Another question about restocking fees

dirtychinchilla · 14 Aug 2013 at 14:47

Afternoon all,

I just want to clarify something with regards to DSR and restocking fees. I bought something from eBay, which I later returned within seven days of receiving it. The auction states that a 15% restocking fee will be charged if I return it.

I received my refund less 15% and have disputed it with the seller, who's claiming that it is acceptable because it was stated in the auction and because he's paid for recorded delivery on the item.

With regards to the delivery, that's up to him, and I really don't care. It says standard, he paid recorded, sucks for him. But this 15% is annoying me.

Can anyone make this clear for me?

Thanks,

dirtychinchilla

tom_e · 14 Aug 2013 at 14:49

If he's a business seller it's against the law for him to charge a restocking fee for items returned under the DSR, it's as simple as that.

arknor · 14 Aug 2013 at 14:51

I remember when ocuk had restocking fees

dirtychinchilla · 14 Aug 2013 at 14:53

Thanks

I'm going to let it lie because he spent so much on postage, but I've told him that it's illegal.

Merlin5 · 14 Aug 2013 at 16:47

tom_e said:
If he's a business seller it's against the law for him to charge a restocking fee for items returned under the DSR, it's as simple as that.

I'm now wondering if I should have paid my restocking fee. I paid for shure earbud tips on the bay for £18 on the 28th July free delivery, it was dispatched on 29th, and ETA was 31st to 1st. I think it came on the 31st. I ordered the wrong size, hadn't opened the packet, only the envelope it came in, so pristine condition.

On the 5th at 1.45pm I messaged the seller for a return so I could buy a different size and they sent me return details the same day. I sent it off to them the next day on the 6th 2nd class, they would have got it on the 8th. Their policy has a 10% restocking fee so they took £1.80 from my refund which they issued on the 8th. Their policy states this below, but no mention of DSR in the rest of the conditions. Should I have paid restocking? From receiving it on the 31st to messaging them on the 5th about returning is 5 days. Would that have counted as within the bounds of DSR? The seller is a business seller.

For cancellations, we offer buyers a 'cooling off' period of 14 working days after receipt for all Buy It Now items. Products must be unopened, in pristine condition and with the original seals intact. A restocking charge will be levied of 10% of the total value including vat and delivery or the initial delivery costs (whichever is the greater).

alexthecheese · 14 Aug 2013 at 16:50

On principle I would report them to eBay.

Nexus · 14 Aug 2013 at 16:51

As already pointed out above, is it a business seller?
If so, its illegal for them to do so, in the UK at least.

Merlin5 · 14 Aug 2013 at 16:59

Yeah, DSR states "Your right to cancel starts the moment you place your order and doesn’t end until seven working days from the day after you receive your goods". So that means I cancelled well within the 7 day period. As it happens, I want to order some more from them. Shall I ring them up stating I want to buy more but that they should refund me the restocking fee?

tom_e · 14 Aug 2013 at 17:03

You should ring them up and tell them you want the restocking fee refunded regardless of whether you plan on buying any more from them, and as they don't state otherwise you can also claim your return postage back.

alexthecheese · 14 Aug 2013 at 17:14

If they're charging restocking fees at all, then surely they must be a business? Otherwise they are taking the pee even more!

Vanquish-Storm · 14 Aug 2013 at 18:16

Restocking fees should be allowed, nothing more annoying than people buying stuff they no longer want 7 days later! Especially with items that can not be sold back on for hygiene reasons! It might boost the high street a bit too!

arknor · 14 Aug 2013 at 18:25

Vanquish-Storm said:
Restocking fees should be allowed, nothing more annoying than people buying stuff they no longer want 7 days later! Especially with items that can not be sold back on for hygiene reasons! It might boost the high street a bit too!

