Any recommendations for in-wall speakers? Fronts and centre?

[EddScott]

Apologies for hijacking the thread but could I get an opinion on the Monitor Audio in wall speakers?

I'm looking at two MA W280-IDC for front and a MA W250-LCR for the centre.

My receiver is an Onkoy 828. I was thinking of changing it but it's been perfect. I have just bought a 4K TV and will by a 4K player but will feed video direct to TV.

Eventually get a BK sub and MA rears (probably Bronze FX) to match the others. I have Quad Lites that I can mix and match with for the time being.

 

[lucid]

Compared to the Quads, the MA front speakers will go deeper. You'll probably hear this in male voices; they'll be more anchored to the front soundstage because they're not relying as heavily on the sub.

The MAs will be marginally easier to drive too thanks to the higher efficiency.

The Quads could have the edge on creating soundstage depth and placement precision.

Tonally, MA is a tad brighter than Quad.

In-walls are a bit of a compromise compared to freestanding speakers. With an enclosed box, it's easier for the designer to get consistent results from the drivers; but with in-wall/in-ceiling speakers they're relying on the ceiling or wall void to provide some back pressure. The back pressure helps the speaker driver return to its rest position faster, and that tightens up bass response. Like for like in price then, a properly positioned box speaker will outperform an in-wall/in-ceiling. How much of a performance gap depends on the quality of the speaker, it's design (open back or enclosed), and - for open back in particular - whether the installer knows their stuff and can persuade the client to pay for read enclosures or boxing in to improve performance.

 

[Phate]

Hey Lucid,

Little update on this. I have the keys to the apartment and the installer is coming to take a look on Wednesday whilst the place is empty so we can look at the layout and figure out whats best. I've got 2 potential ideas in my head in terms of layout but I'll see what he thinks also.

I have been looking at screens, it seems not many brands are easy to get in Portugal, but from what is available I really like the look of the Elite-Screens Aeon Edge Free in Cinegrey. Reviews seem to be very positive over it. I can get a 100" for around €599 + shipping which seems pretty good. Also its totally edgeless which seems very modern and appealing to me. Plus I have read that the grey can help with improving contrast levels as well? either way, this is the screen that is waving at me.

I REALLY liked the look of the Screenline options, but again, difficult to find a seller, although I did email them directly asking for a distributor in Portugal.

Lets see what develops. Its going to be a very busy/crazy couple of weeks as my new places gets transformed, but I'll be sure to photograph as it goes!

 

[lucid]

Edgeless with a TV screen.... good.
Edgeless with a projector screen.....not so good. Well, not unless the back wall is painted a very light-absorbent colour.

The black border of a screen does a couple of jobs. It helps to frame the projected image against whatever the back wall is, and this improves the perception of contrast. (It's a psychological thing.) The other important role is to help to deal with light spill and alignment issues. When you're projecting, a fraction of a degree of tilt or twist in the bracket is magnified by the projection distance. You also have to consider the flatness of the wall that the screen is being attached to. It may look perfect to the naked eye, but if one side runs away then the screen frame can end up tilted just enough that you get the image running out a few millimetres along a side. It's not uncommon to find a combination of effects. Don't forget too, installed gear is subject to a bit of thermal drift and building/install settling over time.

 

[Phate]

Makes sense. I read that the screens come with a black felt border to attached if I want so I get either option really.

Colour wise behind it will be a very dark hopefully non reflective colour. What you say does (as always) make sense. I get carried away by the borderless aspect of it.

 

[Phate]

Further update. I have found a Portuguese distributor for Screenline - which brings me back to this manufacturer based on your comments on the previous page. After tomorrow I will know what size screen I can go for and then explore the options with Screenline, decide and get it ordered. Also as its already based in Portugal the shipping should be much more reasonable.

I need to look into their materials. Still favouring a grey vs a white for asthetic reasons. Also pricing wise seems very reasonable as you mentioned:

I was quoted this on their "only white with diamond surface"

Format 16:9

90” (200x113cm) - NO200HDI – 390,00€ + IVA

113” (250x140cm) - NO250HDI – 480,00€ + IVA

 

[Richeh]

Sorry if you have already picked your speakers but if you are still looking at inwall for movie use have a look at MK speakers, idealAV has them and they come highly recommended.

 

[Phate]

Sorry if you have already picked your speakers but if you are still looking at inwall for movie use have a look at MK speakers, idealAV has them and they come highly recommended.

Thanks for the recommendation. However already picked now. I'm going for Dali On-Wall speakers

 

[8 Pack]

Meridian DSP are awesome sound quality and have built in amps and dacs... I have these as rears in my lounge. very solid.

 

[EddScott]

Lucid, can I call on your expertise again?

