BennyC's Intermittent Fasting & HST Journal

[BennyC]

I've been considering I.F for a little while now and am in the position where I have a very routined day and feel like giving it a shot.

I'd appreciate if anyone with any knowledge or experience of I.F could correct or confirm my thoughts and plans.

As I currently work 07:15 to 16:15 from what I understand the most suitable method for me will be to eat 25% of my daily calories followed by a further 25% about 4 hours later, to then train and eat the remaining 50% of my calories after and to then not eat until the following day when I break the fast.

Luckily I can eat at my desk and take my lunch whenever I wish so a 12:30/1 o'clock feeding to break my fast is not a problem. I can eat again at 3:45/4 as I usually train at around 5PM so am leaving come the busy rush hour period in the gym starts. I can pop my PWO in when I finish at 6PM and then eat dinner asap after this with any other food required to make up my 50%. To clarify:

12:30/1PM - 2 x Pitta with either tuna, chicken mayo, turkey & 1 scoop whey, 1 scoop oats 700/800 calories

3:45/4 PM - Salad, Apple, Mixed nuts (cashews, walnuts, brazils, almonds & raisins) 1 scoop whey, 1 scoop oats. 700/800 calories

5PM - Train

6PM - 1 scoop oats, 1 scoop whey.
(Followed by 4 scrambled eggs, my evening meal which is usually 300 grams mixed veg with either chicken, beef, pork, mackerel, occasionally a pasta based dish and then finally my pre bed shake (Mp bedtime extreme 2 scoops) - total approx 1500 calories

(what I've done is take my small regular meals and divide them up into a 25/25/50 split) Fats look a little low there though don't forget there are 4 eggs and nuts in there towards the end. I can't cook eggs at work unfortunatley as I'd like to have these as my second meal as it's a little light imo.

I know that there is an 8 hour window in which to eat and I'm thinking shovelling 1500 calories, the best part of 3 small meals, in one go will be quite challenging and probaly uncomfortable. So is spreading this food out okay providing it's all been eaten within the 8 hour window? Betwen 6 and 8PM in this case.

I'm also aware of the calorie cycling so would drop my carbs slightly on my off days and up my fats.

Is there anything else I've missed or any other advice? (other than/as well as dietry )

Hopefully this will serve as a simple explanation for anybody thinking about trying it who currently works normal hours, providing my interpretation is accurate!

Thanks,

BennyC

Edit: Meal one on rest days will be around 40% of calorie intake followed by 30/30, when possible.

 

[BennyC]

this is madness

This is Sparta.

Care to elaborate for me.

 

[BennyC]

http://www.leangains.com/

Read up on here if you want to know what it's all about.

The 10 myths debunked article was what got me to decide to give it a shot.

My goals? As always to increase lean mass & strength with minimal fat gain/decrease in bodyfat. I'm sure there are some health benefits but these aren't my reason for choosing IF. Mentioned numerous times on the site is the obsessiveness of regular small meals and the anxiety of missing one and the 'stress' related to this mindset. I can relate and just really wanted to see if this approach is more suited to me.

This will be combined with my first cycle of HST so am hoping for some interesting results.

I'm interested to see what this will do to body compositioning and also my well being/general feelings.

I guess this will be sort of my journal which I will update with some exact details at the end of this weekend and also my thoughts & feelings on the initial phase as I will be 2/3 days in come then and in a better position to pass judgement on the initial effects.

For those that don't regulary read here I've been training for about 3 years now and would class myself as an 'intermediate lifter'. If you want to track my progress so far skim through the bodybuilders picture thread. I also had a thread following my keto cut back in Feb-March which saw me drop from 16% to 12% bodyfat. This hasn't been maintained though and am sitting back at around 15/16%. ('The Final Push' is the thread title for those interested).

I just broke my first 15 hour fast from 8PM last night to 11AM this morning. This will move 1/2 hours either way as I finish work and train early on Fridays.

Overall I didn't have any problems not eating till 11 despite a very slow day at work this far a few hunger pains but nothing mega. Though this is to be expected as my body is still expecting meals from my little and often diet.

