Asus mesh solutions

[mid_gen]

The Asus gear I've had worked fine, but goes out of support instantly more or less. I had a few more years out of my AC66u with merlin but that hasn't been updated for five years or so now, which is just useless for network kit in this day and age.

Unifi kit I've just replaced my Asus with is far better, in every respect. Couldn't go back to Asus' crap software.

 

[Minato]

The Asus gear I've had worked fine, but goes out of support instantly more or less. I had a few more years out of my AC66u with merlin but that hasn't been updated for five years or so now, which is just useless for network kit in this day and age.

Unifi kit I've just replaced my Asus with is far better, in every respect. Couldn't go back to Asus' crap software.

What difference do you notice between the two?

Are you getting better speeds on unifi, more reliable WiFi coverage, or more power user specialist stuff to play with like VLANs and firewalls and things?

 

[mid_gen]

What difference do you notice between the two?

Are you getting better speeds on unifi, more reliable WiFi coverage, or more power user specialist stuff to play with like VLANs and firewalls and things?

Hard to give an objective answer to speeds as I went from a single Asus AC66u, to a Unifi Unifi Express in the same position as the Asus, plus ran some CAT6 downstairs and have a U6+.... so better coverage and faster speeds (ac to ax).

The Unifi Express coverage isn't as good as the Asus, but that was expected as the express is tiny and had no external antenna. The U6+ is great though.

Software is on another level. Major benefit for me is the ecosystem, I'll be adding an NVR and cameras next.

 

[Avalon]

I have the X20s and it would be nice if they had 3 switch ports and were £100 for two but unless there's different hardware revisions they have two ports on each base

You’re right, you need to pay the extra 25 for a pair and go to the x50 for 3 ports. Joys of living in a mixed environment.

 

[Avalon]

Software is on another level. Major benefit for me is the ecosystem, I'll be adding an NVR and cameras next.

It’s a trap! Don’t fall into it before you at least look at what the same budget will buy you in terms of one of the industry standard solutions eg Hikvision. Too many failures on Ubiquiti hardware and the actual quality/features and how well they work is often disappointing. I’d suggest posting in the CCTV thread first.

 

[ChrisD.]

Not sure I agree with that completely, Protect has come on a long way and the cameras are good quality. It's easy to use and setup, my wife manages to use it without issue and we've had zero issues with Protect/cameras for well over a year now.

 

[Avalon]

Not sure I agree with that completely, Protect has come on a long way and the cameras are good quality. It's easy to use and setup, my wife manages to use it without issue and we've had zero issues with Protect/cameras for well over a year now.

The lens coatings stopped breaking down and the dreaded purple hue a thing of the past? Can it tell the difference between cats and people reliably now? I kind of feel like non of those should really be questions on hardware at this price point, let alone 3-4 generations in, but they certainly were when I looked at it.

 

[ChrisD.]

I can't speak for others but I've not had any detection issues, nor problems with any cameras (G3 Flex, G4 Dome, G4 Doorbell, G5 Bullet). Like I said, I'm over a year in probably longer and we're more than happy with the system.

 

[Simon42]

Software is on another level. Major benefit for me is the ecosystem, I'll be adding an NVR and cameras next.

I also suggest you look carefully at the general good CCTV brands such as Hikvision and Dahua before going down the Ubiquiti route and get locked into their kits and system.

If you buy general CCTV cameras you can run whatever software you like and even if you stick to the manufacturers NVR that's just the NVR. I used to install CCTV professionally and a couple of my neighbours boasted about their Unifi CCTV being better after I installed mine. That was until they saw my pictures, especially night time and realised how much better they are plus I have all the notifications, AI motion detection, ANPR and linkage into my home automation for security lights etc.

 

[Avalon]

I can't speak for others but I've not had any detection issues, nor problems with any cameras (G3 Flex, G4 Dome, G4 Doorbell, G5 Bullet). Like I said, I'm over a year in probably longer and we're more than happy with the system.

You know what Chris, your normally right and make sense, so it’s only fair if I am going to disagree, that I do so from equally current personal experience (camera longevity may take a while). So, some time on Wednesday I will be the (proud?) owner of a new UDM Pro and PoE switch. Hopefully Unifi has matured, but we’re not off to a great start with the non PoE switch in the pro and 1Gb uplink for the ports back to the router, so it seemed better value to bag a Pro and a PoE switch than a £500 SE, but the lack of software release parity between the SE and pro may bite me later on.

 

[ChrisD.]

