Belgium Grand Prix 2013, Spa-Francorchamps - Race 11/19

smr said:
I know it sounds silly but I've had a gut feeling that Jenson will go to Red Bull since Webber left the seat.
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I thought it was a interesting interview he gave today, ruling himself out of Red Bull (words to the effect of "they've already got someone for that seat" (which we're sure we already knew)) but suggesting he fancied a shot in Massa's Ferrari seat.

That said, he also sounded quite upbeat about next year's McLaren, so who knows. He's a clever and cheeky boy, so he's probably just hurrying McLaren up.

No mention of Lotus at all though. Losing James Ellison is a big blow for them and I think they'll gradually slip back. If they lose Kimi too it will be a disaster.

I think Button needs McLaren more than McLaren need Button. Their two drivers are too similar at the moment and they need a team leader—if Kimi is a possibility, they should pull out all the stops.
 
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this_is_gav said:
I thought it was a interesting interview he gave today, ruling himself out of Red Bull (words to the effect of "they've already got someone for that seat" (which we're sure we already knew)) but suggesting he fancied a shot in Massa's Ferrari seat.

That said, he also sounded quite upbeat about next year's McLaren, so who knows. He's a clever and cheeky boy, so he's probably just hurrying McLaren up.

No mention of Lotus at all though. Losing James Ellison is a big blow for them and I think they'll gradually slip back. If they lose Kimi too it will be a disaster.

I think Button needs McLaren more than McLaren need Button. Their two drivers are too similar at the moment and they need a team leader—if Kimi is a possibility, they should pull out all the stops.
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The thing is everyone has this perception of Jenson as being really relaxed and carefree or non aggressive (attributes we don't consider in line with leaders in life) yet all of the Formula 1 books I've read and own state otherwise. Up and down the Paddock everyone says the same thing that underneath that calm exterior he IS ultra competitive, Ross Brawn mentioned this in his foreword on Button's Book "My Championship year" for instance.

Also, think of the graceful Swan gliding across the lake....

Calm on the surface... but paddling like hell underneath.
 
smr said:
The thing is everyone has this perception of Jenson as being really relaxed and carefree or non aggressive (attributes we don't consider in line with leaders in life) yet all of the Formula 1 books I've read and own state otherwise. Up and down the Paddock everyone says the same thing that underneath that calm exterior he IS ultra competitive, Ross Brawn mentioned this in his foreword on Button's Book "My Championship year" for instance.
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Yes, but he's just not... very... fast. If McLaren want to challenge for titles next year (rather than Jenson feeling his way to the odd win), then they need at least one driver who's consistently capable of delivering the extra few tenths that Jenson lacks in outright pace.
 
Jono8 said:
Good job Hamilton is one of, if not the fastest driver(s) then .
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Hamilton's outright speed, isn't the problem.
His car's drivability is what the limiting factor is here.

I can't see how he can finish top 3 in the WDC this season. Its possible, but unlikely.

In any case, Hamilton fans at least have some hope to cling to, which is not a bad thing.

I just don't want Vettel to win, as this really is killing the sport, for non-Vettel fans. I'm worried that next season will be his 5th title win, at a such a young age.
 
this_is_gav said:
Yes, but he's just not... very... fast. If McLaren want to challenge for titles next year (rather than Jenson feeling his way to the odd win), then they need at least one driver who's consistently capable of delivering the extra few tenths that Jenson lacks in outright pace.
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He's no slouch either.
You have to remember a lot of world champions have not always been out right the quickest driver on the grid. You only need to look at Alain Prost to see that. :)
 
Alain Prost was far quicker than Button though. He won titles in the same car as drivers quicker, and arguably better than him (well, one driver quicker than him, but he was pretty good!).

Button went up against Barrichello. I love Rubens, as I like Button, but the only time I thought Rubens was really good was in that Jordan in 1994 and some of 1993 (and a bit of 1999), but it turns out that was a very tidy little car slightly flattering him. Had he had a stronger head, he might have taken the fight to Button more in 2009, as he had when they were battling towards the back.

That car was than half a second faster for much of 2009, which is roughly how much slower Button was than Hamilton in qualifying for much of their time as teammates. Give Button a car that good and he'll deliver time after time, but the best I can see from McLaren next year is getting back up there around the pack chasing Red Bull.

A better example to compare Button to would be Denny Hulme. Very tidy, very smooth, very reliable, but not up there with the likes of Clark or Rindt. Won a title, and deservedly so, but due to having superior machinery and being more reliable than Brabham.
 
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OldCoals said:
Vettel and Alonsos right rear popped.

Debris was the problem according to Pirelli.
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Hasn't every tire failure this year (besides the race when everyone's tires went pop) been put down to "debris"?

Utter ballbag.
 
Pirelli are so full of ****, Silverstone should sue them for defamation it's obvious to everyone their tyres can't handle the loads.

The failures on Vettel and Alonso's cars on Friday happened in the same area of the Spa track, between Turns 13 and 14 - the Fagnes and Stavelot corners.