 

[BennyC]

Update 3 days in

I'm not sure if I'm suprised or not but I've found this incredibly easy to adapt to. As in it's been no bother at all. Alright I slept right through till 10am both mornings this weekend due to 6" of snow and 2 rest days. ( before I workout my weights for my first HST cycle) I've not really done a great deal this weekend! Combined with a slow Friday at work it's probably one of the hardest times to adjust diet with nothing to do (other than play Black Ops and browse the web).

I break the fast just after noon, eat again at 3PM and then again at around 6:30/7PM starting the fast again at 7:30/8PM.

Eating large meals is getting easier and my appetite between feedings suprisingly is supressed. Interestingly, I think this will help to hinder any 'over feeding' as I try not to snack in between my feedings, so where as with the standard 5/6 small regular meals fufilment isn't always felt so the odd extra snack would often follow but being full at each feeding stops this.

I didn't have any problems training on Friday which was the first day of fasting and was a back & shoulders session including: deadlifts, OHP, Pull ups, Rows, Pulldown, Rear raises, lateral raises & curls.

I think it's a bit too early to make any judgements about composition but I do think I've dropped a little water probaly due to drinking lots during the fast. I'm hoping that HST being a full body workout will be a bit more aerobic/calorific in itself so should have an effect on composition too.

One thing worth mentioning is that getting out of bed has been suprisingly easy, not that I ever really struggle but similar to when I used Keto back in March I'd wake up and be wide awake. Thinking this will have something to do with the lack of blood sugar spikes as a result of the fast, I'm not complaining though! I still feel rested and strangely not as tired when going to bed though this might be due to not doing a lot.

It's also much nicer not having to constantly think about food all the time too. The extra 10 minutes in bed in the mornings is appreciated too

 

[BennyC]

Id be interested in doing this while cutting, dunno if I could fit the strict meal times around uni though (bringing x much food in etc).

There's 4 different protocols depending on when you're available to train, it's quite flexable and I can confirm that the alertness & lack of fatigue, for me, is one of the positives. The only negative being having to eat large portions which is a little tough but will become easier.

FASTED:

11.30-12 AM or 5-15 minutes pre-workout: 10 g BCAA
12-1 PM: Training
1 PM: Post-workout meal (largest meal of the day).
4 PM: Second meal.
9 PM: Last meal before the fast.

EARLY MORNING FASTED:
6 AM: 5-15 minutes pre-workout: 10 g BCAA.
6-7 AM: Training.
8 AM: 10 g BCAA.
10 AM: 10 g BCAA
12-1 PM: The "real" post-workout meal (largest meal of the day). Start of the 8 hour feeding-window.
8-9 PM: Last meal before the fast.

ONE PRE W/O

12-1 PM or around lunch/noon: Pre-workout meal. Approximately 20-25% of daily total calorie intake.
3-4 PM: Training should happen a few hours after the pre-workout meal.
4-5 PM: Post-workout meal (largest meal).
8-9 PM: Last meal before the fast.

TWO PRE W/O

12-1 PM or around lunch/noon: Meal one. Approximately 20-25% of daily total calorie intake.
4-5 PM: Pre-workout meal. Roughly equal to the first meal.
8-9 PM: Post-workout meal (largest meal).

There must be easier ways of doing this? I am lean and fit and I don't have to starve myself for periods

Do you focus on resistance training? eat over the RDA guidelines for a man? Doing this and trying to build mass whilst minising fat gain isn't easy otherwise we'd all be sat at 6% bodyfat and a solid 220lbs.

It's no different really to people that will lay in bed until 11/12 noon and then get up and have breakfast.

Suprisingly I think a lot of people do this without realising this. Skipping breakfast is a prime example.

I also wouldn't call it 'starving' I still get 3000 calories per day it's just an 'irregular' eating habit to most. If you're interested then deffinatley check out www.leangains.com and read up on the science behind it more than happy to discuss this providing you've read up on it properly

 

[BennyC]

One q, what if you train at different times different days? eg. I could train at 9.30 on a tuesday and 3 on a friday etc.