I agree

mattyprice4004 · 14 Aug 2013 at 18:50

Vanquish-Storm said:
Restocking fees should be allowed, nothing more annoying than people buying stuff they no longer want 7 days later! Especially with items that can not be sold back on for hygiene reasons! It might boost the high street a bit too!

Why would it boost the high street? DSRs only apply to distance sales, from a high street you have no right to return for a change of mind.

Nexus · 14 Aug 2013 at 19:03

Vanquish-Storm said:
Restocking fees should be allowed, nothing more annoying than people buying stuff they no longer want 7 days later! Especially with items that can not be sold back on for hygiene reasons! It might boost the high street a bit too!

The whole reason it exists though is due to the fact that you can't try or assess a product in person. You sounds perhaps like you are a retailer and it personally annoys you? Does it not also bring you business though, compared to selling elsewhere?

I'd also point out that most places selling things for hygiene reasons, such as underwear or swimwear will have a disclaimer that they can't be returned and are DSR exempt.

Vanquish-Storm · 14 Aug 2013 at 19:51

Nexus said:
The whole reason it exists though is due to the fact that you can't try or assess a product in person. You sounds perhaps like you are a retailer and it personally annoys you? Does it not also bring you business though, compared to selling elsewhere?

I'd also point out that most places selling things for hygiene reasons, such as underwear or swimwear will have a disclaimer that they can't be returned and are DSR exempt.

In a lot of shops you can not go in and open boxes try things and leave them their for the company to re-package.

Also the fact that you have to refund postage is a pain, high street stores do not refund petrol/parking.

Do earplugs and such items come under this hygiene rule? Do you have any documentation showing this?

arknor · 14 Aug 2013 at 19:54

Nexus said:
The whole reason it exists though is due to the fact that you can't try or assess a product in person. You sounds perhaps like you are a retailer and it personally annoys you? Does it not also bring you business though, compared to selling elsewhere?

I'd also point out that most places selling things for hygiene reasons, such as underwear or swimwear will have a disclaimer that they can't be returned and are DSR exempt.

There is nothing wrong with returning items in a saleable condition but a lot of people take the **** and should be charged a restocking fee.
is it really hard to carefully unpack an item without tearing the box? why should etailers be forced to sell the item on at a discounted loss?

I wonder where all the ocuk bgrade stuff comes from

Nexus · 14 Aug 2013 at 20:37

Vanquish-Storm said:
In a lot of shops you can not go in and open boxes try things and leave them their for the company to re-package.

Arguably a good shop should let you asses a product first, thats the hallmark of a good shop and customer service. I see what you are saying though, for some items that isn't practical. But regardless, that is the reason the DSR exists, because you aren't getting to see something in person.

Also the fact that you have to refund postage is a pain, high street stores do not refund petrol/parking.

I think I've been buying things online since about 2000 and I've never once had the retailer pay postage costs for me returning something I didn't want, so thats a moot point really. The exception to this is of course where something has been wrong or faulty, in which case they have paid postage.

Technically the Seller is responsible for postage back, unless they state in their terms and conditions otherwise. But as I've pointed out above, I've never once come across any seller who doesn't have those terms and conditions. So effectively any business who is paying for returns of items that customers simply don't want is either hoping the policy brings in sales, or they simply aren't running their business very well.

Do earplugs and such items come under this hygiene rule? Do you have any documentation showing this?

There is no hard and fast rule specifically about hygiene, however its largely up to the retailer as to how they want to handle it. They can set terms and conditions that they won't accept returns for intimate items, or if its hygienically sealed, they can ask that its not opened, thus you can still somewhat assess it, however if you did open it and return it, it is grounds for breach of contract, so arguably they don't have to refund you.

