AMD to unveil Zen 4 CPUs at CES 2022

[Curlyriff]

Fastest theoretical performance at 720p means that the cpu will last you longer, since it wont be bottlenecking your future graphics card at the resolution you are currently playing at. Say 2 cpus are similar at 1440p but one 30% faster in 720p so..

That is irrelevant for me though. I will upgrade again anyways because I will do a full system update rather than CPU or GPU separate.

And honestly all this testing when it has come to 720p gaming, lets say a 9900k compared to the 3800x, the 9900k averaged about 15% faster in gaming with an RTX2080 at 1080p high settings, it still sits similar 15% faster with an RTX3080. It isn't suddenly the 3800x become more of a bottleneck between that GPU upgrade. The % change is within margin of error in real world gaming scenarios.

I have always had people say but at 720p it was X% faster but nothing has really shown any real world data for that being a huge case when it comes to upgrading the GPU two or three generations and one CPU particularly falling off a cliff worse than the other.

Meaning that if the AMD 7600x is 5% faster in gaming to the 12900k with a 6950xt then I expect it would only be around 5% faster come the 7950xt or whatever approx. Could there be a bigger difference if you kept same CPU but upgraded 3-4 generations of GPU, maybe but by then normally new DDR and PCIE options etc are about meaning a full upgrade anyways.

oh wow so close if thats the case and building new system will go AMD socket support will be longer nice option to have open wonder what can be done with PBO looking forward to seeing it played with

Indeed if it does really come to that close and within 5-10% gaming (I expect Intel to have the lead slightly) then I think AMD would be better option if you was building a new system at moment and able to drop in a Zen5 3D cache chip come Q423/Q124.

 

[Toasty]

It will be on for Intel too. And it works just as well for Intel. So 'meh'

The thing is right now Intel are talking to motherboard vendors about having ReBar on by default because their GPU's don't work properly with it off....

Anyway yes.... he acts like the sort of guy whose angry AMD are competitive, like he's yearning for the good old days of Bulldozer.

Don’t think he is anti AMD more that his goal is fastest e-sport gaming performance period regardless of anything else, power, time tuning, cooling or expense.

Raptor lake will no doubt come out ahead in gaming in that scenario as you can buy expensive top bin DDR5 and also the new £500 EKWB with a TEC for max 6 GHz boost clocks and spend a few days in the BIOS.

Then probably chuck that in the bin when vcache models beat it with a simple AIO and regular DDR5.

 

[Deluxe1]

When does the review embargo lift so we can see some third party benchmarks?

Could be wrong but I think I read it was two days before retail release.

 

[TrixP10]

Regarding Zen 4 prices. I see posts saying that Zen xyz should be lower etc. IMHO, this is AMD throwing down the gauntlet. I mean the die size of Intels's latest is huge in comparison to Zen 4. Admittedly, 5nm ain't cheap and Intel has it's own FAB's but at twice the die size can Intel compete?
Rock and hard place for Intel - declining sales and profit margin, something must give. How much will Raptor lake cost to produce and can you charge premium prices on a EOL platform unless there are substantial benefits to the user. Intel has already stated that they intend to increase prices so will there be a corresponding leap in performance because without it ?

 

[Bencher]

That is irrelevant for me though. I will upgrade again anyways because I will do a full system update rather than CPU or GPU separate.

And honestly all this testing when it has come to 720p gaming, lets say a 9900k compared to the 3800x, the 9900k averaged about 15% faster in gaming with an RTX2080 at 1080p high settings, it still sits similar 15% faster with an RTX3080. It isn't suddenly the 3800x become more of a bottleneck between that GPU upgrade. The % change is within margin of error in real world gaming scenarios.

I have always had people say but at 720p it was X% faster but nothing has really shown any real world data for that being a huge case when it comes to upgrading the GPU two or three generations and one CPU particularly falling off a cliff worse than the other.