I *think* in this case you just have to adjust/blend the protocols to suit. SO you might not get a 16 hour fast in, or if it's possible to move your training.

It's difficult to comprehend it before you actually just dive in and do it.. and it's even harder to even think about it when you don't have a set routine to your week that's tailored for this kind of thing!

Deffinatley agree. There really is nothing to worry about though, I'd say I'm fully adjusted to my new meal times now and much happier in regards to my nutirion than I was before.

Let us know how your lifts suffer too, as well as keeping a picture log!

I worked out the weights for my 15's yesterday for my HST cycle. I think the two rest days really helped as I felt much more powerful, especially on squats & bench. I didn't notice any decrease in my endurance or strength. I don't think there's any logical reason why there should be either.

 

[BennyC]

My 10 & 15 RM have been calculated and look like this:

15's
Squat: 100KG
Press: 40KG
Seated Row: 80KG
SLDL: 85KG
Bench: 80KG
Pull up: BW - 25%
Lateral Raise : 9KG
Dips: BW + 10KG
BB Curl: 30KG
Standing Calf Raise: 60KG
DB Shrug: 35KG's
Lying EZ Skullcrusher: 27.5KG

10's
Squat: 120KG
Press: 50KG
Seated Row: 100KG
SLDL: 100KG
Bench: 95KG (PB for reps )
Pull up: BW + 5KG
Lateral Raise : 12.5KG
Dips: BW + 20KG
BB Curl: 35KG
Standing Calf Raise: 100KG
DB Shrug: 42.5KG's
Lying EZ Skullcrusher: 32.5KG

Some weights are a little more conservative than others. I only did the one working set to establish my RM but beared in mind that I will have 2 sets of each to perform, and also 2 sets of which ever exercises preceed that particular one too, so took into account fatigue.

I squat at home out in the passage way in the cold and then walk 2 minutes round to courner to finish up the rest at the gym. I usually warm up again briefly and do my usual RC exercises & mobilisation.

5's up next, most likely drop the isolations, or switch to something like a hammer curl and go heavier on dips. Might trade SLDL for regular deadlifts for 1 x 5 once one week and twice the next.

IF is going well, I'd say I've completely adapted to my new meal times and am glad I made the switch. All the initial benefits I experienced are still present. Due to the fast I tend to have that 'just got out of bed' leaness we all experience but still looking full at the same time. Water is deffinatley down as is fat a little too as light striations in my chest are now visible, vasularity is up a little bit too. I'll most likely throw in some light cardio over x-mas to keep me sane and shift any 'holiday weight'.

I'll post up my entire 6-8 week HST plan including the progressive load increases for C&C and to clarify for anybody unsure of how theirs should look.

 

[BennyC]

Yeah, it feels wierd to say that's my 15RM as when drop setting I've beasted out 26 but it's different once the CNS is tricked!

Not had any DOMS yet though only half the volume while I work out RM's, though my calves get really really bad DOMS, to the point it's not funny and actually very painful/tender to even touch. Hopefully I should be able to cope

 

[BennyC]

5's
Squat: 140KG
Press: 62.5KG
B.O.R: 100KG (medium grip)
Bench: 110KG - PB
Pull up: BW +15KG - PB
Laterals: None - considering some band work
Dips: BW +40KG - PB
DB Hammer Curl: 22.5KG
Standing Calf Raise: 130KG
BB Shrug: 130KG
EZ skull crusher: None.

Happy with that, 4 PB's in the last 2 sessions. Kick back for x-mas now and then crack on with the 15's.

My brother confirmed for me that I look leaner so IF is working. Half an inch off my waist so far but haven't jumped on the scales yet.

 

[BennyC]

Well today was very interesting indeed. First day of the 15's. I decided to train fasted and following advice from the LG website I had about 9-10grams of BCAA's 20 minutes prior to training. Did my squats at home and then headed round to the gym to finish off with the rest.