I found some enclosures for the MAs and used the same dimensions to make enclosures within the frame of the false wall. The actual wall is a main concrete wall.

Would it be best to seal these enclosures with sealant of some kind and line them with something like Dynamat? Also, should I add a port for the enclosures?

 

[lucid]

You seal with intumescent sealant. It's a fire-retardant product. Most builders merchants stock it. Have a look at Screwfix.

Dynamat - Yes. It will help reduce sound leakage in to the next room. If you're doing that though, there's a product called Soundbox or something similar that will save you a lot of time. It's a soft box made out of Dynamat-type material.

Porting - No. In order for a port to be of any value it needs to vent in to the same room that the speaker fires in to, otherwise it's just a big hole undoing all the work and money spent building enclosures and lining them with soundproofing materials.

Porting in to the room requires speaker design knowledge to create the correct size enclosure, then do all the maths to get an appropriate diameter/length/position port to tune it correctly. Ports can be tricky to get right. At some frequencies the air mass in the box provides an acoustic suspension for the bass driver. But at others the port plays a note to reinforce/replace what the bass driver can't do alone. Get any of this wrong and you run the risk of messing up the sound quite badly. It's better to stick to what the speaker was designed to do. Make a sealed enclosure; this is your best chance to keep the performance of an in-wall/in-ceiling as linear as it can be.

 

[EddScott]

Really appreciate the advice. Thank you.

 

[Phate]

Further update from me.

Installer came around and we figured out the layout, screen size etc. He gave me the final quote inc installation and I green lit it. He should it could be installed "next week" - I have ordered the screen seperately and asked him if he would prefer to wait until that is here. Waiting on his reply, if so, then that will push everything by 2-3 weeks.

It's going to be a beast of a setup when its done.

Screen wise I went with a Screenlite, 92" fixed frame with RGB kit in a grey high contrast fabric on a fashion velvet frame. It will be an amazing upgrade from my previous screen.

My next job is to get the projector installed, which is fine, nothing I haven't done before but running the cables could be a potential pig of a job, I am in need of suggestions of how to run the cable over coving, will post pics tomorrow.

 

[-Ad-]

Very nice, looking forward to the install and pics.

Another option for a screen (albeit more expensive) is a Draper Euroscreen. You can get ceiling/wall mount or a recessed version (if joists go the correct way). They are tab tensioned and have the REACT fabric which is more of a grey colour. Better for rooms with ambient light and or non-dedicated cave rooms with lighter coloured walls.

I love my React screen and the best thing is that there are no borders, so you can project right up to the edge and there are no black surrounds when switching between 2:39:1 and 1:85:1.

Did you look at other receivers, possibly from the likes of Arcam or Anthem. They are another level up when it comes to room correction. Or if you have 12k to be a bit spendy with then the only choice is the Lyngdorf MP-50. Room Perfect is the daddy, but comes at quite a cost

 

[Phate]

I looked at many options and decided I wanted a fixed frame. For me I think and feel (and partially visualize) that it will be part of the feature wall when its switched off. Its grey high contrast so it will be more subtle when not in use. Then I also don't need to wait for it to drop down, worry about ceiling mount etc, less to go wrong. Also like you say a drop down & tab tensioned screen means there is more capital going towards those components. Having in fixed frame means more money can go toward improved quality of fabric

Initially i wanted borderless, but like Lucid mentions above, they do an important job in controlling ambient light reflection outside of the image and help with dealing with any overlap also.

I can't wait for it all to arrive now!

 

[Phate]

Confirmed now, speakers, subs and amp being installed on Friday

 

[Martynt74]

How's it all looking?

We need pics!

 

[Phate]

Small update on this...

- All speakers installed, they sound incredible. Atmos is one of the most surreal things to experience at first. Can't wait to listen to more content in this. Also the dual sub setup is immense...the subs are only tiny but you can feel the bass to make your hairs stand on edge. Its amazing
- The installers were fantastic. Really pleased I went with a company to handle all this. Did they a much better job than I could.
- They're coming back Wednesday to finish off the cabling. They ran out of conduit whilst they were here. They're also going to mount my projector and run the cables for that as well.

---

After this on my todo list it

- Paint conduit to match wall colours.
- Get screen installed, due to be delivered in a week and a half or so

Pic, don't lose your marbles over the cables. Remember it is NOT finished.

Rears

Overall I am chuffed with the whole result. The sound quality is absolutely incredible. The amp has taken a little bit of getting used to when it comes to user interface but it's early days.

 

[Phate]

How's it all looking?

We need pics!

Funny I was typing my reply above as you posted this

 

[Kol]

Going to be epic, looking forward to seeing the progress. I hope you get on with your neighbours with those dual subs