Are chiropractors quacks?

jsmoke said:
Are chiropractors quacks?
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Yes. The entire system is based on nonsense, and has never been scientifically proven. It's just as credible as homeopathy, which is also a scam.

Incidentally, I have never encountered a chiro who was pro-vaccine. In my experience they are invariably opposed to vaccination, and other forms of science based medicine. You can virtually guarantee that they'll end up trying to push some other kind of woo to boost the profits of their practice.
 
dowie said:
Should throw in the "creepy Chiropractor" advert that went viral... AFAIK in the USA they actually get some sort of "doctorate" degree, in the UK they don't but seem to adopt "Dr" as a courtesy title anyway.:

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Today's dose of WTF complete!

To answer the original question - yes they're quacks in the same way that homeopaths are.
 
RxR said:
What do you think champion weightlifters (eg. powerlifting champions) in Oz do when they put their back-bone out and need it fixed quickly and efficiently? ie. In 30 minutes or less.
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So basically you're back with some anecdote again... I'm not sure athlete or celebrity endorsement is necessarily an indicator of much - remember the power balance bracelet from a few years ago - pro athletes around the world got suckered into buying that one. Funnily enough you'll note there is a Melbourne Chiropractor jumping on board and giving it his endorsement - its literally just a bracelet with a hologram on FFS :D


Skip to 1:55 to see the Chiro/"Dr" endorsing a plastic bracelet with a hologram on it.... these are the sort of people that get entrusted with cracking your spine and spotting imaginary stuff on x-rays:
 
For those who care more about the facts from research, here's a workforce review of the chiropractic industry in Australia published in BMC (BioMedCentral). Note, most have a bachelor degree or higher, and 2.1million visits a year:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5217252/#__ffn_sectitle

e: correction: 21.3 million visits a year.

e2: have a look at the Aussie page of Bupa -'do you see them being referred to as quacks there along with dentists and physios etc?

https://www.bupa.com.au/health-insurance/members-first


In that study, 55% of chiropractic referrals are from doctors (GP's), 30% from physiotherapists and 38% from podiatrists.
 
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Those who care about facts might note the guardian article written by Singh earlier - though if you want to throw in papers then how about this, by the co-author of Singh's book and the UK's only professor of complimentary medicine (before he lost the post after Prince Charles got involved - Charlie doesn't like people criticising homeopathy)

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20642715

OBJECTIVE:
The aim of this study was to summarise all cases in which chiropractic spinal manipulation was followed by death.

DESIGN:
This study is a systematic review of case reports.

METHODS:
Literature searches in four electronic databases with no restrictions of time or language.

MAIN OUTCOME MEASURE:
Death.

RESULTS:
Twenty six fatalities were published in the medical literature and many more might have remained unpublished. The alleged pathology usually was a vascular accident involving the dissection of a vertebral artery.

CONCLUSION:
Numerous deaths have occurred after chiropractic manipulations. The risks of this treatment by far outweigh its benefit.
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Basically very little benefit to it, the benefit you might get outweighed by a risk of injury/death and you might as well go see a Physio...

I get that people have been convinced/gaslighted by a Chiro or are apparently oblivious to the placebo effect or have perhaps invested time/money in seeing one but it is just BS...
 
The one I visited with my daughter used an incredibly hilarious clicking device that I think someone had knocked up in a garage. I'm sure some of them have some real knowledge but they don't help themselves.


I'd add that the volume of users has little bearing on the quality or authenticity of the product - Google sales counts of Twilight, for instance.
 
Oh Jesus i hate quacks.

Sweden has a huge interest in health and well being and at market days or events there are rows and rows of scam artists selling magnetic healing bracelets, magic pressure beads, herbal remedies and every kind of BS cure and wellness potion from the forest. My mother in law, a septic herself, spends hours talking to them and asking them to prove their magic powers, but thats gotten infuriating in itself. Just smile and say no......

Shes also a qualified physio therapist, and a good one but an annoying one. :/ another story.
 
suenstar said:
As long as you're seeing one with proper medical qualifications, you should be in good hands.
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In here lies the problem. They don't require any qualifications and are unregulated unlike doctors and physios. Take your chances. I'm sure there are good ones but I would be extremely cautious. Any one off the street can claim to be a chiropractor.
 
"Registration as a chiropractor in Australia requires completion of an accredited chiropractic program which is provided by public universities in Victoria, New South Wales, West Australia and Queensland".

It is a national government-regulated (Australian Health Practitioner Regulation Agency) health *profession* in Australia. Youtube self-tauts need not apply.

Of course, the opinions of some posters in this thread have explicitly assumed they have more medical competence than the 55% of GPs who referred their clients to chiropractors. And those 21.3 million visits to chiropractors in 1 year in a country of only 20+ million first world well-educated people...ah, yeah. I smell the horsey stuff from an odd inexperienced quarter.
 
