Amplifier for use with Sky

manisinghb · 5 Jul 2011 at 21:16

Hi guys, firstly apologies if this is the wrong place to post this, couldn't find any where else this seems like the best bet =)

So on to the query...I'm setting up a 'Ross Sky Remote Eye' in another room which allows me to watch Sky from the Sky box set up in my front room. I know how to set up the Remote Eye as I have done it before but this time my problems are faced with the amplifier. Instructions say that if I have a cable longer than 10m then I need an amplifier with non-bypass(?!). I have an amplifier in my porch already which passes the TV signal all around the house, but I'm guessing it must not be working (or is a bypass whatever that is - can someone explain?). Anyways I want to get this 'non-bypass' amplifier but not sure which one will be most appropriate. Have any of you done this and can spec me what amplifier you got or at least know what one to get?

Thanks in advance

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manisinghb · 5 Jul 2011 at 21:54

manisinghb said:
Hi guys, firstly apologies if this is the wrong place to post this, couldn't find any where else this seems like the best bet =)

So on to the query...I'm setting up a 'Ross Sky Remote Eye' in another room which allows me to watch Sky from the Sky box set up in my front room. I know how to set up the Remote Eye as I have done it before but this time my problems are faced with the amplifier. Instructions say that if I have a cable longer than 10m then I need an amplifier with non-bypass(?!). I have an amplifier in my porch already which passes the TV signal all around the house, but I'm guessing it must not be working (or is a bypass whatever that is - can someone explain?). Anyways I want to get this 'non-bypass' amplifier but not sure which one will be most appropriate. Have any of you done this and can spec me what amplifier you got or at least know what one to get?

Thanks in advance

edit: I found the amplifier below, will this do?

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wonko · 5 Jul 2011 at 22:15

Are the instructions saying to use this non-bypass amp between the antenna and TV, or between the sky box and remote eye? If it's the latter then it sounds the wrong way around to me.

I think bypass means that the amplifier will pass dc power on from the sky box on to the remote eye. If you used a non-bypass amp between the sky box and the tv in your other room then the remote eye wouldn't work.

It would be worth trying it without an extra amplifier first - it might work ok. If you want to distribute the rf output from the sky box round the house then you could take a coax cable back to your porch and use a loftbox (similar to your piccie) instead of your existing distribution amp.

lucid · 5 Jul 2011 at 22:24

I had to read your query a couple of times and I'll admit I'm still a bit confused by it

Okay... long story short.... The amp in your link will work because it can pass the 12 volts needed to make the Sky eye work. Now, before you waste any more money let's deal with what you've got.

1) How many rooms do you need with Sky eyes?

2) Have you unpacked the Ross Sky eye yet?(If not, don't do it yet. I'll explain later...)

3) What have you done to check that the existing amp in the porch doesn't work with Sky eyes?

manisinghb · 5 Jul 2011 at 22:36

wonko said:
Are the instructions saying to use this non-bypass amp between the antenna and TV, or between the sky box and remote eye? If it's the latter then it sounds the wrong way around to me.

I think bypass means that the amplifier will pass dc power on from the sky box on to the remote eye. If you used a non-bypass amp between the sky box and the tv in your other room then the remote eye wouldn't work.

It would be worth trying it without an extra amplifier first - it might work ok. If you want to distribute the rf output from the sky box round the house then you could take a coax cable back to your porch and use a loftbox (similar to your piccie) instead of your existing distribution amp.

I think you got me Wonko (sorry my explanations a bit hasty Lucid =P )
The instructions say the amp should go between antenna and TV.

I did exactly as you did, I tried the whole setup without an amplifier, ie. the rf output direct from the sky digibox straight to the magic eye on the second TV. and it works brilliantly! But as soon as I plug the rf output into my existing amp in the porch, its gone...thats why I'm assuming its my amp that doesn't let the dc bypass to power the Sky Eye which is why I'm hoping the one in the piccie should do the trick for me??

