Any server experts in here?

doopydug · 24 Mar 2008 at 09:28

Need to set up a small network/server in my warehouse to run SAGE stock control.

I have built hundreds of pcs in my time but know nothing about servers .

Is there an online guide or advice available anywhere?

Basically, I need to have three terminals running in my warehouse for the guys to issue stock. If one guy issues the last ceramic hob for instance, I need the stock program to be updated in real time hence the need for a server.

Where do I start? What are the hardware requirements of the server and terminals. Do they all connect through a standard router?

J.B · 24 Mar 2008 at 13:53

I imagine (dont quote me on this) that you just need 4 standard computers networked together in a standard way and SAGE will do the rest in software, as long as all the PCs can communicate with the "server" and run SAGE

doopydug · 24 Mar 2008 at 14:10

That is certainly what I was WANTING to hear

K.C. Leblanc · 24 Mar 2008 at 15:43

You can connect them through a router, or a hub/switch. If it's for use by a business consider buying a proper server with 3 years on site warranty from someone like HP.If you are going to self build a basic PC should be fine for 3 users, I would consider using RAID 1 since it gives you some protection against hard drive failure and also make sure you have a method of backing up to removable media that you can then take off site.

Check sage's documentation for server specs, but I can't imagine it being very demanding. Also bare in mind if you need a proper server OS this will bump the price up, but you might get a away with using XP pro or Vista, which can handle up to 10 conncurent conections.

bigredshark · 24 Mar 2008 at 19:50

K.C. Leblanc said:
You can connect them through a router, or a hub/switch. If it's for use by a business consider buying a proper server with 3 years on site warranty from someone like HP.If you are going to self build a basic PC should be fine for 3 users, I would consider using RAID 1 since it gives you some protection against hard drive failure and also make sure you have a method of backing up to removable media that you can then take off site.

Check sage's documentation for server specs, but I can't imagine it being very demanding. Also bare in mind if you need a proper server OS this will bump the price up, but you might get a away with using XP pro or Vista, which can handle up to 10 conncurent conections.

Thats all good advice!

quackers · 24 Mar 2008 at 22:19

As said, server 2003, four networked pc's with a switch and probably some sort of hardware firewall to protect the network.

doopydug · 24 Mar 2008 at 22:44

Thanks for all the advice guys.

I have seen plenty of capable servers out there - my main worry now is the operating system.

Most seem to offer Windows SBS 2003 but I would be more comfortable with XP. Would I lose any functionality if I choose to use XP?

Is it easy enough to configure the server/network access etc through XP?

mejinks · 25 Mar 2008 at 00:28

Unless you plan on expanding past 10 users, I would follow K.Cs advice. Its spot on. If you were only going to run Sage, then you wouldn't want SBS anyway and server 2003 would be overkill anyway.

On the other hand, if you planned on expanding quite a lot, then you would need Windows 2003 server with AD set up on it. This is surprisingly easy once you get going.

Curiosityx · 25 Mar 2008 at 02:17

Purchase yourself a copy of Windows Server 2003 SBS with 5 Cals included to reduce cost and then buy a managed server platform like a HP ML310 G5 for HP ML150 G5 for reliability. A single dual core processor, 2Gb of memory and two 72Gb - 146Gb disks configured in Raid 1 would suffice.

The SBS Installation process is relatively straight forward, i would not recommend running Sage in a workgroup environment and certainly not having it hosted on a Windows XP machine.

The benefit of using SBS is mainly licensing related, there is a 75 user limit but one SBS CAL grants you a license for Exchange also. In a Windows 2003 Standard environment CALS for Windows Server and Exchange need to be purchased separately elevating the cost.

If you want to get a better idea on the hardware involved have a look below.

http://www.hp.com/cgi-bin/sbso/buyguides/tsg_product_select.cgi

K.C. Leblanc · 25 Mar 2008 at 08:15

I'll do a longer post later, the basic installation of 2003 is very similar to XP.

mejinks · 25 Mar 2008 at 19:39

Why does he need sbs??

Curiosityx · 25 Mar 2008 at 21:23

mejinks said:
Why does he need sbs??

Because Sage does not work well if at all in workgroup environments, mainly due to issues relating to permissions. This along with the added functionality of Exchange, ISA, Active Directory, File services, print services and centralised security.