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suenstar said:
Some chiropractors are good at what they do, some are totally delusional, it all depends on where you are and which one you see... the same can be said about a lot of medical professionals.
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pretty much this.

of all the guys i've seen on youtube there is only two who are proper doctors. an asian guy who seems to make people who are hunchback and had issues their whole lives and been to 50 other chiro's but he managed to help them with time.

the other is similar but he's caucasian. both are sadly in america.

i don't think the guy who uses the ring dinger is legit (where he sticks a towel round your neck then pulls). he will do the job of a chiro but i wouldn't trust him with a serious condition. same goes for the short fat guy with the spartan beard. his videos look good but none of his patients have really serious issues. he also has copied the ring dinger but uses a black sleeve to make it look professional but i don't agree this is proper practice and everyone needs to have it done. probably doing more harm than good over time forcing patients to keep on coming back.

i used to go to one. but now I self crack. i know my posture is bad. so i crack my back using 2-3 different techniques. i sometimes also lie down flat on the floor arms by my side. then get someone to put their foot on my back in the area i know is misaligned and get get them to press in with all their weight. i also do stretching.

i should really take up yoga. i imagine that would solve most peoples issues tbh with no need for a chiro. it's all about correct posture and stretching.
 
RxR said:
"Registration as a chiropractor in Australia requires completion of an accredited chiropractic program which is provided by public universities in Victoria, New South Wales, West Australia and Queensland".

It is a national government-regulated (Australian Health Practitioner Regulation Agency) health *profession* in Australia. Youtube self-tauts need not apply.
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Universities in Australia (and the UK) also teach homeopathy courses...

You're reaching a bit... first with the anecdotes now with the "they take courses" - doesn't prevent them from being quacks.
 
The usual more practical BS tests are more simple.

Do you know what you are talking about from personal first-hand experience?

I'll answer first: yes. I used their skeletal adjustment services more than 9 times over the course of approximately 10 years.

In the scale of evidence, factual first-hand experience counts more than theory.

How many times did you use a chiropractor service to eg. reinstate the position of a partly dislocated bone?

See above answer.

Was the bone position fixed correctly each time? If not, how many times was it not out of the total number of visits?

Yes. Every time, within minutes, on each and every occasion.
 
RxR said:
In the scale of evidence, factual first-hand experience counts more than theory.
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That is hilarious - regardless it isn't just "theory" people are basing their claims on but empirical evidence (or lack thereof) rather than random anecdotes.

If you're going to give weight to anecdotal experiences then you might as well claim that there is a strong basis to believe in the powers of witch doctors, magical crystal healers, homeopaths, fortune tellers, faith healers, psychic surgeons, people who can talk to the dead etc..etc..etc.. as you'll no doubt be able to find various people who've paid for their services and have claimed to have received a benefit for them.

See the magical hologram power bracelet posted previously - the "inventor" is supposedly convinced, the Chiro is supposedly convinced by it... various users of it believe the magical hologram has some special powers too.

Just because gullible people claim something worked doesn't mean it actually worked.
 
Yes and no - most of these issues require you to correct over time by adjusting habits i.e. posture, strengthening muscles, etc. a good one will understand how the body works/should be and teach you what you need to do a bad one will slap you around for 10 minutes which might loosen you up a bit very short term but do nothing to actually help long term. Worst many of them don't know anything beyond applying textbook procedures with minimal knowledge of when they are/aren't appropriate, kind of like generic work at a car garage, and can do actual harm.
 
PermaChanged said:
Are partly dislocated bones even a thing? Subluxations normally right themselves in my first hand experience, which is far more important than any documented evidence.
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My back was in agony 2 days ago I felt it as soon as i woke up i must have slept in a way it did something to my back.

as soon as i got home from work i self adjusted. there was 3 loud cracks it was still sore for a bit after but nowhere near as bad. i haven't don't anything thereafter and i'm brand new again. had i not i'd still have a sore back.

i could tell exactly where the adjustment needed to be done.

also after having a proper massage from a yoga instructor. i can now feel knots in muscles now i know what to look for. i've had hundreds of massages before but this person is in a different league. she could tell where issues were and got rid of them. it's also the only massage i felt now i've had was actually worth it. so i can now tell when i've got a knot and then i get that specific knot massaged out.

again there will be many more bad massage therapists out there than good ones. which is why i said before i've only seen 2 on youtube who i reckon are of any proper use the others are probably just pulling their customers legs and none of them really need to go see a chiro.
 
Psycho Sonny said:
My back was in agony 2 days ago I felt it as soon as i woke up i must have slept in a way it did something to my back.

as soon as i got home from work i self adjusted. there was 3 loud cracks it was still sore for a bit after but nowhere near as bad. i haven't don't anything thereafter and i'm brand new again. had i not i'd still have a sore back.

i could tell exactly where the adjustment needed to be done.

also after having a proper massage from a yoga instructor. i can now feel knots in muscles now i know what to look for. i've had hundreds of massages before but this person is in a different league. she could tell where issues were and got rid of them. it's also the only massage i felt now i've had was actually worth it. so i can now tell when i've got a knot and then i get that specific knot massaged out.

again there will be many more bad massage therapists out there than good ones. which is why i said before i've only seen 2 on youtube who i reckon are of any proper use the others are probably just pulling their customers legs and none of them really need to go see a chiro.
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Not pointing at you just hooking onto your post but unless you (in general) understand the mechanics of what is going on self-adjusting can do more harm than good even when it might give relief, lessened a bit if you can read your own body but a lot of people aren't that in tune. Same with poor chiros who just proscribe a generic treatment in response to a symptom rather than try and understand what mechanically is going on, why and what the long term outcome would be of not treating it and the various approaches to treating it.
 
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