You know what Chris, your normally right and make sense, so it’s only fair if I am going to disagree, that I do so from equally current personal experience (camera longevity may take a while). So, some time on Wednesday I will be the (proud?) owner of a new UDM Pro and PoE switch. Hopefully Unifi has matured, but we’re not off to a great start with the non PoE switch in the pro and 1Gb uplink for the ports back to the router, so it seemed better value to bag a Pro and a PoE switch than a £500 SE, but the lack of software release parity between the SE and pro may bite me later on.

I can't comment on Hikvision etc, I do know that they would be superior for night time especially. My G5 bullet is perfectly fine for what it covers, but what I love most is the ecosystem integration and from what I've seen, the UI for Blue Iris/Hikvision isn't as nice. I just personally feel that in the past year or so, UniFi OS, NA, and Protect have come on leaps and bounds. Still a long way off the likes of OPNsense for ultimate configuration and settings, but for the vast majority of enthusiasts it's perfectly fine.

 

[darkblade]

Is your Pi running a 32-bit OS? I had to change mine to the 64-bit version last year since the UniFi controller software stopped supporting 32-bit.

That was the start of my issue, I was running a 32-bit OS (as per the original recommended installation instructions). I've installed a 64-bit Bullseye OS, but have then found that Ubitique is insisting on running an old version of MongoDB, but there's no package for the ARM based Pi 3B. Having tried to resolve this, I then discoverd that it now appears that 2GB of ram is now the recommended minimum when using a 64bit OS - which makes the Pi 3B obsolete as far as running the latest UnFi controller software.
So I've ditched the Pi 3B and now have it installed on a Pi 4, which seems overkill, but there we go.

 

[darkblade]

I also suggest you look carefully at the general good CCTV brands such as Hikvision and Dahua before going down the Ubiquiti route and get locked into their kits and system.

If you buy general CCTV cameras you can run whatever software you like and even if you stick to the manufacturers NVR that's just the NVR. I used to install CCTV professionally and a couple of my neighbours boasted about their Unifi CCTV being better after I installed mine. That was until they saw my pictures, especially night time and realised how much better they are plus I have all the notifications, AI motion detection, ANPR and linkage into my home automation for security lights etc.

Out of interest, what cameras and software/NVR are you using?
I installed Hikvision with PVR 8 years ago.

 

[Avalon]

I can't comment on Hikvision etc, I do know that they would be superior for night time especially. My G5 bullet is perfectly fine for what it covers, but what I love most is the ecosystem integration and from what I've seen, the UI for Blue Iris/Hikvision isn't as nice. I just personally feel that in the past year or so, UniFi OS, NA, and Protect have come on leaps and bounds. Still a long way off the likes of OPNsense for ultimate configuration and settings, but for the vast majority of enthusiasts it's perfectly fine.

I’m considering it a renewal of my right to hate on Unifi credentials. I’d like to have a more positive opinion of Unifi, but they keep going above and beyond to ensure that’s not easy from a hardware design perspective and the software side always feels like it comes up short beyond the basic Unifi controller/AP combo.

I manage a few Hikvision installs at this stage and it scales reasonably well, the G2 Hikvision stuff is also superb in pitch black environments, the NVR fine tuning less so. I’ll start looking into cameras, expect to be tagged & called names as/when it all goes down in flames

 

[daz.rathbone]

Sorry, bit late to the conversation, but thought I'd throw my 2p in....

For background my house sounds similar to OP, massively thick walls mostly made of engineering brick (old 50s council build). Tried tons of solutions as getting wired throughout the house would be difficult.
A few years ago I ran a couple of XT8's, using wireless backhaul. When configured correctly these were excellent.
Then moved to Unifi. Tried UDM (awful), and various combinations of APs. Eventually we had an extension built and I build a full rack in the new office (part of extension); UDM-SE, couple of PoE 24 switches, UNVR with their cameras all round the house, managed to get wiring put in when the extension was built so put the little USW Lite's in a couple of rooms over PoE, and 2 APs. Tried combinations of U6-LRs, U6-Lites, and U6-Pros... one in attic and one in office (far lower corner of house). There was *always* dead spots that got poor to no wifi signal. On top of Unifi "updates" which cause problems all too often, I eventually decided to replace everything.

Ended up with OPNsense as my main fw/router, then a couple of TP-Link PoE switches (2.5GbE and 1Gb), and replaced the attic/office APs with EAP670s. *Massive* difference - no blackspots anywhere in the house, and speeds (SnR) significantly improved on all devices, including round the garden. Highly recommend them APs, so much better than any of the Unifi U6s I've had.

I also replaced all the Unifi protect cameras/system with some Reolink ones. They all get controlled/recorded by a mini-pc with a Google Coral device running Frigate (and recording 24/7 to a 16TB share on a NAS, over 2x2.5GbE links).

