Best cooling for OC'd E6300 in Antec Sonata III Fan Heater...

[martianrobot]

... er, I mean Antec Sonata III case.

I've OC'd my E6300 to 2.8ghz with a basic BIOS FSB increase to 400 from 266, and I've got my Geil memory running at stock 800mhz with 4-4-4-12 timings. I don't have the confidence or knowledge to get it all higher, but it's very nippy and stable on my new G33 board and I'm happy to leave it at that

However, I also upgraded from a 7600GT to a 8800GTS, and added a couple of drives in a RAID 0 array, so my mATX case was getting cramped and my ropey Xilence 400w PSU felt seriously underpowered. I did think about going for a P182 with a Seasonic, but ended up being a cheapskate (hey! I'm still trying to pay off the past 3 years upgrading addiction!) and going for the Sonata III, as it has good reviews and the PSU is especially rated for my kind of setup. I also think my little G33 board would look a bit lost in a P182!

Got the Sonata today, had fun building the system as tidily as possible, and set it up with XP. Installed the obligatory Oblivion for my personal benchmarking. All well and good - this mofo flys!

However, I'm getting much higher temperatures than ever before - at idle the system and CPU both hover around the 50c mark, though the GPU is only reporting 64c, which aint bad I guess.

For a cooler I'm currently using a Zalman CNPS8000 Ultra Quiet Low Profile, which in my previous setup span at about 1000rpm and kept my non-OC'd E6300 at about 30-40c. It's now spinning at 2000rpm and having trouble! For case fans I've got the standard Antec Tricool on low blowing out the back, and an Akasa AK-183-L2B Amber Ultra Quiet 120mm Fan held onto the drive bay with rubber widgets - this just about squeezes behind my 8800GTS! I think this is the worst aspect of the Sonata III - it's a very ineffective placement for a fan, blowing hot air from the drives over my system, and barely sucking in any cooler air from the front!

It probably doesnt help matters that I have the system in a hideaway workstation next to my full size desk - its the only place I can put it as otherwise I'd be knocking my legs on it all the time. It does help reduce noise, and it does have an open back with my case back about 2 inches away from the wall, but I guess it is still just circulating the hot air it produces.

I'm thinking of upgrading my CPU cooler, but I'm not sure what might be the best solution. Or what might fit in with my combination of hot things!

I've looked at the Scythe Ninja, and then gawped incredulously at the Titan Amanda, until I saw its price tag.

Any suggestions?

 

[WJA96]

If it was me, I would fit a Thermalright HR-01 with the fan duct and reverse the airflow ie. have the rear fan blowing cooler external air directly over the CPU cooler and then use a more powerful fan at the bottom front of the case to pull the hot air out over the HDD. Any hot air gathering in the top of the case will be cleared by the PSU fan. Your PSU will run hotter than before, but it's not a really big issue.

What motherboard do you have? The chipset cooling is super-critical with the HR-01 as it tends to leave a dead-spot exactly where the Northbridge is. For most P965 chipsets and definitely P35 chipsets it's no problem, but some NVidia chipsets I've had have struggled to cope. You probably wouldn't have noticed any issues with chipset cooling with the Zalman, as it's radial.

 

[martianrobot]

If it was me, I would fit a Thermalright HR-01 with the fan duct and reverse the airflow ie. have the rear fan blowing cooler external air directly over the CPU cooler and then use a more powerful fan at the bottom front of the case to pull the hot air out over the HDD. Any hot air gathering in the top of the case will be cleared by the PSU fan. Your PSU will run hotter than before, but it's not a really big issue.

What motherboard do you have? The chipset cooling is super-critical with the HR-01 as it tends to leave a dead-spot exactly where the Northbridge is. For most P965 chipsets and definitely P35 chipsets it's no problem, but some NVidia chipsets I've had have struggled to cope. You probably wouldn't have noticed any issues with chipset cooling with the Zalman, as it's radial.

Cheers for advice. I have a Gigabyte GA-G33M-DS2R, as in my sig. The Northbridge is pretty much in the same place as its big brother the GA-P35_DS3R, though the heatsink is a lot smaller.

I like the idea of your setup suggestion however I'd be concerned that hot air would not be getting out of my case efficiently, as the Antec Earthwatts PSU doesn't have a bottom mounted 120mm fan, or even vents at the bottom, but an 80mm back facing fan and a holey grid at its rear. And as it is the PSU is running quite hot!

The only other thing I can think of is to mod the case and add a CPU duct and maybe a fan to the side panel, destroying the Sonatas lovely paintjob. I have quite a good duct on my old case I can use. However, to be honest if it came to modding I'd rather just sack the Sonata and go for a P182 or Antec 900. Maybe I could rip the EarthWatts PSU out of it and sell the case for £30-40?

I think this case would've been better if they'd reduced it to two external 5.25 drives and one external 3.5 (whoever uses more than that?!), and added a ducted fan either above or below the internal drive rack (which is the best thing about this case - those silicon grommets are little wonders!)

 

[WJA96]

Frankly, you'tre better off starting with a new case as you could spend hundreds trying to bodge that one into working. First loss, least loss.

 

[Frank Grimes]

Try reseating the cpu cooler and if you have the spare change get an Arctic Freezer Pro, it will help with the airflow as it will direct it to the rear fan, although the zalman should be adequate for the job of keeping that cpu cool. Set that triflow fan to its middle setting. In fairness you are not comparing like with like - 30-40C @ 1.86Ghz vs 2.8Ghz @ 50C. How much extra voltage is going through the CPU now? A 10C increase for a 1Ghz overclock is not that outrageous.

