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AMD Phenom II 955 - bottleneck?

well ive always been quite happy to generally be about a year or so behind in hardware specs, so if bulldozer is the **** right now then its probably what i'll buy later next year :) unless i get to doing that intel switch over of course ;)

heheh ive always liked ati graphics more in general, but i dont think its based on a great deal of knowledge or anything. just tend to find them better than their nvidia price equivelant, well thats based more on past experiences, not sure about currently. but my experience of sli has been better than crossfire and there a hell of a lot of people (including me lol) maoning about crossfire issues and performance in battlefield 3 right now, but i dont hear many people moaning about sli in bf3. maybe its just what ive read!

Far from it lol, Bulldozer's exactly what a bulldozer is, slow. :p
 
Well, AMD don't have any official support for AM3, so officially, your board has no upgrade path.

While Bulldozer in its current form does work on your board, who knows if Piledriver will.
I've used Crossfire and SLI, but I'm biased when it comes to AMD GPU's :p, so I'd say Crossfire ***.



Indeed, I said Bulldozer's supposed to work with the latest BIOS. But who'd buy Bulldozer? It replaces the Phenom II X4 and X6 CPU's at the same price point, but is worse, there's no evading that.

Please go away Martini, Bulldozer is very rarely worse, apart from Superpi, and a bunch of crap, its mostly the same speed, it generally offers the same performance in games as a x4, an x6, or a SB, or a Q6600 for that matter(overclocked Q6600 that is :p ).

Its almost twice as fast as a x6 in photoshop, faster in encoding, MUCH faster in winrar/7zip/par 2.

There's no evading its worse, when sometimes its 100% faster, there is NO situation the x6 is 100% faster than a bulldozer, and a couple that Bulldozer is around 100% faster than an x6, but there is no evading its worse?

Bulldozer is almost exactly where anyone with half a brain thought it would be, a little worse, the ONLY problem Bulldozer has is for a 315mm2 chip and 2billion transistors, its horrible, theres also likely some performance there simply from power settings.

My now 2500k(get over it I've said for an entire year I'd go 2500k if Bulldozer didn't suit ME in the situations I use and mostly due to power--- I live in a room that could loosely be described as a radiator), at 4.4Ghz(stock cooler for now) gains around 25% performance simply changing the bios power throttling from 95W to 120W. Power wise, again the only limit is the actual power, power efficiency is pretty awesome, Sandybridge its actually around 1.1-1.2billion transistors, 95W, Bulldozer 2billion transistors, 90-95% more transistors, 125W. Its only overclocked power I'm interested in anyway and that's where my room simply can't cope with it.


Anyway, on thread topic, you aren't bottlenecked by that chip and you won't be if you go crossfire.

Take Game A , with a single card you're not bottlenecked, you're running at 100fps already, a second card allows you to run at 180fps in which case you will be cpu limited and might only reach 120-150fps with that CPU, but in reality you'd use MSAA, top settings, and maybe buy a new screen and end up using a higher resolution, or run eyefinity in that game and then even with xfire, you're back down to 100fps, which your CPU is more than capable of.

Game B is crazy slow performance, you're getting 30fps at top settings but with one card you drop settings down to just under top settings to get 60fps. Then you throw in a second card, you don't want 100fps with not top settings, so you end up running top settings but now at 60fps, perfectly smooth and not cpu limited.

Game C, you get silly good performance on a single card, you're getting 100fps maxed out at 4k resolution, its not hard to run, you throw in a second card and you will be cpu limited, hell you might be cpu limited with a single card........ who cares. You still have awesome performance, sometimes games don't need xfire, I mean, take every game you've bought in the past 20 years, 95% of them are so old, slow and basic that xfire just isn't required. Some new games will also run great, thats life, you're still not losing anything not having an awesome CPU.

You use xfire to increase performance where its not good enough, or enable higher settings, or go to a new resolution, none of which will be cpu limited situations.

The only time a cpu is going to bottleneck you with or without xfire, is if you are one of those who love bigger jumps in quake 3 type games and want 250fps.

I'd probably try a slightly higher overclock, to help out with the few games that are more cpu limited, but there aren't many of them.
 
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Please go away Martini, Bulldozer is very rarely worse, apart from Superpi, and a bunch of crap, its mostly the same speed, it generally offers the same performance in games as a x4, an x6, or a SB, or a Q6600 for that matter(overclocked Q6600 that is :p ).

Its almost twice as fast as a x6 in photoshop, faster in encoding, MUCH faster in winrar/7zip/par 2.

There's no evading its worse, when sometimes its 100% faster, there is NO situation the x6 is 100% faster than a bulldozer, and a couple that Bulldozer is around 100% faster than an x6, but there is no evading its worse?

Bulldozer is almost exactly where anyone with half a brain thought it would be, a little worse, the ONLY problem Bulldozer has is for a 315mm2 chip and 2billion transistors, its horrible, theres also likely some performance there simply from power settings.

My now 2500k(get over it I've said for an entire year I'd go 2500k if Bulldozer didn't suit ME in the situations I use and mostly due to power--- I live in a room that could loosely be described as a radiator), at 4.4Ghz(stock cooler for now) gains around 25% performance simply changing the bios power throttling from 95W to 120W. Power wise, again the only limit is the actual power, power efficiency is pretty awesome, Sandybridge its actually around 1.1-1.2billion transistors, 95W, Bulldozer 2billion transistors, 90-95% more transistors, 125W. Its only overclocked power I'm interested in anyway and that's where my room simply can't cope with it.