Meaning that if the AMD 7600x is 5% faster in gaming to the 12900k with a 6950xt then I expect it would only be around 5% faster come the 7950xt or whatever approx. Could there be a bigger difference if you kept same CPU but upgraded 3-4 generations of GPU, maybe but by then normally new DDR and PCIE options etc are about meaning a full upgrade anyways.


Indeed if it does really come to that close and within 5-10% gaming (I expect Intel to have the lead slightly) then I think AMD would be better option if you was building a new system at moment and able to drop in a Zen5 3D cache chip come Q423/Q124.

Yes but now ths 9900k with a 3080 is also 15% faster on 1440p. And if its not it will be with a 4080. So if you bought the 9900k instead you would keep it longer.

If you are changing cpus for no reason basically then sure, why would you care about proper reviews?

 

[Curlyriff]

Yes but now ths 9900k with a 3080 is also 15% faster on 1440p. And if its not it will be with a 4080. So if you bought the 9900k instead you would keep it longer.

If you are changing cpus for no reason basically then sure, why would you care about proper reviews?

Right but the slower 3800x (which you might buy cause of price point) is not suddenly 35% slower with the new GPU at 1440p because it showed a massive gap at 720p for artificially creating a difference.

And it isn't for no reason. It is what performance increase is there when looking at 1440p compared to what I get now at 1440p. So what % increase in performance does the 7950x get over the 5950x in gaming at 1440p with the same GPU. I am not able to sustain 144FPS at 1440p at min with a 5950x and 6900XT but with a 7950x I could gain 15% FPS performance then that is what I would like to know. That gives me an idea on if for me the payout to return is what I am happy with.

 

[humbug]

Don’t think he is anti AMD more that his goal is fastest e-sport gaming performance period regardless of anything else, power, time tuning, cooling or expense.

Raptor lake will no doubt come out ahead in gaming in that scenario as you can buy expensive top bin DDR5 and also the new £500 EKWB with a TEC for max 6 GHz boost clocks and spend a few days in the BIOS.

Then probably chuck that in the bin when vcache models beat it with a simple AIO and regular DDR5.

No.

Before Alderlake AMD was king on E-Sports, and by a very wide margin.

These days Intel are tied with AMD in E-Sports.

He's an angry Intel fanboy.

 

[Joxeon]

Right but the slower 3800x (which you might buy cause of price point) is not suddenly 35% slower with the new GPU at 1440p because it showed a massive gap at 720p for artificially creating a difference.

And it isn't for no reason. It is what performance increase is there when looking at 1440p compared to what I get now at 1440p. So what % increase in performance does the 7950x get over the 5950x in gaming at 1440p with the same GPU. I am not able to sustain 144FPS at 1440p at min with a 5950x and 6900XT but with a 7950x I could gain 15% FPS performance then that is what I would like to know. That gives me an idea on if for me the payout to return is what I am happy with.

Buying a new CPU every year for gaming is a waste of money unless you play competitively for a living, a CPU every 3 years and a GPU every 2 is fine for 1440p+ if you want to stay top tier.

If you want to save a bit more then a GPU+CPU every 4 years is probably bang for your buck.

 

[V F]

Buying a new CPU every year for gaming is a waste of money unless you play competitively for a living, a CPU every 3 years and a GPU every 2 is fine for 1440p+ if you want to stay top tier.

If you want to save a bit more then a GPU+CPU every 4 years is probably bang for your buck.

Which is likely going to be supplied by your sponsors. If you're good. The average ones will need to pay their own way, unless they have good contacts through sponsors.

 

[Curlyriff]

Buying a new CPU every year for gaming is a waste of money unless you play competitively for a living, a CPU every 3 years and a GPU every 2 is fine for 1440p+ if you want to stay top tier.

If you want to save a bit more then a GPU+CPU every 4 years is probably bang for your buck.

Indeed it would be. But if you are buying a CPU every 3 yrs (I assume you mean 3 generations) and we are suggesting a new GPU every 2 generations then you don't need to worry about the performance difference of the CPU beyond two generations and thus the 720p is irrelevant.

