BBC testing UHD.

GAC

GAC

GAC

Soldato
Joined
11 Dec 2004
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for those who havent seen it the bbc is testing UHD (4K) during the commonwealth games, they have test setup's at broadcasting house in london.

try as i might though i cant find any specs about what their classing as UHD, fired a few emails and tweets but the good ole bbc are still tight lipped.

if its anything like the HD im guessing its going to be gimped to hell and back, as i still havent been able to get a response when bbc iplayer will do 1080P. :rolleyes:
 
I thought they showed a couple of World Cup Football matches in similar circumstances. Nice to see it's happening shame it's so far away I can't see it.
 
that was sony as far as i know and they recorded and delayed showed them, but that was only the semi's and the final. not sure how much info sony put out about it though.
 
UHD is defined as 3840x2160 so quad 1080 HD. Currently the frame rates specified are 50p and 60p but tests at much higher rates have been carried out. For Europe it is likely that 50p will be selected for backwards compatibility with current 50hz broadcast infrastructure and in the Americas and Japan 60p for 59.94hz infrastructure.

The BBC will definitely be using the HEVC video codec also referred to as H.265 for their test at a bit rate of around 30Mbps. HEVC is about 50% more effecient than H.264 so they can get away with a lower bit rate for quality that would be comparable to a 45-50Mbps H.264 stream.

It is likely they are using satellite to get the feed back to broadcasting house.

The nice thing with UHD is that it'll use the same transport method as HD albeit it'll use more bandwidth but current infrastructure doesn't need to change much with the exception of updates for the encoders and new decoders that exist in 4k TVs or future set top boxes.
 
Resolution is one thing, bitrate is another!

I'm sure most providers Sky/BBC turn down the wick when it comes to bitrate to save on bandwidth.
 
SD has definitely dropped in bit rate and the +1 channels even more so, some are around 1Mbps. Sky are actually considering delivering 4k over the Internet utilising the fibre network their working on so they can guarantee a sustained bit rate to their boxes. They can then keep the satellite bandwidth for SD and HD.
 
HEADRAT said:
Resolution is one thing, bitrate is another!

I'm sure most providers Sky/BBC turn down the wick when it comes to bitrate to save on bandwidth.
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A lot of HD channels on Sky still don't broadcast everything with 5.1 audio, Syfy are especially bad for it. Makes me sad when I sit down to watch something and the Dolby Pro Logic II light on my AV receiver comes on.
 
you'd have thought with the way netflix has stomped over normal media that the bbc would up their game a bit though with iplayer. its still only 720P would be nice if it was 1080P now and then i could accept them demoing UHD/4k stuff but i have a feeling its going to be yet another farce when finally rolled out.
 
GAC said:
you'd have thought with the way netflix has stomped over normal media that the bbc would up their game a bit though with iplayer. its still only 720P would be nice if it was 1080P now and then i could accept them demoing UHD/4k stuff but i have a feeling its going to be yet another farce when finally rolled out.
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1080p is pointless though as we only make shows at 1080i
 
god i hope not, theres no excuse to be shooting in 1080i/720p only now especially when you can buy good 4K cameras for next to nothing from what they where 12 months ago.
 
GAC said:
god i hope not, theres no excuse to be shooting in 1080i/720p only now especially when you can buy good 4K cameras for next to nothing from what they where 12 months ago.
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Broadcast cameras are a whole different ball game though and the tech needed to edit 1080p with file size, bit rate etc is just another cost that the industry really can't take at the moment. Hell the upgrade from SD to HD (1080i) 4 years ago now was painfull enough, let alone a small upgrade to 1080p then quad1080 (4k)

We are only just moving over to file based delivery to broadcasters now, been using HDCAMSR (tape) all this time.
 
Yes, broadcast is 1080/50i but most programming is made at 1080/25p (although on a tape and broadcast file it'll be marked as 50i even though it is progressive) with the exception of some studio based shows and sport, which is sometimes captured at 720/50p.
 
GAC said:
you working in the industry then or just meaning in general ?
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Yeah I work in the industry. Even if stuff is shot in 1080p it only makes it out at 1080i (so p footage in an i frame which is known as PSF). So again, iplayer in 1080p is pointless as it's always i footage.
 
vila said:
I'm inclined to disagree quite a lot of stuff is shot 1080p now...
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Your right it is, but it's only shot like that for style not for res as as I have said above, it comes out for an interlaced format. All GFX we use are field based not frame based because the tech spec we are delivering to does not allow progressive footage to actually be broadcast 1080p (frame based GFX also look awful in GFX. Everything gets converted if its progressive. Hell we aren't even allowed to fluid film motion to make something look progressive if it's interlaced.
 
GAC said:
for those who havent seen it the bbc is testing UHD (4K) during the commonwealth games, they have test setup's at broadcasting house in london.
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I wrote to them about it a while back. They're not streaming it or broadcasting it so you have to physically go to BBC Glasgow or London.
 
25p in a 50i container is there so that a progressive signal can be transported as segmented frames (2 fields) to stay aligned to current 50hz infrastructure at broadcasters and facilities.

It is possible encode/transcode from 50i back to 25p for the likes of iPlayer, iTunes, Netflix etc with no loss of detail. In some file formats you simply change the tagging from interlaced to progressive.

I'm purely talking about true progressive content here.
 
Quartz said:
I wrote to them about it a while back. They're not streaming it or broadcasting it so you have to physically go to BBC Glasgow or London.
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yes i know that :P

i did get a email this evening saying they will "try" and find the specs on the test they are doing at the mo.
 
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