The actual OFT wording is below:

Unless they fall under one of the exemptions (see When customers do not have a right to cancel ), such goods can be returned. The right to cancel is not linked to the ability to resell goods. The right to cancel does not apply to goods which by their nature cannot be returned. We consider this to apply only where returning the goods is a physical impossibility or where they cannot be restored in the same physical state as they were supplied, for example, items such as latex or nylon tights that could become distorted once worn.
You may give clear instructions to customers requiring them to exercise reasonable care, if they still allow inspection. For example,
in the case of goods such as earrings that have hygiene seals,
you may state that the seals should not be removed when examining them. If selling such items, you should factor this into packaging, instructions and price. Failure by the customer to follow the instructions will not prevent them returning the goods, but will give you a claim for breach of duty.

Vanquish-Storm · 14 Aug 2013 at 21:05

Nexus said:
Arguably a good shop should let you asses a product first, thats the hallmark of a good shop and customer service. I see what you are saying though, for some items that isn't practical. But regardless, that is the reason the DSR exists, because you aren't getting to see something in person.

I think I've been buying things online since about 2000 and I've never once had the retailer pay postage costs for me returning something I didn't want, so thats a moot point really. The exception to this is of course where something has been wrong or faulty, in which case they have paid postage.

Technically the Seller is responsible for postage back, unless they state in their terms and conditions otherwise. But as I've pointed out above, I've never once come across any seller who doesn't have those terms and conditions. So effectively any business who is paying for returns of items that customers simply don't want is either hoping the policy brings in sales, or they simply aren't running their business very well.

There is no hard and fast rule specifically about hygiene, however its largely up to the retailer as to how they want to handle it. They can set terms and conditions that they won't accept returns for intimate items, or if its hygienically sealed, they can ask that its not opened, thus you can still somewhat assess it, however if you did open it and return it, it is grounds for breach of contract, so arguably they don't have to refund you.

The actual OFT wording is below:

Unless they fall under one of the exemptions (see When customers do not have a right to cancel ), such goods can be returned. The right to cancel is not linked to the ability to resell goods. The right to cancel does not apply to goods which by their nature cannot be returned. We consider this to apply only where returning the goods is a physical impossibility or where they cannot be restored in the same physical state as they were supplied, for example, items such as latex or nylon tights that could become distorted once worn.
You may give clear instructions to customers requiring them to exercise reasonable care, if they still allow inspection. For example,
in the case of goods such as earrings that have hygiene seals,
you may state that the seals should not be removed when examining them. If selling such items, you should factor this into packaging, instructions and price. Failure by the customer to follow the instructions will not prevent them returning the goods, but will give you a claim for breach of duty.

Regarding the postage I mean the initial posting to a customer. Customers pay for next day delivery then expect that to be refunded if they return the item, which under DSR you have to do.

The DSR is also too vague as they are not a set list of rules.

You can't go into argos and open and try all of their items, but I understand what you are saying. In the shops that do allow you to try items/products you can not just rip open the packaging and try them.

Nexus · 14 Aug 2013 at 21:16

Vanquish-Storm said:
Regarding the postage I mean the initial posting to a customer. Customers pay for next day delivery then expect that to be refunded if they return the item, which under DSR you have to do.

Like I said, nearly every retailer has it in their terms and conditions that the customer pays return postage for anything they do not want. This is a perfectly legal practise and they are entitled to add that caveat to the DSR when operating.

From my own experience, the exception to this tends be huge retailers who are quite happy to pay the return for postage because they know people are more likely to order. I'm thinking of the likes of Next and the many retailers which now use Collect+ for free returns.

The DSR is also too vague as they are not a set list of rules.

In a way, but essentially its a set of guidelines that do need to be adhered to and are a way of drawing up a contract between a customer and retailer. Hence why some areas are open to interpretation and the retailer can set such terms.

You can't go into argos and open and try all of their items, but I understand what you are saying. In the shops that do allow you to try items/products you can not just rip open the packaging and try them.

I disagree.

I've often seen people in Argos ask to look at something. Just go to Customer Services.

Vanquish-Storm · 14 Aug 2013 at 22:41

I am not talking about return postage sir. I mean the original postage from the store to the customer.