advanced driving / skills

ShiWarrior

ShiWarrior

ShiWarrior

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Hi all

I asked if i could get some extra skills/advanced driving for my Xmas present which i did , i.e. parents are going to pay for it , what ever i decide to choose.

now, im not sure where to go from me and need advice

I like to be a better driver and to learn in "what if" situations (mostly in winter , so ice/snow etc) but also dry/wet summer conditions too

im just entirely sure what i want and I require some advice
thanks
 
From what I've seen of advanced driving, most of that appears to the "mindset", i.e. understanding what to look for, how to drive more safely, make progress etc, to the point where in theory it should mitigate against the requirement of skills.

I'd see skills as instinctively being able to react to conditions. For that, might be worth conducting a track learning course, skid pan course or similar.

Don't get me wrong, both are useful (IMO), but they're typically done in different ways.
 
I've done a skid control course and felt like i learnt a lot from that. I was lucky in mine was free through work but having been on it i'd have happily paid for it myself with how good it was.

It was one of those cars with the outrigger wheels so they can simulate loss of grip on either the front or back, mine was at my local racing circuit.
 
Good road driving is all about concentration, observation and driving to allow for the bad actions of others. Many modern motorists get that massively wrong, worse they will even go out of their way to make your life hard because they have a camera, are convinced they know best when often they are really wrong and can 'learn you' on YouTube because even though you crashed they have it all on video as 'evidence'. Cyclists who get run over because they are in the right, not ride to allow for the idiot in the car is an example, people who close gaps because 'how dare you' try to push on from a slip road is another. Many modern road users seem to me to be more interested in being right than being alive and I just can't grasp that mindset.

If you want to be a better road driver then an Advanced Driving Test is a good thing as it will bring observation and defensive driving to the fore and that is good, if you heed the advice of course. However, if you want to learn about car control at the extremes then I'd seek out some of the track courses that will teach you skid control, weight transfer, balance and the fun stuff. Thing is most of that stuff isn't truly relevant outside extreme circumstances if you are follow the ADI bibles and drive to your environment but it's fun to learn all about proper car control.

All of that is irrelevant however without concentration, observation and driving to allow for the other idiots and most of us don't do that often because of 'life'. Not an excuse, just a fact.
 
ShiWarrior said:
Hi all

I asked if i could get some extra skills/advanced driving for my Xmas present which i did , i.e. parents are going to pay for it , what ever i decide to choose.

now, im not sure where to go from me and need advice

I like to be a better driver and to learn in "what if" situations (mostly in winter , so ice/snow etc) but also dry/wet summer conditions too

im just entirely sure what i want and I require some advice
thanks
Click to expand...


Skidpan day.

http://www.silverstone.co.uk/experiences/driving-experiences/skid-control-2/

Honestly one of the best motoring related things I've ever done (I did mine at Zandvoort in Holland however).

You can also do something like an IAM Roadsmart course

https://www.iamroadsmart.com/courses

There's also the ROSPA course which is pricey but worth it.

https://www.rospa.com/safety-training/on-road/advanced/driving-course/


If you drive a lot for work it might be worth approaching your employer and asking if they're interested, many will due to the reduced insurance premiums.
 
Housey said:
Good road driving is all about concentration, observation and driving to allow for the bad actions of others. Many modern motorists get that massively wrong, worse they will even go out of their way to make your life hard because they have a camera, are convinced they know best when often they are really wrong and can 'learn you' on YouTube because even though you crashed they have it all on video as 'evidence'. Cyclists who get run over because they are in the right, not ride to allow for the idiot in the car is an example, people who close gaps because 'how dare you' try to push on from a slip road is another. Many modern road users seem to me to be more interested in being right than being alive and I just can't grasp that mindset.

If you want to be a better road driver then an Advanced Driving Test is a good thing as it will bring observation and defensive driving to the fore and that is good, if you heed the advice of course. However, if you want to learn about car control at the extremes then I'd seek out some of the track courses that will teach you skid control, weight transfer, balance and the fun stuff. Thing is most of that stuff isn't truly relevant outside extreme circumstances if you are follow the ADI bibles and drive to your environment but it's fun to learn all about proper car control.

All of that is irrelevant however without concentration, observation and driving to allow for the other idiots and most of us don't do that often because of 'life'. Not an excuse, just a fact.
Click to expand...

Very well put indeed. Good driving on the road is 99% about what's between your ears rather than skid control skillz. Making decisions based on observation and clear thought and not decisions driven by emotions such as starting to drive faster or more aggressively just because of the perceived driving behaviour of another car (who may have only done something you have done yourself in the past anyway, it just doesn't count when you do it)...

