back out again. The games after that aren't too bad, so we'll see how things look after the Leeds game on 4th January. If we're bottom half then I think serious questions need to be asked.
While I like Amorim as a person, if we're being completely honest, he looks well out of his depth and hasn't really shown anything of substance. His record since taking over is relegation battle territory. I find the whole not watching penalties thing a bit weird, it makes him look weak, and a weak man cannot manage this club. I maintain that if Graham Potter was in his place, there would be riots outside the stadium over his performance so far.
Of course the squad is nowhere near good enough either, and as we've seen, take away any of our best players and things start to look pretty awful once again. However, whether the squad is good or bad, the manager's job is to make it perform as more than the sum of its parts, and he absolutely does not do that. If anything it's the opposite, he makes them worse.
I wanted to give him 10 games and he just about did well enough in the end, aside from a couple of particularly dark moments (Grimsby and Brentford) - now I want to see some progression and decent performances. Everton was a real setback and it reversed the good feeling from the past few weeks.
Realistically top 6 is a step too far for this squad, but if Amorim is doing his job we should be fairly close to that. We're likely to lose on Sunday and then the knives will be back out again. The games after that aren't too bad, so we'll see how things look after the Leeds game on 4th January. If we're bottom half then I think serious questions need to be asked.
The game on Monday wasn't meant to be too bad either...
I dunno, yeh he's a likeable character and I'd like to see him succeed and I know there are gaps in the squad.
But when Everton went down to 10 and we continued to play 5 at the back... That was the straw that broke the camel's back for me.
Who would replace him? No idea lol. So many managers since Fergie and varied ones at that. But I would be surprised if we can't do better than Amorim.
I would agree the Everton game was quite damning. Following the early red card, the focus shifted to Amorim to make some positive changes to win the game, and he just looked absolutely clueless. It was very disappointing.
Another interesting point is that Ratcliffe is widely considered to be a ruthless businessman, but he seems to love Amorim. He's had the wool pulled over his eyes too! Of course it's right not to make any hasty decisions, but he's managed 55 games for us now and I don't think it's unfair to say the vast majority of those have been pretty bad.
As for who would replace him, I've absolutely no idea. I don't think the season can be fixed from here, the league is too competitive and the players are underwhelming, but we need a lot more from Amorim too.
Another interesting point is that Ratcliffe is widely considered to be a ruthless businessman, but he seems to love Amorim. He's had the wool pulled over his eyes too! Of course it's right not to make any hasty decisions, but he's managed 55 games for us now and I don't think it's unfair to say the vast majority of those have been pretty bad.
As for who would replace him, I've absolutely no idea. I don't think the season can be fixed from here, the league is too competitive and the players are underwhelming, but we need a lot more from Amorim too.
Soldato
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Man Utd and Liverpool could swap managers and see if it helps
I think we need to actually get the players in that this system needs in January. I would love it if Amorin would show some flexibility, but that ain't happening, but I don't think ejecting him at this point is a wise idea.
We still have a lot of dead wood. We've made some great signings recently which have improved the team, but there are some glaring problems. Some players on the left that can actually pass and cross would be nice. The right side with Amad and Mbuemo is looking pretty good.
Our squad depth is absolutely dire still. Was watching the forest game yesterday and was thinking how much better, VASTLY better their bench is than ours. Pretty sad state of affairs. Part of the problem really, he doesn't have any better players to bring on most of the time.
We still have a lot of dead wood. We've made some great signings recently which have improved the team, but there are some glaring problems. Some players on the left that can actually pass and cross would be nice. The right side with Amad and Mbuemo is looking pretty good.
Our squad depth is absolutely dire still. Was watching the forest game yesterday and was thinking how much better, VASTLY better their bench is than ours. Pretty sad state of affairs. Part of the problem really, he doesn't have any better players to bring on most of the time.
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naaah Slot is the worst Pool manager since Michael Barrymore...
Soldato
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Man Utd spent £200m last summer buying players that don't suit this system?
How much would it cost to buy the players that suit this system? Maybe changing the system to suit the players the club has might be a better idea.
We bought some. The whole squad needs an overhaul.
I think we have already established that Amorin isn't changing his system.
Caporegime
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That's not on Amorim. The people running things decided they wanted to change systems completely. They've bought 5 players since Amorim took over. That isn't even half a starting lineup let alone a squad.
Is there a formation that would get more out of this team? If so he needs to go, if not then he needs to stay as the club really doesn't need more instability.
I do think the players are a bigger issue but his inflexibility will surely not be good for the long term?
I do think the players are a bigger issue but his inflexibility will surely not be good for the long term?
Yes. 4 at the back. We don’t have the players for a 2 man midfield but we would be better if we had a 3 man midfield. We still need to buy some CMs but it would be better.
The big issue is the 5 at the back along with weak wing backs. Wasting a CB when you’re attacking and relying on your crap LBW for attacking threat.
Being outnumbered when you attack and your defenders not knowing who to mark when they’re defending.
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United’s priority at the moment seems to be investing in youth, Radcliffe did allude to that in his interview.
As for Amorim, I too have become frustrated with his tactical decisions no more so than against Everton, but there have been signs of improvement. I don’t see more than a small improvement until next season because by then the team should be 100% Amorim’s choice.
As for Amorim, I too have become frustrated with his tactical decisions no more so than against Everton, but there have been signs of improvement. I don’t see more than a small improvement until next season because by then the team should be 100% Amorim’s choice.
100%? We have loads of people on long contracts
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This is what people tend to forget. We haven't been able to break down teams that low/mid block for a decade. Look at our goals for record in recent year. We are lucky to get >1 goal a game. People criticise the team for being "moments fc" or Penchester United and then show little patience when we hire a coach who is committed to a progressive play style. Of course it's been very frustrating to see the rate of progress but this is no normal club and if you look at games like Everton - we essentially had Lammens, Dorgu and Mbeumo who where recruited while the current coach was there. We hired him to implement his play style and realistically we are 25-30% through the rebuild.
I still think he is speaking a lot of sense and of course he is very honest but we get a lot of insight we didn't get with ten Hag who used to just shake his head and say "it cannot happen". There is a battle and I get why Amorim feels he cannot compromise his messaging because if he does we slip back to the same form and failing of the last ten years. I don't agree with everything he does. Some things infuriate me but he is trying to address mental weakness in the club and that was never going to be easy.
One positive versus ten Hag era is that you seldom see us outplayed. We were routinely outplayed even when at OT by the likes of Bournemouth, Brighton, Forest, Brentford. We were run through even with three in midfield and 4 defenders. I would like to see him try and bring through some younger players but the pressure is so high that they have to be really special to cope. He's playing to try and get some results and that feels short sighted, especially when its basically the same 11 or 12 players getting game time. Beat west Ham and Wolves in the next 8 days and we cement some progress but I expect there to be more ups and downs.