These follow shortly after the 150mph Pouhon double left-hander, where the right-rear tyre is put under its highest lateral load for several seconds.
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Here's a crazy thought, the tyre manufacturer makes tyres which can withstand higher than the maximum load they are likely to put under for a longer period than they are likely to be under it.
 
Skeeter said:
It's a shame the Mercedes car is a bit of an unknown until race day.



What are you on? How does pulling off some great overtakes at Hungary help Hamilton win from pole? You can overtake at Spa, so sticking it on pole won't be enough if the chasing cars are faster in the race.
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Because if he got stuck behind Webber\Button like vimto did he would have lost the race...simples really
You can also overtake at Hungary as Lewis proved ;) but don't let facts get in the way.
 
LizardKing said:
He's no slouch either.
You have to remember a lot of world champions have not always been out right the quickest driver on the grid. You only need to look at Alain Prost to see that. :)
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Then a young gun who was faster named Senna turned up and prost left :D oh sorry then he blamed the car so Ferrari got rid of him ;)

Guerrilla said:
Here's a crazy thought, the tyre manufacturer makes tyres which can withstand higher than the maximum load they are likely to put under for a longer period than they are likely to be under it.
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You mean Bring Bridgestone back :) I like that idea
 
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"No, the drivers are not convinced and they will be very worried about it," reported Sky Sports F1's Ted Kravitz. "I think they will wait and see what happens in Practice Three [on Saturday morning] and if there is another failure, then we could be in trouble.

"The drivers have been talking about not wanting to race and risk their lives on a fast circuit like this. I think they really need to watch it because it could turn nasty this tyre situation if there are more failures."

If there's another puncture this morning the Qualifying and Race will be boycotted without a doubt in my mind :(

Pirelli won't be in F1 next year either.
 
smr said:
"No, the drivers are not convinced and they will be very worried about it," reported Sky Sports F1's Ted Kravitz. "I think they will wait and see what happens in Practice Three [on Saturday morning] and if there is another failure, then we could be in trouble.

"The drivers have been talking about not wanting to race and risk their lives on a fast circuit like this. I think they really need to watch it because it could turn nasty this tyre situation if there are more failures."

If there's another puncture this morning the Qualifying and Race will be boycotted without a doubt in my mind :(

Pirelli won't be in F1 next year either.
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10\1 red BS and Ferrari have either put less air in the tire hoping that they get heat into the tire or the camber is not what it should be.

Red bs is know for doing this. And as for Pirelli Whitmarsh said they will be here in 2014.

Time for the FIA to start checking the car for things like camber\tire pressure ect.
 
From Williams "Track temp 21. Air temp 20. Wind speed 6kph. Dry at this time but rain is coming!" :(
 
Tom Clarkson saying Vettel was testing a Monza-spec rear wing... and both Red Bull's were both way faster than everyone else. :\

Pirelli, teams and drivers all seem to a agree that a loose piece of metal (possible a skid block from Grojean's Lotus) in the kerb at turn 13 (the second part of the Fagnes chicane) has been the cause of the the tyre failures.
 
this_is_gav said:
Alain Prost was far quicker than Button though. He won titles in the same car as drivers quicker, and arguably better than him (well, one driver quicker than him, but he was pretty good!).

Button went up against Barrichello. I love Rubens, as I like Button, but the only time I thought Rubens was really good was in that Jordan in 1994 and some of 1993 (and a bit of 1999), but it turns out that was a very tidy little car slightly flattering him. Had he had a stronger head, he might have taken the fight to Button more in 2009, as he had when they were battling towards the back.

That car was than half a second faster for much of 2009, which is roughly how much slower Button was than Hamilton in qualifying for much of their time as teammates. Give Button a car that good and he'll deliver time after time, but the best I can see from McLaren next year is getting back up there around the pack chasing Red Bull.
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On Button, yes with a equally good car I can only see him finishing behind, he's not a fast nor great driver. No one really rated him till he won a championship but anyone with a car that much better would win. If you gave Kovo that car he'd have won the title. I've never rated titles, nor points its only an indication of the CAR you're in(and sometimes how good you are vs a team mate) but absolutely no indication AT ALL of how good that driver is against anyone else down the grid.

I just can't see Button being the guy to lead Mclaren to their next championship unless they have a Brawn type year, blow everyone away with a monsterous advantage from a rule change and new part on a car.

Thing is Mclaren should be looking for a top driver because in years they have a monsterous advantage, the better driver would still win the title, but there would be a better chance in years where the Mclaren isn't that good.
 
Someone's going in that turn 9 barrier before this session is done.

Di Resta looks half asleep today. Arriving at the La Source braking area diagonally, locking up and going over the grass... not ideal. It should be a strong weekend (weather permitting) for Force India too.

Ben Edwards said it was Kimi's Lotus which dumped it's skid block in the Fagnes chicane. I saw Grosjean go very wide there yesterday, so assumed it was his.
 
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