I did a short RoSPA defensive driving course about 10 years ago. It was only about 90mins long but I found it very helpful (even as an experienced driver). Certainly more helpful than the intense 4 hours of snow & ice driving I did in the north of finland in a heaving modded Imprezza (for the hell if it).
 
If you want a day where you get to try out and learn a lot in your own car, look up one of the CATDT group days.
 
Is there a course that can teach you how to drive like they do in the movies ?

You know the type of thing, leaping 50 feet over a debris field of burning cars and bodies, driving on two wheels to enable you to get down a
6 foot wide alley to escape them Ukrainian thugs who are intent on killing you, negotiating a 100 mph dash through downtown Washington DC
IN THE WRONG DIRECTION with your one uninjured arm while phoning your girlfriend as she is in imminent danger of abduction by rival
Latvian thugs..............[ that's quite enough of that ]
 
Track day in your own car could well teach you more about your cars limits and more importantly your own than ones of these advanced driving courses.
Assuming your already a competent driver and not like 98% of the rest of road users who dont seem to have any brains at all.
 
sovietspybob said:
I've done a skid control course and felt like i learnt a lot from that. I was lucky in mine was free through work but having been on it i'd have happily paid for it myself with how good it was.

It was one of those cars with the outrigger wheels so they can simulate loss of grip on either the front or back, mine was at my local racing circuit.
Click to expand...
I've done one of these too, at Silverstone and I agree - highly recommended. I learned a lot.
 
Skid pan day is well worth it, especially if you get the chance to drive something unusual to you such as an HGV!

I went on such a course through work a few years back and during the “classroom chat” afterwards it was the group of company car drivers who were with us that said they’d learned more from the truck experience than the cars they had driven (which was a mix of fwd, rwd, 4x4 normal and high performance)

Saved a jack knife situation a few weeks later using what I’d been shown on the day.

I imagine such a variety of vehicles on a full days course would be expensive but well worth it IMO!
 
Diddums said:
I tried to find REG LOCAL's posts on Pistonheads but I think they may have been deleted since he wrote his book. He's an ex police instructor, training cops in pursuit, VIP protection, etc. The guy's a bit of a legend in the advanced driving circles, might be worth giving his book a read.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Advanced-Performance-Driving-Reg-Local/dp/150853540X
Click to expand...

That book is definitely worth a read, and his YouTube video series in extremely informative.

My dad taught Reg, and often said he was one of his best students.
 
wouldn't an IAM/Rospa course be better in the long run (but possibly less instant fun) than a skid-pan course, as it's valid for all driving conditions at all times? (and hopefully reduces the chances of needing the skid-pan skills).

I did a skid-pan course years ago, no idea how long, but it was in an x1/9 that died in ~97, so I'm guessing mid 90s. It was ace and a lot of fun. I've certainly used those skills/knowledge since, but only a few times in proper "oh ****" moments.

Late 90s I did IAM and that course has permanently changed my driving and thus I feel is more "value for money" as a tool to improve general driving skill (I've not done Rospa, but I'm assuming the outcome to be the same). I'm not saying it wasn't fun, as I had an ex police driver who occasionally wanted me to push the car on coutry roads and commented that if the car we were in was rwd we could get the back out a little - so it wasn't a boring hand-shuffle around the steering wheel course at all.

At the end of the day though - no matter how skilled you are, you can't control the actions of other people. There seem to be more and more "me first, screw you" drivers on the road, so any course that helps to observe and predict what other people are potentially likely to do is surely beneficial?

I guess it depends what you're after... a quick thrill ride (skid-pan, or track-day tuition) or a slower-burner that might teach more.
 
Maybe not a totally serious suggestion, but...

One of the best things I have done for my driving was learn to ride a motorcycle. It teaches you the "always on" 100% concentration, improves your prediction of other peoples antics, gets you looking and an evaluating road and weather conditions automatically etc.

As an IAM member, I will also say this - possibly attend a few meetings before comitting. They have a certain "style" that doesn't agree with everyone's idea of proper/safe/reasonable driving. In my journey to become a volunteer blood biker, I have found the ROSPA "style" of teaching/control/road manners better fits my personal driving style and opinions.
 
Nomisf said:
Maybe not a totally serious suggestion, but...

One of the best things I have done for my driving was learn to ride a motorcycle. It teaches you the "always on" 100% concentration, improves your prediction of other peoples antics, gets you looking and an evaluating road and weather conditions automatically etc.

As an IAM member, I will also say this - possibly attend a few meetings before comitting. They have a certain "style" that doesn't agree with everyone's idea of proper/safe/reasonable driving. In my journey to become a volunteer blood biker, I have found the ROSPA "style" of teaching/control/road manners better fits my personal driving style and opinions.
Click to expand...

I have always said the same. I think new drivers should do 6 months on a moped before starting to drive to learn the road craft and hazard perception.
 
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