If your going to do a job its worth investing and doing it properly with an adequate solution. I agree there may only be 5 users but it is justified by having a system that will last until a future upgrade is deemed necessary.

brendy · 25 Mar 2008 at 22:22

Absolutely, a g5 ml350 will cost you £2k including the below spec from HP, This includes a better onsite warranty, we have bought a few and have run them using both sql 2000 server and msde for some of our larger sites running multiple slave machines on an sql program. With sbs 2003 you also get sql 2000 server so if you were able to get hold of a bespoke system, the sql license would already be in place for the server.
ProLiant ML350 G5 Xeon 5320 Quad
1 x Xeon 5320 1860-2x4MB/1066
2GB (2x 1GB), Hot Plug SFF SAS
Smart Array Controller P400/256MB,
DVD-R/RW, 3 Year NBD Warranty
Integrated ILO
HP ML350 9x5 3Y SBD Warranty
HP 2GB Fully Buffered Dimm PC2-5300
2x1GB Kit
HP 72Gb 10K SAS Disk, Hot Plug x 2
2.5" Form Factor
HP Microsoft Windows 2003 R2 Small Business Ed.

Curiosityx said:
Purchase yourself a copy of Windows Server 2003 SBS with 5 Cals included to reduce cost and then buy a managed server platform like a HP ML310 G5 for HP ML150 G5 for reliability. A single dual core processor, 2Gb of memory and two 72Gb - 146Gb disks configured in Raid 1 would suffice.

The SBS Installation process is relatively straight forward, i would not recommend running Sage in a workgroup environment and certainly not having it hosted on a Windows XP machine.

The benefit of using SBS is mainly licensing related, there is a 75 user limit but one SBS CAL grants you a license for Exchange also. In a Windows 2003 Standard environment CALS for Windows Server and Exchange need to be purchased separately elevating the cost.

If you want to get a better idea on the hardware involved have a look below.

http://www.hp.com/cgi-bin/sbso/buyguides/tsg_product_select.cgi

mejinks · 26 Mar 2008 at 14:31

Curiosityx said:
Because Sage does not work well if at all in workgroup environments, mainly due to issues relating to permissions. This along with the added functionality of Exchange, ISA, Active Directory, File services, print services and centralised security.

If your going to do a job its worth investing and doing it properly with an adequate solution. I agree there may only be 5 users but it is justified by having a system that will last until a future upgrade is deemed necessary.

My point was why does he need SBS when plain old W2K3 server will do what is needed.

m_cozzy · 27 Mar 2008 at 08:10

SBS is a much cheaper option I believe over the full version of server 2003 & is designed for this sort of scenario, wizards & things to make it easier to set up. Personally being used to 2003 I dislike all them meddling wizards

Curiosityx · 27 Mar 2008 at 17:53

brendy said:
Absolutely, a g5 ml350 will cost you £2k including the below spec from HP, This includes a better onsite warranty, we have bought a few and have run them using both sql 2000 server and msde for some of our larger sites running multiple slave machines on an sql program. With sbs 2003 you also get sql 2000 server so if you were able to get hold of a bespoke system, the sql license would already be in place for the server.
ProLiant ML370 G5 Xeon 5320 Quad
1 x Xeon 5320 1860-2x4MB/1066
2GB (2x 1GB), Hot Plug SFF SAS
Smart Array Controller P400/256MB,
DVD-R/RW, 3 Year NBD Warranty
Integrated ILO
HP ML350 9x5 3Y SBD Warranty
HP 2GB Fully Buffered Dimm PC2-5300
2x1GB Kit
HP 72Gb 10K SAS Disk, Hot Plug x 2
2.5" Form Factor
HP Microsoft Windows 2003 R2 Small Business Ed.

A tad excessive for what's needed i feel, even the ML350 and especially the ML370.

mejinks said:
My point was why does he need SBS when plain old W2K3 server will do what is needed.

As explained above SBS in a complete solution incorporating the capabilities of Windows Server 2003 but also Exchange 2003, SQL 2005, ISA 2003 and IIS 6 all in one installation package.

All this and it is still cheaper than Windows 2003 Standard as additional options need to be purchased separately along with licensing. A Single SBS License covers all the licensing requirements for application included in the SBS Suite.

brendy · 27 Mar 2008 at 21:59

Curiosityx said:
A tad excessive for what's needed i feel, even the ML350 and especially the ML370.

Sorry, that should have read 350 on both counts. anything less wouldnt be worth it pound for pound.

quackers · 27 Mar 2008 at 22:51

You could always pick up an older server from the bay, i installed sbs r2 on an older server, exchange 2003 and its works fine. Doing that, you could probably get the server + software for around 700 quid or less.

For exchange the server just needs ram, 2-4gb and your off

doopydug · 4 Apr 2008 at 21:38

If I was to put 4gb ram in the server, would that all be useable?

I hear that XP or vista 32 bit can only access less than that? So how is sbs 2003 with memory management?

Is 4gb too much in that case?

Deathwish · 5 Apr 2008 at 19:16

Should be fine with 4Gb ram. We have a few servers (DL320 and DL380) running here with 4Gb and using Windows Server 2003 (Which SBS is based on). Sure, it doesn't use it all, and only shows 3.5Gb, but its better than 2Gb.