Ambulance chasing party wall surveyors?

Scam

Scam

Scam

Soldato
Joined
20 Oct 2002
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19,653
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London
Anyone heard of this? Our architect submitted our plans to the council's portal a week or so ago. We'd checked with him that no signs would go up on the street etc. (they wouldn't because it's all permitted development) as although we've been completely open with our neighbours about doing the work and giving them rough timeframes, we haven't gone round with the bottle of wine etc. and got into the details about the party wall agreement/plans with them yet. Our builder has pencilled us for April start, so plenty of time still.

Anyhoo, yesterday our neighbours on one side messaged us to say they've received two letters from party wall surveyors (we don't have one yet!), asking which one we're going with and which one they should sign and return. Obviously cue panic stations, we went round and had a chat and it turns out these companies trawl the planning portals and mailshot the neighbours either side of a property that has recently submitted plans! Wut! :mad:

Anyone heard of this? We haven't managed to chat with the guy the other side but I'm assuming he's received the same. He rents, so hopefully he hasn't passed it onto his landlord yet (doesn't sound like it). The letters are awful, banging on about protecting your property, any damage etc. and making sure your neighbour doing the work is liable. How totally devious! Thankfully we had already spoken to the neighbours but imagine if you hadn't had that conversation yet and this was the way they found out you were planning on doing major building works? lol.. And what happens if you neighbour signs up? The person doing the work would be liable to pay these scummy companies wouldn't they?

/rant
 
Its pretty endemic in the industry to be honest. Many companies compile lists of applications, scale of projects, agent details etc and then sell it as a subscription service. As an Architect/Agent i'm constantly bombarded with product manufacturers reps trying to introduce their products into the schemes we have ongoing.
 
I imagined that'd be the case. I guess the plans have to be publicly available so there's always going to be bottom-feeders trying it on. Just a nasty little surprise. The agent who manages the other side has already let the landlord know we want to do work. So much for treading carefully and keeping everyone sweet as we go. Oh well, he owns quite a few houses locally so I'm sure he's not bothered. Just want to make sure we're only paying for one party wall surveyor; if he wants to use his own hopefully we can just use the same person for both sides? Any risk to that?
 
always been like it i remember 30 years ago having to submit plans for a extension and garage to be built , we had 5 builders ring up to quote within a few hours of the submission. was silly nowadays you cant get one for love nor money(well we cant :))
 
Scam said:
I imagined that'd be the case. I guess the plans have to be publicly available so there's always going to be bottom-feeders trying it on. Just a nasty little surprise. The agent who manages the other side has already let the landlord know we want to do work. So much for treading carefully and keeping everyone sweet as we go. Oh well, he owns quite a few houses locally so I'm sure he's not bothered. Just want to make sure we're only paying for one party wall surveyor; if he wants to use his own hopefully we can just use the same person for both sides? Any risk to that?
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Honestly, and I know it's difficult as YOU are the person doing the works (i.e. you need to convince your neighbours) - but I recently insisted my neighbours get a professional party wall surveyor in, and it is absolute garbage. I apologised I asked them do it.

It becomes like that spiderman meme where everyone points at everyone else. So anything tricky is deferred to building control... or regs... or planning approval. In the end it said nothing meaningful, all in legal jargon, with some pictures of my house saying it was in good condition.

You can print your own letter and get them to sign it.
 
Had similar relating to possible impact on my property years ago when next door was doing a big extension - 3 sides of the house ! Had the ambulance chasers done even the slightest research on google maps or streetview they would have seen we are 50 metres apart as there's an open bit of land between the two houses. I'm no civil engineer, but reckoned I could live without a survey.
 
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arknor said:
sounds like good business sense
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Well yeah because if your neighbor is annoying (like complain about your 7am Sainsbury's deliveries) you are entitled to make the OP pay two surveyors out of fun :D
 
dLockers said:
Well yeah because if your neighbor is annoying (like complain about your 7am Sainsbury's deliveries) you are entitled to make the OP pay two surveyors out of fun :D
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if it were the OPs neighbours getting planning permission and the OP getting these letters he would probably be glad.

if your doing building work maybe it would be "nice" to inform your neighbours in the first place rather than blind side them like this
 
peterwalkley said:
Had similar relating to possible impact on my property years ago when next door was doing a big extension - 3 sides of the house ! Had the ambulance chasers done even the slightest research on google maps or streetview they have seen we are 50 metres apart as there's an open bit of land between the two houses. I'm no civil engineer, but reckoned I could live without a survey.
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In that instance if there's no basement or the like it's highly unlikely you'd need one. But new sizeable exacavations can have a surprising zone of influence, particularly if done badly.
 
It's best to see party wall awards as a tool for the other side to review your designs and confirm they haven't been produced by Muppets. They can't stop you doing the work but they can request design improvements that would better protect the wall. The act is intended to preserve the integrity of shared structures for mutual benefit of both sides. It can then incorporate an approved construction sequence/methodology where appropriate to help try and avoid cowboy builders going rogue. It's not a perfect tool but it's better than nothing.
 
arknor said:
if your doing building work maybe it would be "nice" to inform your neighbours in the first place rather than blind side them like this
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Hey bud! Many thanks for joining in this internet discussion! May I point you to this post which includes a spot of light reading before you take fat thumb to keyboard? All relevant info is included therein. Awesome job, all the best; https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/posts/35394879

ik9000 said:
not a perfect tool but it's better than nothing.
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No issue with the process. My issue is purely with the scalpers trying it on and muddying said process. Fortunately we get in fine with our neighbours so far but stuff like this is most unhelpful.