 

[martianrobot]

Try reseating the cpu cooler and if you have the spare change get an Arctic Freezer Pro, it will help with the airflow as it will direct it to the rear fan, although the zalman should be adequate for the job of keeping that cpu cool. Set that triflow fan to its middle setting. In fairness you are not comparing like with like - 30-40C @ 1.86Ghz vs 2.8Ghz @ 50C. How much extra voltage is going through the CPU now? A 10C increase for a 1Ghz overclock is not that outrageous.

You are right there - I should stop me moaning! The extra heat and noise is a compromise for the extra power. And 10c is not a great deal more really. It does help if I leave the workstation cupboard door open - drops down to 45/46c at idle.

It is noisier though - but then my previous system only had the stock CPU speed, a 7600GT with Zalman and 1 hard drive! But I guess it's not too bad.

It's running at stock volts I think - all I've done is up the FSB to 400 from 266 in the BIOS.

Still, I want to find a more effectice CPU HSF, and a way to force more cool air into the cas. Its crazy that Antec put so much effort into designing a nice easily removable dust filter at the front, and then making it fairly irrelevant - the screw holes for a fan on the side of the drive cage seem like an afterthought... "Hey! This is case looks great chaps, the punters'll love it, its nice and shiney and has got Silence written on the box and... oh. Where's the intake fan gonna go? Doh!"

Frankly, you'tre better off starting with a new case as you could spend hundreds trying to bodge that one into working. First loss, least loss.

I am still considering going for a P182. I used a P180 in a system build I did for someone last January and loved it. The triple thick panels are great, and I think the compartmentalisation works a treat.

 

[WJA96]

Antec cases look lovely and they have LOADS of features, but all you actually want is box with a couple of fans in it that move air from one side to the other. All this compartmentalisation is un-necessary if you buy cool-running quiet components from the outset.

If you want a proper, small-ish, quiet solution then have a look at the Lian-Li PC-A05 with a Tagan Silence PSU (2 x 80mm tunnel ventilation) and the HR-01 fitted at the back. Draw the cold air in at the back, over the CPU, and expel it at the front. Use the Tagan to mix the air by drawing cool air at the front and expelling it inside the case. I've built seven or eight of those systems for a customer in Portugal and they run very quiet indeed, and very cool.

 

[martianrobot]

Antec cases look lovely and they have LOADS of features, but all you actually want is box with a couple of fans in it that move air from one side to the other. All this compartmentalisation is un-necessary if you buy cool-running quiet components from the outset.

If you want a proper, small-ish, quiet solution then have a look at the Lian-Li PC-A05 with a Tagan Silence PSU (2 x 80mm tunnel ventilation) and the HR-01 fitted at the back. Draw the cold air in at the back, over the CPU, and expel it at the front. Use the Tagan to mix the air by drawing cool air at the front and expelling it inside the case. I've built seven or eight of those systems for a customer in Portugal and they run very quiet indeed, and very cool.

The Lian Li looks nice, and bizarrely enough it's the exact right height to sit under the drawer area of my desk which is a feat as that is the same as my previous mATX case, but the Lian Li takes a full ATX mobo!

Trouble is, it just looks *wrong* inside - and I can see it causing too many problems for my setup. Having the hot PSU at the front right under the hot hard drives seems a bit of a no-no for starters, plus no cool air can get to the graphics card, another no-no for an 8800GTS. I can also see no benefits of having reverse air flow to be honest, and if anything it would be noisier having output at the front as air being pushed out seems to make more noise than air being sucked in! However I guess it would mean air is being pushed out into the room as opposed to towards the wall, where noise might rebound of the wall and the heat gathers.

I think the BTX format is probably the best mainstream air flow and cooling solution I've seen for efficiency and noise - my mates D*ll worked pretty well in that regards, though it only had an ATI X1300 in it.

The Antec 900's OTT approach seems to work too, though obviously it's a dust magnet!

I think probably the best thing I can do is only OC when I want to play games or do some video processing etc, and run at stock all other times. I may underclock my 8800GTS when not gaming, though I don't know if that would make much difference to heat, power consumption and noise.

 

[WJA96]

I think you're putting up psychological barriers to what you know deep inside to be true. Antec aren't actually the best anymore. The PC-A05 may look wrong, but with the Tagan straight-through PSU, it works a treat. I had big issues using it with Corsair PSUs where the 120mm fan did terrible things to the airflow, but the Tagans seem perfect for the job. Because, in my suggested configuration, the PSU is drawing air in from outside the case, it runs massively cooler than normal, and it creates a little column of air that circulates into the top of the case. and pushes the hot air around the graphics card about a bit. In my Silent Systems I use passive graphics cards - usually Gigabyte or ASUS 7600GTs and despite having no fans they run fine in the PA-A05. I would need to check, but I think the NVidia fan-cooler extracts air from the case, and the ATI powered cooler sucks it in. These small differences add up.

As for reverse airflow, why not? I'm feeding the hottest components - the PSU and the CPU, the coolest air. HDD are designed to run at 60C or so, so no issue there, and I bet that even in your existing fan heater you never hear the graphics card cooler spinning at all after start-up?