Lucid -
1. atm I'm only extending the Sky Eye to my dining room but will be running to the rest of the house in the very near future
2. unforunately I have opened the Sky Eye =( why u ask?
3. as above, I connected the rf output in the Sky box direct to the Sky Eye and second TV and it worked but as soon as I connect it to the amp, it doesn't

lucid · 5 Jul 2011 at 23:25

manisinghb said:
Lucid -
1. atm I'm only extending the Sky Eye to my dining room but will be running to the rest of the house in the very near future

I install this sort of kit for a living. If you'd said it was for a Sky eye just to one room then I'd have suggested a bypass kit. It would have solved the 12v issue and saved you £20+ buying a new amp.

manisinghb said:
Lucid -
2. unforunately I have opened the Sky Eye =( why u ask?

The Ross eye appears to be very expensive compared to my regular alternatives.

manisinghb said:
3. as above, I connected the rf output in the Sky box direct to the Sky Eye and second TV and it worked but as soon as I connect it to the amp, it doesn't

For the time being I'd suggest you run RF 1 output to the aerial amp. Run RF2 on the coax to the dining room with the Sky eye. That solves your amp problem without the need to buy an amp straight away.

When you are ready to do the rest of the house you will need an amp + eyes, and maybe connectors and a bit of cable. It'll save you a lot of time and possibly some money buying the stuff you need as a package. Drop me a line in Trust if you'd like a deal on that stuff.

wonko · 6 Jul 2011 at 08:44

Hi lucid, I didn't get the impression that OP had bought a new distribution amplifier yet. I'm not sure if the existing amplifier in the porch is needed to provide a strong-enough signal to his main TV/sky box. If not, then I'd agree with routeing the antenna direct to the main TV and using the existing distribution amp with a bypass kit to feed to other rooms.

Hi manisinghb - if you let us know what amp you've got in the porch and how you've tried wiring it up it might give us some clues. I'm a bit confused by

But as soon as I plug the rf output into my existing amp in the porch, its gone

Do you mean the picture is gone? If your existing amp is dc-blocking, I'd only expect the remote eye to not work if you've wired it correctly.

manisinghb · 6 Jul 2011 at 12:17

lol ok I'm clearly not explaining myself properly maybe I was tired last night so I'll have another shot at it:

1. I have not bought a new amp my whole enquiry is whether or not I should buy a new amp as my existing one seems to be the culprit behind the 12v not reaching my Ross Eye

2. I want to run the rf output from my Sky box straight to the amp in the porch so it can send the signal around the house, if I run the RF2 on the coax straight to the dining room with the Ross Eye (which btw I tried and works effortlessly), then I'm going to have to drill holes in the wall and run the wire all around the room to reach my second TV, which tbh I want to avoid - so all I want to do is run RF to the amp and pass on the power from the amp to the Ross Eye on my 2nd TV

3. Below is a picture of the amp I have, I have no idea what make it is as it was already fitted there when I moved in a few years ago...

Wonko - I'm pretty sure in fact I know that my amp must be dc-blocking because as I mentioned above when I connect the RF output direct to the Ross Eye it works fine but when I connect the RF output to the amp - the light on the Ross Eye doesn't even come on

I really hope this is more clear and I am sorry for being a little hazy in my explanations =P

lucid · 6 Jul 2011 at 13:29

wonko said:
Hi lucid, I didn't get the impression that OP had bought a new distribution amplifier yet. I'm not sure if the existing amplifier in the porch is needed to provide a strong-enough signal to his main TV/sky box. If not, then I'd agree with routeing the antenna direct to the main TV and using the existing distribution amp with a bypass kit to feed to other rooms.

I think we are all on the same page TBH. The OP was asking if the SLX8B would be suitable. i.e. A "Not bought yet. Will this work?" query, to which I answered Yes some time ago

The existing porch amp is blocking the 12V DC. It will need to be replaced. The SLX8B is one possibility. There are others.

Really, this whole thing isn't that complicated. I could have fitted half a dozen systems in the time it has taken this thread to reach this point. lol

It's very simple...

1) Junk the existing amp and replace with on that passes 12V

2) Hook up RF2 on the Sky box to UHF In on the amp.

3) Add Sky eyes to the appropriate TVs

SLX8B TV amp + 5x IR eyes* = £35 inc free delivery

* with small discrete and easy to hide IR eye

Additional Sky remotes: Sky+ or Sky+ HD = £11.50ea when purchased with a distribution amp & IR Eye system.