Whilst I found it very punishing with 60 seconds rest and absolutely hate lactate build up! I did enjoy the challenge and my heart rate was nicely elevated. With about 4/5 exercises left to go I began feeling very peculiar. By the time I got to 3 exercises left something wasn't right and I was more or less shaking quite badly. I called it quits as I didn't want to pass out under any weight.

Heading for the changing rooms I knew what was coming. A dry wretch and then into the disabled toilet (for the sink) to throw up my amino's twice and then a final tactical chunder needed a helping hand. I sat down to finish my puke sweats and proceeded to gobble down my PWO shake 2 scoops whey 2 scoops oats. I felt fine despite having just vommed. Got home, walked in, straight to the sink almost chundering over the lamb roast my mum's spent all morning preparing. I was also being sick out of my nose and over my hand and with the third heave my vomit was stone cold which was very odd.

A shower made me feel instantly better and a second attempt at the PWO has seen it stay confined to my stomach for several minutes

I think the recent change to IF, HST and then to train fasted was a little too much for my body. Though I think the large amount of BCAA's I dumped into it probably had a larger role to play.

 

[BennyC]

lol wow

I think the most important piece of advice for the 15s is to not do your first session with anything hanging around in your stomach, although that seems like an extreme reaction. I don't think I could ever train fasted, maybe that was the biggest factor?

Yeah, I deffinatley underesitamted the 15's. The first set is fine, but the second really is a test. I fell 2/3 reps short on my second of bench but you can't really do anything about lactate build up. Except rest pause but I didn't have a spotter. Not too fussed though as it's the progressive load that's more important than getting every rep.

I think it was just too much BCAA's, normally I let them disolve into the water but in this case they didn't, I usually use slightly warm water but opted for cold this time

The shakes I can contribute to the fasted training but the vomitting was deffinatley the amino's as I could still see them in the first few voms.

 

[BennyC]

Benny, that is the lols, almost beats my projectile vomiting in the showers at the gym

I'd popped once in the sink and then my mum started trying to wash some lamb and I was like 'MOOOOOOVE!!!!1!11one!!1' as I then sprayed out my nose and mouth all over my hand and shaker

 

[BennyC]

Not as bad as EAA's!

 

[BennyC]

Todays 15's went much better. No 'Chunky Yawns' today

Mixed about 7/8 grams of BCAA's with warm water 20 minutes before starting at 11AM. I increased my rest time to 90 seconds and it was much better suited but still taxing. Having worked my RM's out in the afternoon having eaten, trying to do the 15's fasted with only 60's rest was a bit ambitious.

I did feel a little sick 3/4's of the way through but figured I was over hydrating and soon felt better.

Fell short a few reps on pullups and dips but got all my bench out today. Not too worried though.

Decided to ditch the tricep iso at the end in place of some core work. Press, Bench and Dips is enough for my tri's I've decided.

 

[BennyC]

How you finding the IF?

Love it

It's great not having to worry about meal timings. I just eat between 12 and 8PM. I'll shift the window depending on when the fast is started the previous day. For example if I finish eating at 7 then I'll break the fast at 11 the next day, or just break it at the normal time and have an extra hour fasting. I think I'll be sticking with this for quite a while.

Energy levels are good, I don't think I've actually felt tired since starting IF. I had dropped about 1 or 2lbs without changing my diet but then christmas came along

I'd deffinatley recommend it.

 

[BennyC]

Bit of an update:

Into the second week of 15's now. Feeling more accustomed to it however it's still quite exhuasting. Having to focus a lot more on breathing during each set to actually make it through it!

Tuesday & Thursday I've done a 40-55 minute brisk walk @ 10degrees incline 5/5.2km which see's around 450-600 calories (actually less as the treadmills over-read).

I tipped just under 90KG this morning (89.7) after having been just shy of 93KG or there abouts when I started just before x-mas. Due to the calorific nature of the 15's I decided to take advantage and try and drop a little fat which seems to be working. I have some comparisons shots which I will post up at the end of the HST cycle.

Looking foward to finishing the 15's and beginning the 10's and to start getting some proper weight moving.