With that it all depends what performance uplift you actually get at 1440p which is my point. If I get a 25% performance uplift in one CPU gen I would possibly consider that okay bang for buck. If it is only 5% then that fine and I will wait till the next gen. I wont know what that 1440p uplift is or not without that review and the 720p doesn't answer that.

 

[humbug]

Its like the VRam argument, isn't it?

You would never buy something that is 'just' enough on the day, no, not unless you were very budget constrained, you would want something that has some headroom, do i need to explain why? No, i don't, so this argument makes no ###### sense.

So the argument that you would only review something up to the point of performance on the day because that's all you need to know is Leninist tripe. Looking at you Steve Walton.

 

[Robert896r1]

No.

Before Alderlake AMD was king on E-Sports, and by a very wide margin.

These days Intel are tied with AMD in E-Sports.

He's an angry Intel fanboy.

Jufes like to tune his systems and uses them for comparison vs out of box. His personal goal and his audience goal isn’t plug n play but optimal gaming configuration. Comparing his findings vs out of box is just weird…given he’s never catered to that goal.

https://kingfaris.co.uk/blog/10900k-vs-5950x/summary As demonstrated here by a buddy, tuned 10900k was a different beast esports or not.

As usual, amd is a great plug n play, out of the box platform and that’s fine for majority of the users as demonstrated on here.

 

[cliffy]

oh wow so close if thats the case and building new system will go AMD socket support will be longer nice option to have open wonder what can be done with PBO looking forward to seeing it played with

I read that the fmax is 5850mhz for the 7950X, the fmax for the 5950x is 5050mhz in comparison, although i have seen 5100mhz from mine

 

[humbug]

Jufes like to tune his systems and uses them for comparison vs out of box. His personal goal and his audience goal isn’t plug n play but optimal gaming configuration. Comparing his findings vs out of box is just weird…given he’s never catered to that goal.

https://kingfaris.co.uk/blog/10900k-vs-5950x/summary As demonstrated here by a buddy, tuned 10900k was a different beast esports or not.

As usual, amd is a great plug n play, out of the box platform and that’s fine for majority of the users as demonstrated on here.

The only game E-Sports game that has been widely tested is CS:GO, its the only game for which he shows no data.

 

[humbug]

I'll tell you what else is interesting, several of the games he has data for he show a 15 to 20% performance gain vs the 5950X, all the ones that lost the most to the 5950X, conveniently.

Now, the thing is the 10900K can boost to 5.1Ghz on 4 cores simultaneously, to get those sort of performance boosts it would have to be boosting to around 6.1Ghz.

 

[Robert896r1]

I'll tell you what else is intresting, sevral of the games he has data for he show a 15 to 20% performance gain vs the 5950X, all the ones that lost the most to the 5950X, conveniently.

now, the thing is the 10900 can boost to 5.1Ghz on 4 cores simultaneously, to get those sort of performance boosts it would have to be boosting to around 6.1Ghz.

Always impressive how little you understand and have actual experience to draw from. But those hot takes are sure entertaining!

I mean all the information is in the data but Naaah why take a few mins to understand different architectures when you can spam forums with verbose, ‘feelings’ driven narratives instead.

 

[humbug]

Always impressive how little you understand and have actual experience to draw from. But those hot takes are sure entertaining!

I mean all the information is in the data but Naaah why take a few mins to understand different architectures when you can spam forums with verbose, ‘feelings’ driven narratives instead.

Care to add any actual data to that? Data has no feelings.

 

[Robert896r1]

Care to add any actual data to that? Data has no feelings.

Not doing your homework for you. Start reading more and typing less. It’s all there. If you need to understand more, anandtech does great architecture breakdowns. Cross refence them to understand the “why” better.

 

[humbug]

okay...

 

[SupraWez]

I’ll wait for independent reviews but looks like Intel are in for another kicking