Simples...

manisinghb · 6 Jul 2011 at 13:43

lol yes that's all I was asking Lucid thanks. I might take up your offer on the kit but will have a look around first =)

Just two small quick questions:

1. Downstairs I have 3 rooms; front room, dining room and a bedroom. Now when I got the house refurbished, I extended the TV and telephone lines from the ones in the dining room through into the bedroom, do you think this will affect the signals/performance in any way in either room?

2. The FM output in the amp, will it allow me to plug a coaxial wire from my stereo in to the coaxial wall socket in any room and listen to radio?

wonko · 6 Jul 2011 at 13:48

Hi lucid, what you've suggested will distribute the sky box output around the house, but unless I've misunderstood, we haven't established if the OP also wants to keep the terrestrial antenna signal to the lounge or other rooms. Not as much point having lots of TVs if they only can show the same thing

If the OP doesn't want to watch terrestrial TV any more then we have a solution. Otherwise we need to know whether his existing porch amplifier is there to provide gain because it's a weak signal area or is only there to distribute the antenna signal. It might have been powering a head-amp for all we know.

However if the OP does want terrestrial TV, then wouldn't it be better to use a different distribution amp to add the antenna and sky feeds. It would be difficult to get the terrestrial signal into the lounge though if there is only one coax cable and that was being used for the output from the sky box.

manisinghb · 6 Jul 2011 at 14:32

wonko said:
Hi lucid, what you've suggested will distribute the sky box output around the house, but unless I've misunderstood, we haven't established if the OP also wants to keep the terrestrial antenna signal to the lounge or other rooms. Not as much point having lots of TVs if they only can show the same thing

If the OP doesn't want to watch terrestrial TV any more then we have a solution. Otherwise we need to know whether his existing porch amplifier is there to provide gain because it's a weak signal area or is only there to distribute the antenna signal. It might have been powering a head-amp for all we know.

However if the OP does want terrestrial TV, then wouldn't it be better to use a different distribution amp to add the antenna and sky feeds. It would be difficult to get the terrestrial signal into the lounge though if there is only one coax cable and that was being used for the output from the sky box.

ok now I'm confused lol. I was actually thinking of what you have suggested already ****o - get the SLx6B amp to distribute the Ross Eye from Sky to 2nd TV, and keep my existing amp installed for the Terrestrial TV? Only one way to find out if it works I guess, will let you know by tomorrow evening =)

lucid · 6 Jul 2011 at 14:34

manisinghb said:
lol yes that's all I was asking Lucid thanks. I might take up your offer on the kit but will have a look around first =)

Just two small quick questions:

1. Downstairs I have 3 rooms; front room, dining room and a bedroom. Now when I got the house refurbished, I extended the TV and telephone lines from the ones in the dining room through into the bedroom, do you think this will affect the signals/performance in any way in either room?

2. The FM output in the amp, will it allow me to plug a coaxial wire from my stereo in to the coaxial wall socket in any room and listen to radio?

By all means have a look round. I know I'm competitive when you factor in delivery too. Also bear in mind that you are talking to me now and already benefiting from the advice offered. Do you think you'd get the same level of service from an Ebay merchant or some faceless web seller?

On to your questions...

1) Use decent cable and you'll have no problems. Go cheap.... well, you know the rest

2) The FM socket is an input. Don't worry, people often get inputs and outputs mixed up.

If you have an FM aerial to plug in to that socket then the amp will mix the FM and TV signals down a single coax. It is called Diplexing. Your connection plate in the bedroom or elsewhere needs to separate the two signals again.

You can get two qualities of socket to deal with the signal. "Contractor quality" is the cheapest of the cheap. They look okay at first glance but they aren't well shielded and cause signal problems. Then there's the stuff that we pro's use when the householder calls us in to make their system work properly. The difference in price is minimal. Something good is about £3 each.

lucid · 6 Jul 2011 at 14:47

wonko said:
Hi lucid, what you've suggested will distribute the sky box output around the house, but unless I've misunderstood, we haven't established if the OP also wants to keep the terrestrial antenna signal to the lounge or other rooms. Not as much point having lots of TVs if they only can show the same thing

If the OP doesn't want to watch terrestrial TV any more then we have a solution. Otherwise we need to know whether his existing porch amplifier is there to provide gain because it's a weak signal area or is only there to distribute the antenna signal. It might have been powering a head-amp for all we know.