PS: Having had to run round there yesterday to make sure they didn't sign anything, said neighbour phoned me this morning to say they tested positive for COVID. Argh.. we were round there for about 45mins in the end, looking at their loft and comparing notes. Negative test for us today, wish us luck for tomorrow :(
 
Well, this approach is news to me as an engineer who regularly deals with PWS, but it is clever business i suppose. The neighbour gets protected in theory at no cost to them (whether or not it's necessary) and you foot the bill.
 
Scam said:
Anyone heard of this? Our architect submitted our plans to the council's portal a week or so ago. We'd checked with him that no signs would go up on the street etc. (they wouldn't because it's all permitted development) as although we've been completely open with our neighbours about doing the work and giving them rough timeframes, we haven't gone round with the bottle of wine etc. and got into the details about the party wall agreement/plans with them yet. Our builder has pencilled us for April start, so plenty of time still.

Anyhoo, yesterday our neighbours on one side messaged us to say they've received two letters from party wall surveyors (we don't have one yet!), asking which one we're going with and which one they should sign and return. Obviously cue panic stations, we went round and had a chat and it turns out these companies trawl the planning portals and mailshot the neighbours either side of a property that has recently submitted plans! Wut! :mad:

Anyone heard of this? We haven't managed to chat with the guy the other side but I'm assuming he's received the same. He rents, so hopefully he hasn't passed it onto his landlord yet (doesn't sound like it). The letters are awful, banging on about protecting your property, any damage etc. and making sure your neighbour doing the work is liable. How totally devious! Thankfully we had already spoken to the neighbours but imagine if you hadn't had that conversation yet and this was the way they found out you were planning on doing major building works? lol.. And what happens if you neighbour signs up? The person doing the work would be liable to pay these scummy companies wouldn't they?

/rant
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Yes, I got the same letters as your neighbours about five years ago when my neighbour wanted to build an extension. It's just something they do to drum up business, probably because people don't know about party wall agreements and their rights.
 
The nice thing about pw act is it protects the interests of both sides. It's a surprisingly well founded bit of legislation and very fair. Which is why the government overruled it with new and imo (and more importantly the opinion of lawyers whose articles I read) grossly unfair legislation for HS2 biased horribly against landowners bounding the new train line to the point where HS2 can pretty much do what they like even under the adjoining owners land and to their future detriment in terms of their ability to then dig down and alter construction in their own piedaterre. IIRC the adjoining owner to HS2 could be charged for any delays arising due to problems encountered with their pre-existing structures/land and if they dared to even try challenge HS2 proposals in any way. It's worth a read if I can find the links.

Shocking, to the point of needing an inquiry as to why this was allowed to be passed. Coupled with the land grabs, debatable value assigned to it, and the woeful reasons for HS2 in the first place if I got in to government I'd be doing a full review of just who is benefiting from these decisions and how the ones made came to be. It stinks something rotten.
 
DB_SamX said:
Well, this approach is news to me as an engineer who regularly deals with PWS, but it is clever business i suppose. The neighbour gets protected in theory at no cost to them (whether or not it's necessary) and you foot the bill.
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Are the rates charged by PW surveyors limited/protected at all? What's to stop said scam artist getting a doddery old neighbour to sign up, then have us charged £10k or something daft? Just curious. We're about to reach out to our recommended surveyor and no idea what the charges are and what is usual.

ik9000 said:
I'd be doing a full review of just who is benefiting from these decisions and how the ones made came to be. It stinks something rotten.
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Ah HS2. Yep 100% agree. All that money just to get to Birmingham 20mins faster. Absolute joke. Crossrail on the other hand should now be opening by June with only one station left to handover to TFL apparently. We're a 12min walk from an upgraded station and my office is about a 2min walk in central. My commute (however often we end up doing it) will be about 35mins door to door which is pretty awesome for zone 3 to 1.
 
Scam said:
Are the rates charged by PW surveyors limited/protected at all? What's to stop said scam artist getting a doddery old neighbour to sign up, then have us charged £10k or something daft? Just curious. We're about to reach out to our recommended surveyor and no idea what the charges are and what is usual.
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Yes. You can go to arbitration with a 3rd independent surveyor where an agreement can't be reached or where one party is felt to be taking the pee. You also then have recourse in the courts if you still feel aggrieved but obviously the stakes are higher and costs involved mount up. You would need to show you'd exhausted reasonable stages before then ie 3rd surveyor stage.
Scam said:
Ah HS2. Yep 100% agree. All that money just to get to Birmingham 20mins faster. Absolute joke. Crossrail on the other hand should now be opening by June with only one station left to handover to TFL apparently. We're a 12min walk from an upgraded station and my office is about a 2min walk in central. My commute (however often we end up doing it) will be about 35mins door to door which is pretty awesome for zone 3 to 1.
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that does sound pretty good. I used to live in zone 1 and it took me that long to get to work in z1 center back then.
 
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