Had YouFibre a couple of months ago and they've given me an Asus ET12 - still in it's box but I meant to get it out and have a little lab play with it

TLDR; Found the Asus (using wireless backhaul) very good, and the TP-Link EAP670 fantastic - way better than all the Unifi APs.

Edit: Just to add my recommendation of the EAP670, they're so good that if I update (or switch off) the AP in the office, I still get a signal from the AP in the attic. That is about 25-30m away, two floors up, and going through at least 4 thick walls. It's a weak signal, but I stay connected. Tested the exact same with a U6-LR and lost signal way before I got into the office.

 

[WJA96]

Edit: Just to add my recommendation of the EAP670, they're so good that if I update (or switch off) the AP in the office, I still get a signal from the AP in the attic. That is about 25-30m away, two floors up, and going through at least 4 thick walls. It's a weak signal, but I stay connected. Tested the exact same with a U6-LR and lost signal way before I got into the office.

What did you set your minimum RSSI to be on the U6-LR?

By default UBNT prioritise quality of signal over signal strength and they sell access points so the attitude is “buy more access points, get better signal”. Fundamentally all these devices use the same 3 chipsets and antenna configurations and you can’t change physics so what it basically boils down to is the client determines the coverage.

And that is determined primarily by RSSI. If you slip the RSSI on the U6-LR it will allow your client to keep hold of the signal but then it won’t roam to a stronger signal as readily, it will hang on to bad signal longer. That’s the default behaviour of the EAP670.

I sell both Omada and UniFi and both are great access points. I can configure a U6-LR to seem like it’s got epic coverage eg. you still get signal in the garden but then you come back into the house and your signal isn’t as good as it could be because your client has latched onto the weaker signal and won’t release it because it’s not getting a soft kick from the access point.

For optimum user experience you don’t want to set the RSSI to such an extreme that the client never roams.

And the end result of those settings is that the coverage appears worse on a single access point.

 

[daz.rathbone]

What did you set your minimum RSSI to be on the U6-LR?

By default UBNT prioritise quality of signal over signal strength and they sell access points so the attitude is “buy more access points, get better signal”. Fundamentally all these devices use the same 3 chipsets and antenna configurations and you can’t change physics so what it basically boils down to is the client determines the coverage.

And that is determined primarily by RSSI. If you slip the RSSI on the U6-LR it will allow your client to keep hold of the signal but then it won’t roam to a stronger signal as readily, it will hang on to bad signal longer. That’s the default behaviour of the EAP670.

I sell both Omada and UniFi and both are great access points. I can configure a U6-LR to seem like it’s got epic coverage eg. you still get signal in the garden but then you come back into the house and your signal isn’t as good as it could be because your client has latched onto the weaker signal and won’t release it because it’s not getting a soft kick from the access point.

For optimum user experience you don’t want to set the RSSI to such an extreme that the client never roams.

And the end result of those settings is that the coverage appears worse on a single access point.

Whilst I fully understand the importance of RSSI along with other settings to get optimal coverage, throughput, and handover, this is a great post and a very important point for anyone sorting multiple APs to grasp - kudos.

I've mapped out signal strength quite a few times around our house - starting with a single AP (always in the attic) usually with RSSI set around -80dBm (anything lower has proved useless to most devices for me - even at -80 it's a close call). Then taking noise and throughput up/down measurements in each room on both 2.4/5GHz. What I constantly found was our main bathroom and entrance/hallway (directly 2 floors down from where the attic AP is mounted) was where signal would significantly dropout. To be fair comparing the U6LR and the EAP670 both were fairly even on the 2.4 band, but on the 5Ghz band you'd lose U6LR connection when either moving towards the front door (end of hallway) or closing the bathroom door. Same power on each band, and matching (most) other settings, the EAP670 still gave around -70dBm signal, and easily 300Mbps throughput on the 5GHz band. I actually went and bought the U6-Pro just to see if it was any better (it wasn't) - bare in mind at this point I was all-in on a Ubiquiti setup, even bought all the damn OCD plates so my rack looked pretty - I wanted it to work. I even started trying to make sense of the radiation pattern maps to see what I was missing

From the first moment I installed the 670 the whole signal map changes - tweaking RSSI, when using more than one AP, is just about getting the handoff right. I think our current setting is -72 and handover occurs just as I got from the hallway into the kitchen (towards the office). So the attic AP now gives coverage in the main bathroom - some things you want to drop on the loo, but wifi signal isn't one of them

Certainly for the 5GHz channel I tried every setting I could and could not get either the U6LR or U6Pro to give the same signal strength as the EAP670. Also throughput was a different thing entirely, as even in the same room on a matched SnR, the throughput speeds on the 670 were significantly higher.