Anyway, on thread topic, you aren't bottlenecked by that chip and you won't be if you go crossfire.

Take Game A , with a single card you're not bottlenecked, you're running at 100fps already, a second card allows you to run at 180fps in which case you will be cpu limited and might only reach 120-150fps with that CPU, but in reality you'd use MSAA, top settings, and maybe buy a new screen and end up using a higher resolution, or run eyefinity in that game and then even with xfire, you're back down to 100fps, which your CPU is more than capable of.

Game B is crazy slow performance, you're getting 30fps at top settings but with one card you drop settings down to just under top settings to get 60fps. Then you throw in a second card, you don't want 100fps with not top settings, so you end up running top settings but now at 60fps, perfectly smooth and not cpu limited.

Game C, you get silly good performance on a single card, you're getting 100fps maxed out at 4k resolution, its not hard to run, you throw in a second card and you will be cpu limited, hell you might be cpu limited with a single card........ who cares. You still have awesome performance, sometimes games don't need xfire, I mean, take every game you've bought in the past 20 years, 95% of them are so old, slow and basic that xfire just isn't required. Some new games will also run great, thats life, you're still not losing anything not having an awesome CPU.

You use xfire to increase performance where its not good enough, or enable higher settings, or go to a new resolution, none of which will be cpu limited situations.

The only time a cpu is going to bottleneck you with or without xfire, is if you are one of those who love bigger jumps in quake 3 type games and want 250fps.

I'd probably try a slightly higher overclock, to help out with the few games that are more cpu limited, but there aren't many of them.

Thanks for the insight! I've never been quite sure exactly how the link between cpu and gpu works in terms of fps in games. I thought they worked independently of eachother, though they both have roles to play in game performance. but i hear talk of cpu's "feeding" gpu's.

i run a 1080p monitor which i dont feel like upgrading anytime soon. i always run vsync when i can get quite easily get 50-60fps+ average also. so framerates above 60fps really dont bother me, im not aiming for that as 60fps looks plenty smooth to me!

i think with my cpu and a 6950 i should be able to play bf3 on high (maybe some ultra settings to) at native res in 64 player servers pretty smoothly. crossfire is just a thought for next year if some pretty juicy games come out and my gpu struggles a little. im well into the cpu overclock idea now though, its exciting :) im gonna save for a good cooler n then go for it! thanks mate :)
 
ET900,look at actual benchmarks etc.
Ask people who have gone from an AMD CPU to the 2500k/2600k/2700k with Crossfire and their opinions.
If the Phenom II chips are getting less FPS in games, it's a bottleneck, but as I said earlier, that isn't always a bad thing.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4310/amd-phenom-ii-x4-980-black-edition-review/7

That's the Phenom II 980 review, and if you see, it does come behind the Intel CPU's, but in all situations, although it's an obvious bottleneck it's not going to affect you as the FPS is already quite high.
 
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ET900,look at actual benchmarks etc.
Ask people who have gone from an AMD CPU to the 2500k/2600k/2700k with Crossfire and their opinions.
If the Phenom II chips are getting less FPS in games, it's a bottleneck, but as I said earlier, that isn't always a bad thing.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4310/amd-phenom-ii-x4-980-black-edition-review/7

That's the Phenom II 980 review, and if you see, it does come behind the Intel CPU's, but in all 3 situations, although it's an obvious bottleneck it's not going to affect you as the FPS is already quite high.

yeh i get what you're saying. as long as im getting desirable framerates i dont need to bother about upgrading the cpu basically. but when i feel like i should be getting better framerates with my gpu then i should look into upgrading my cpu right?

the thing that i didn't quite get was how the cpu directly affects the gpu performance, though i know it does. i'll read all that page you linked though and have a look about. im sure there'll be a good explanation of it somewhere :)
 
Like I said earlier on, stick with what you've got.

I wouldn't quite know how to explain it to you about how the CPU and the GPU work, so I won't try :p.
 
Sorry to hijack the thread but my 955 is C3 revision so wt is the best overclock can it get up to?? and is it worth it for e.g gaming?

cheers
 
Sorry to hijack the thread but my 955 is C3 revision so wt is the best overclock can it get up to?? and is it worth it for e.g gaming?

cheers

C3 revision averagely clock a bit higher than the C2's.
But I can't just look at the C3 tag and go "4GHZ"

I've had 2 C3 965's, one got 3.9GHZ, one got 4GHZ.
I've clocked C3 555 x2's to 4-2 and 4.3.

You'd have to try clocking it and see what you get.
I would consider it worth it yes.
 
C3 revision averagely clock a bit higher than the C2's.
But I can't just look at the C3 tag and go "4GHZ"

I've had 2 C3 965's, one got 3.9GHZ, one got 4GHZ.
I've clocked C3 555 x2's to 4-2 and 4.3.

You'd have to try clocking it and see what you get.
I would consider it worth it yes.

Great thx mate, I'll have a go at it.
 
hey guys ive been messing with overclocking. discovered that my 955 can run at 3.6ghz stable with stock voltage! bus speed is at 225 and ht link is at 2031, didnt change the multiplier speed at all. i cant go any higher til i get a better cooler though cos of the temps. just thought it might be useful for those of you with the same cpu :)
 
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