 

[BennyC]

Ta.

I wouldn't say it's the worst. The static bike ime burns the least calories. I could use the x-trainer and might well switch soon but for now I'm just taking it steady. Set it all up and then just walk. I don't have to worry about keeping pace/strides up. Just walk or fall off the back

Do like the x-trainer or rower when going for it though.

What's worse is that when people using the treadclimbers or treadmills on an incline, or ever a flat walk hold the ******* handles! It does my head in so much! removes all the effort, lowers your energy expendiature and thus lowers the amount of calories burned. Swing your damn arms!/rant.

 

[BennyC]

FFFFUUUUU this gets me good. Makes me rage with the fury of the devil himself. The ones that treat the stepper cardio machines as if they are holding a tricep dip at the top, along with the peak of a shrug (shoulders at the ears) and then just moving their legs as little distance as possible.

Don't get me started on people who row like retards!

On a happier note, hows it going Benny? Body composition changing much?

Yeah it's going good. I've upped my carbs slightly as I was on about 160grams a day 1 or 1 + 1/2 scoops of oats, 2 slices of bread and then veg in the evening. Now 2/3 scoops of oats.

Training fasted has been tough, I'm not going to lie I also think the ingestion of amino's in the morning leaves me feeling sick 20/30 minutes later as they don't taste very pleasant. Also the volume and number of exercises with such a taxing rep range adds to this but I've got the final 15's tomorrow. Hopefully with a bit more glycogen I'll make it through.

Failed a few reps short on bench yesterday and pull ups but as previously mentioned I'm not too worried especially as I was on quite low carbs.

Tuesday saw a incline walk for 55 minutes burning 600 cals approx, and today 35 mins on the x-trainer a slightly higher intensity burning 500 cals. So on my off days I up my fats with some extra olive oil in my eggs in the morning but generally tend to end up with total calorie intake around my MBR. So say on an off day I eat about 2400/2500 - 500/600 calories burned from CV = 1900/2000 and my MBR when I last worked it out was around 1900.

This isn't ideal for growth and I'll be stopping this when I begin the 10's. Generally I'm quite inactive during the day both at work or when I'm at home so don't really expend large amounts calories elsewhere than in the gym. Training days calorie intake tends to be around 2500-2700 calories at the moment with no CV work.

I read this:

http://www.leangains.com/2009/12/fasted-training-boosts-muscle-growth.html

And another article which basically explained greater fat burning properties to fasted training after a group being over fed by about 800 calories per day after six weeks had only gained 1.8KG of weight where as a group on the same diet but not training fasted gained much more. I'll see if I can find it.

Weight this morning was 89.2KG (pre morning poo), so almost 4KG difference since starting this log with little change to my diet except meal timings. Vascularity is up with the cephalic veins more visible, water & fat and down most noticably on my legs and over my abs. Not bad going considering new years! Ended up breaking my fast last night for a cheeky half pint at 9:30ish but nothing worth crying over, still got to live!

Think I'll deffinatley be sticking with IF for quite sometime.

I'm looking foward to how my body responds to the 10's and 5's seeing as these loads will actually be stimulating muscle growth.

Edit: Here it is:
http://www.leangains.com/2010/09/fasted-training-insulin-sensitivity.html

a lot of that goes over my head but the sub-heading 'Body composition' is the part I mentioned. Worth reading as much of it as you can though.

Edit 2: For the 10's I have my Jury Service so will not be training fasted, following this I return to work so my fasted training will only take place for the 15's. Training will move to around 5PM in the afternoon before my last and largest meal.

 

[BennyC]

You've failed! May as well quit now

Get out!

*Runs to chippy crying to buy pies*

Mod close thread as necessary

 

[BennyC]

I appreciate the input

As mentioned training fasted in the morning was temporary for the x-mas period. Due to jury duty and returning to work training will be in the afternoon/early evening and no longer fasted.

I agree it is very demanding and wouldn't dream of doing the 10's or 5's fasted as the 15's were tough enough but manageable. Don't worry, I listen to my body and adjust my diet/rest as necessary