However if the OP does want terrestrial TV, then wouldn't it be better to use a different distribution amp to add the antenna and sky feeds. It would be difficult to get the terrestrial signal into the lounge though if there is only one coax cable and that was being used for the output from the sky box.

Firstly, feeding the roof aerial signal in to the Sky box solves the problem of getting Freeview to the TVs in the house.

Second, it's not practical to run two distribution systems in tandem - one for Freeview (or terrestrial if still on) and a second for Sky with IR eyes.

Your point about the possibility of it powering a head amp is valid. The OP needs to do a bit of homework about the aerial system & amp... starting with a look at the back of the amp for a model number.

manisinghb · 6 Jul 2011 at 15:20

ok now I'm confused lol. I was actually thinking of what you have suggested already ****o - get the SLx6B amp to distribute the Ross Eye from Sky to 2nd TV, and keep my existing amp installed for the Terrestrial TV? But as Lucid suggests this may not work and as he is in the business I'll take his word for it.

So the back of my existing amp says this (can't see no model number this is all there is):

wonko · 6 Jul 2011 at 15:38

manisinghb - hope I haven't confused you too much - sorry if I was too quick to post without rereading things back properly first. I was just trying to make sure that you'll end up with what you want at the end before diving in and buying anything.

p.s. how did you mistype my name to get it starred out :eek:

lucid - I'm assuming that there is only one coax cable running from the porch to the room with the sky box in it. How would you get the antenna signal to the sky box if the only cable is being used for the sky box output? All of the loftbox-type solutions (including the one I've got) need two coax cables :confused:

.

manisinghb · 6 Jul 2011 at 15:41

LOL sorry Wonko I accidently typed your name with a WA.... hahaha sorry my bad! & no worries you haven't confused me too much appreciate the input always =)

And yes, there is only one coax cable running from the porch to the room with sky box...I'm assuming (as perhaps you are wonko) that what lucid is advising might require two coax cables running from the amp(s) in the porch to the sky box?

wonko · 6 Jul 2011 at 17:13

LOL, no problem :cool:

You've obviously understood what I was trying to get at about only having one cable to the sky box. Is there any way you could run an extra cable from the porch to wherever the sky box is? That would mean a 'standard' loftbox approach would work with terrestrial + sky to all rooms.

lucid · 6 Jul 2011 at 21:00

There are a couple of ways to link up a system, but in the end the system still needs to mix the aerial signal with the RF2 signal from the Sky box.

The best way to do that is via the Sky box itself. That means two cables to the Sky box. Have a look at the existing wiring run from the amp in the porch to the Sky box. Most times it is possible to run an extra cable along side. You may have to enlarge a hole here and there, but the hard work of finding a suitable path has already been done.

If you absolutely definitely positively can't get an extra cable through... and I do mean that you've really tried and not just given up because "it's a bit hard", there is an the alternative. But I'll warn you now, it knocks the signal strength down by over half!! You don't want that if the aerial & cabling is anything less than perfect because with digital you'll start to lose channels. It also makes a DIY installation more complicated. Trust me on this....Running the extra cable is a far far easier solution

Masthead amp: Your existing amp is, I believe, capable of powering a masthead aerial amp. But that doesn't mean it doing so at the moment.

Have a look at the aerial mast. Do you see a box attached to the mast with a cable from the aerial and a cable down to ground level? Report back on the results of your investigation. If there is a box up there it could be a masthead amp, or a group filter, or a diplexer, or a splitter.

manisinghb · 7 Jul 2011 at 12:49

Guys I can easily run another cable just means I'll have to make the existing holes running the existing coax a little bigger but that's no problem, sounds better and easier than the Masthead amp Lucid, thanks for the option though =)

I will have a look at the aerial in the loft later on today when I get back home just for the sake of it anyways =P